Falling Off
Falling Off
On Breakfast time this morning, there was an article about the Countess of Wessex being a cyclist and while being interviewed by Louise ? (can't remember her name), they both admitted to having fallen off their bikes, almost as if it is part of cycling. They both came to cycling late in life. I know a couple who have taken up cycling in their 50's and they both fall off. Am I the exception in that I've not fallen off since I was learning to ride without stabilisers? Does the bike have a part to play in that people buy lightweight, twitchy, fast steering race bikes which they aren't able to handle?
Edit: I'm thinking purely of road riding.
Edit: I'm thinking purely of road riding.
Last edited by Graham O on 10 May 2016, 9:50am, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Falling Off
I think you may well be the exception rather than the rule. Certainly I've had innumerable falls, most of them fairly trivial, luckily. As I get older I'm also getting more careful, I hope - bones tend to get brittle with age!
But I've had the odd spectacular 'off' in my lifetime. As the complex dentistry work in my mouth, is testament to!
But I've had the odd spectacular 'off' in my lifetime. As the complex dentistry work in my mouth, is testament to!
Suppose that this room is a lift. The support breaks and down we go with ever-increasing velocity.
Let us pass the time by performing physical experiments...
--- Arthur Eddington (creator of the Eddington Number).
Let us pass the time by performing physical experiments...
--- Arthur Eddington (creator of the Eddington Number).
Re: Falling Off
I think it's a whole range of things. I expect that I shall come off again despite having been riding since I could walk and being an instructor, because I tend to ride on roads that many would avoid like the plague, I often ride very poor surfaces, I take out groups of novices and children who tend to veer without warning, and (when fit) I do lots of miles in the city in all weathers. I would expect most of my future issues will be 'forced dismounts' rather than proper crashes but I'd not rule out a crash. Ad then there is MTBing and off-road touring (i.e. MTBing on a road bike).
If I still lived out in the countryside or quiet suburbs I would think myself unlucky if I did come off again.
If I still lived out in the countryside or quiet suburbs I would think myself unlucky if I did come off again.
Re: Falling Off
I bet it is another U shaped curve.
Lots of offs when you are a learner, young and reckless.
Nice safe period when you are more experienced and cautious.
Then the ever increasing number of falls as you start to get very aged and unfirm.
Pepper that with the "cleat moment" and the statistical one-in-a-million-chance if you ride enough miles.
Audax do keep a record of incidents on their rides and comparing it to the enormous mileage involved it is very low, not many youngsters or learners on those rides.
Lots of offs when you are a learner, young and reckless.
Nice safe period when you are more experienced and cautious.
Then the ever increasing number of falls as you start to get very aged and unfirm.
Pepper that with the "cleat moment" and the statistical one-in-a-million-chance if you ride enough miles.
Audax do keep a record of incidents on their rides and comparing it to the enormous mileage involved it is very low, not many youngsters or learners on those rides.
Yma o Hyd
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Re: Falling Off
Graham O wrote:On Breakfast time this morning, there was an article about the Countess of Wessex being a cyclist and while being interviewed by Louise ? (can't remember her name), they both admitted to having fallen off their bikes, almost as if it is part of cycling. They both came to cycling late in life. I know a couple who have taken up cycling in their 50's and they both fall off. Am I the exception in that I've not fallen off since I was learning to ride without stabilisers? Does the bike have a part to play in that people buy lightweight, twitchy, fast steering race bikes which they aren't able to handle?
Its louise [inappropriate term removed] I believe who does that show .
I started riding a bike late in life, 32, I got a raleigh pioneer trail flat bar hybrid( still used on turbo, nice bike ). After 2yrs I then acquired a Dawes super galaxy. This is clearly lauded as a long wheelbase sedate handling tourer, it was my introduction to dropped bars and toeclips. My first 3-5 miles it just felt so twitchy that I was reluctant to slide my hand down to the bar end shifter to change gear. It felt quite a surprise, a difference that I hadn't expected. By the end of the ride I was more comfortable, less wary but soon ditched the ridiculous toeclips for SPD. The transition to racer wasn't as big a shock. So I think to jump straight onto a full on road bike without prior riding could be a wake up call, I'd not reccomend clipless and mixing with heavy traffic until used to the bike around a quiet car park or industrial estate at night.
Re: Falling Off
The only times I've ever fallen off since learning to ride on two wheels is when I've hit something or something has hit me.
Pothole was the worst a few years ago, and I was hit by a car reversing when the driver wasn't looking where he was going. Oh, and once or twice I've come off on a patch of ice.
........................ and I've never ever banged my head.
Pothole was the worst a few years ago, and I was hit by a car reversing when the driver wasn't looking where he was going. Oh, and once or twice I've come off on a patch of ice.
........................ and I've never ever banged my head.
Mick F. Cornwall
Re: Falling Off
I learned in my early 20s, and am now in my 50s. I commuted in London for about 7 years, and now cycle only for fun and errands. I had two lightweight tourers, and now the bike i have is best described as an audax. I have been knocked off by cars twice, both in London, and fell over twice when I was new to clipless. I also once fell in the water when crossing a greasy ford, and fell over onto railings on a 'cycle' crossing due to the angle of the railings being ridiculous.
Apart from that,I have never fallen off. I'm not sure why people fall off a lot, unless they are on very bad roads (this is increasingly the case I'm afraid), are mountain biking, or are racing, where it is, of course, understandable. I do take care on bad road surfaces, and I'm not very fast (ave speed about 15mph).
It is an interesting point Graham makes about people possibly buying bikes that are a bit twitchy in the steering for them. I think he may well be right. Marketing and fashion may mean that lot of newcomers/returners to cycling who have been inspired by racing may end up with bikes that are too 'racy' for what they are doing. I'm an oddball in that for me it works the other way; my second tourer (Dalesman) was a bit sloppy in that respect, and I didn't like that aspect of it, my current bike is the twitchist of all three and I like its handling the best.
But a fellow-female friend has a straight-bar hybrid and a drop-bar audax, and tells me she uses the hybrid all the time because she finds the audax's steering unnerving. (I've never had/tried straight bars, to me they always look very awkward, though I am told they are better for steering once you get the hang of them.)
Apart from that,I have never fallen off. I'm not sure why people fall off a lot, unless they are on very bad roads (this is increasingly the case I'm afraid), are mountain biking, or are racing, where it is, of course, understandable. I do take care on bad road surfaces, and I'm not very fast (ave speed about 15mph).
It is an interesting point Graham makes about people possibly buying bikes that are a bit twitchy in the steering for them. I think he may well be right. Marketing and fashion may mean that lot of newcomers/returners to cycling who have been inspired by racing may end up with bikes that are too 'racy' for what they are doing. I'm an oddball in that for me it works the other way; my second tourer (Dalesman) was a bit sloppy in that respect, and I didn't like that aspect of it, my current bike is the twitchist of all three and I like its handling the best.
But a fellow-female friend has a straight-bar hybrid and a drop-bar audax, and tells me she uses the hybrid all the time because she finds the audax's steering unnerving. (I've never had/tried straight bars, to me they always look very awkward, though I am told they are better for steering once you get the hang of them.)
Re: Falling Off
Not sure where this "twitchy" thing about road bikes comes from. I find they go where I point them, like any other bike.
Re: Falling Off
karlt wrote:Not sure where this "twitchy" thing about road bikes comes from. I find they go where I point them, like any other bike.
But not all bikes react as quickly or we'll. I think 'twitchy' is the wrong word, 'precise' might be better. If you are used to an Mtb/hybrid/Galaxy with slower, less precise steering the move to a 'road' bike could well be daunting. The problem is actually over steering, road bikes rarely need much steering but other styles do and that is usually what causes the off.
I try not to fall off - it hurts, but on those occasions when I have its had nothing to do with the bike as such. Outside influences - ice, parts failure, riding surface, other traffic being the cause premiere.
Convention? what's that then?
Airnimal Chameleon touring, Orbit Pro hack, Orbit Photon audax, Focus Mares AX tour, Peugeot Carbon sportive, Owen Blower vintage race - all running Tulio's finest!
Airnimal Chameleon touring, Orbit Pro hack, Orbit Photon audax, Focus Mares AX tour, Peugeot Carbon sportive, Owen Blower vintage race - all running Tulio's finest!
Re: Falling Off
foxyrider wrote:karlt wrote:Not sure where this "twitchy" thing about road bikes comes from. I find they go where I point them, like any other bike.
But not all bikes react as quickly or we'll. I think 'twitchy' is the wrong word, 'precise' might be better. If you are used to an Mtb/hybrid/Galaxy with slower, less precise steering the move to a 'road' bike could well be daunting. The problem is actually over steering, road bikes rarely need much steering but other styles do and that is usually what causes the off.
I'm not sure I notice any difference. I ride MTBs as well and they also just go where I point them, as soon as I point them. If they were slow to react they'd have to be sliding on the front tyre and I don't see that happen. I don't feel any under or oversteer on any of them.
Re: Falling Off
I'm not sure that "precise" is the right word. All bikes should go where the rider wants them to go, but it is the amount of user input which is needed. My slow steering Surly needs very little user input in the way of course corrections when it meets potholes, bumps, mud etc, but my faster steering cross bike needs many more small corrections. That is what I interpret as "twitchyness".
Re: Falling Off
I started riding aged about 10yrs - now 69! I am mystified. I do not understand all these cyclists "falling off". Only times I have come off, icy roads! I use only 'sit up and beg' bikes, and now very low frame due to arthritis. I have a "cheap" Halfords bike and a more expensive Batavus bike. Both have been off road - i.e. Rutland Water Lake ride (to me more like a mountainous ride with views of the lake) on my cheap bike and up and down we went and never fell off! I used to commute ride (missing potholes) and now mainly for shopping and touring holidays. I also have 2 panniers on bike permanently and still have had no problem with balance! Anyway just thought I would comment here.
Re: Falling Off
Graham O wrote:On Breakfast time this morning, there was an article about the Countess of Wessex being a cyclist and while being interviewed by Louise ? (can't remember her name), they both admitted to having fallen off their bikes, almost as if it is part of cycling. They both came to cycling late in life. I know a couple who have taken up cycling in their 50's and they both fall off. Am I the exception in that I've not fallen off since I was learning to ride without stabilisers? Does the bike have a part to play in that people buy lightweight, twitchy, fast steering race bikes which they aren't able to handle?
Edit: I'm thinking purely of road riding.
What does fallen off mean?
I don't recall falling off a moving bike, except maybe when I was trying to do 'jumps' as a kid. I've fallen over a couple of times when I tried to stop and had some problem with doing so (e.g. gravel or ice)
I rode into the back of parked car when I was maybe 11 years old, but I didn't fall off.
I understand the Countess of Wessex is learning to use cleats, so perhaps 'lightweight and twitchy' don't have much to do with it.
“In some ways, it is easier to be a dissident, for then one is without responsibility.”
― Nelson Mandela, Long Walk to Freedom
― Nelson Mandela, Long Walk to Freedom
Re: Falling Off
Yep, are you differentiating between falling off and being knocked off?
On road my 'falls' have been:
- took corner too fast at bottom of 1 in 7 slope and hit gravel while (unofficially) racing
- back end slid out on debris on roundabout
- back wheel pulled out of frame due to manky skewer
where as 'knocked off':
- car didn't stop at give way
- dived into ditch as car overtaking on blind bend locked up brakes and slid towards me
- hit diesel spill where lorry had previously crashed
forced dismounts:
- various!
On road my 'falls' have been:
- took corner too fast at bottom of 1 in 7 slope and hit gravel while (unofficially) racing
- back end slid out on debris on roundabout
- back wheel pulled out of frame due to manky skewer
where as 'knocked off':
- car didn't stop at give way
- dived into ditch as car overtaking on blind bend locked up brakes and slid towards me
- hit diesel spill where lorry had previously crashed
forced dismounts:
- various!
Re: Falling Off
I say 'twitchy' because that's what most people seem to say when they mean 'very responsive'. On a road bike, on actual roads, I don't really 'steer' round bends or turns, I just adjust my weight, and allow the bike to 'steer' itself, which I like. It's a bit like riding a really good, soft mouthed and balanced horse, you steer with your weight, not the reins. A riding school plod you may have to drag around turns with the reins as its mouth will be as hard as iron and it has had to adjust to novice riders who lean the wrong way all the time (as Terry Prachett used to say pillion riders 'since the dawn of time' do).
If you were used to a big heavy bike with less responsive geometry and you tried to 'steer' mine in the same way you were used to doing, you probably would fall off rather a lot.
If you were used to a big heavy bike with less responsive geometry and you tried to 'steer' mine in the same way you were used to doing, you probably would fall off rather a lot.