dog causes accident

Commuting, Day rides, Audax, Incidents, etc.
fretsaw
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dog causes accident

Postby fretsaw » 26 Jul 2014, 5:53pm

riding on the camel trail,a dog accmpanied by owners,and not under control,caused a little girl to somersault over the handlebars,causing her to land on both knees.i had previously tackled the owners of said dog,ten minutes before about the rules governing stray animals on the trail;their retort was, "what rule"a typical stupid answer i have confronted in the past;apart from the obvious dangers,which they had not been aware of.the accident had been caused by a group of inexperienced cyclists,with trailer,seeing the dog in front of them,noticing it was weaving from side to side,stopped abruptly,and the little girl following,was propelled into the rear of the trailer,and then to the ground;confronting the pair, and in spite of witnessing the whole scenario,a denial their dog was responsible;eventually the rational turned to violent threats from the dog owners.;later on the miscreat pointed to a little dog,doing the same,off the lead,saying,hes doing the same;he hadnt realised his own rhetoric!
another point,bodmin is to become a town geared for cyclists,with infrastructures built;the camel trail will become just another motorway.how sad!

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maff1977
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Re: dog causes accident

Postby maff1977 » 26 Jul 2014, 6:18pm

god. the camel trail is a nightmare at this time of year - far too much traffic on it for it to be safe. hope the girl is allright. stick to the cornish lanes, only traktors on them :lol:

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Vantage
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Re: dog causes accident

Postby Vantage » 26 Jul 2014, 7:23pm

If I'm reading this right, it looks like the initial braking cyclist was at fault, not the dog or owners.
I don't personally know the camel trail, but my own local SUP has plenty of four legged furballs on it and given their unpredictability, I gradually slow right down to around 5-6 mph and give as much room as I can while passing. The owners give a nod or say thanks and everyone goes about their business.
Only twice in 2 1/2 years have I had to slam the brakes on due to the dog escaping it's owners clutches and due to my low speed at both times, no injuries or incidents.
Bill


“Ride as much or as little, or as long or as short as you feel. But ride.” ~ Eddy Merckx
I am not a cyclist. I am a Dad!

fretsaw
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Re: dog causes accident

Postby fretsaw » 26 Jul 2014, 8:08pm

the dog was running free;the owners two hundred yards behind;the accident victim,was part of a group of five,bunched together;at the point of impact the trail is narrow,with a drop of ten feetr to the beach below;the dog spooked the trailer driver,who abruptly stopped;id say the dog was indirectly responsible,for the accident;no the dog wasnt on a bicycle! :?

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cycleruk
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Re: dog causes accident

Postby cycleruk » 26 Jul 2014, 8:28pm

If there is a law (bylaw), stating dogs must be on a lead, then why not contact the local council and ask them to do something about it. Either put up signs or have an officer patrol the area.
Good health & a following wind. :D

Pete Owens
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Re: dog causes accident

Postby Pete Owens » 26 Jul 2014, 9:38pm

If this was an incident on the road - where a cyclist had stopped for some reason (any reason) and an Audi had plowed into the back of them, then there would be no dispute whatsoever here that the Audi driver was at fault. They should be able to stop in the distance they can see to be clear.

We are talking about a shared use path - a place where pedestrians have priority and where walking dogs as a perfectly acceptable. A dog wandering erratically about a path does not constitute being out of control. "out of control" means jumping up at people nipping cyclists ankles and so on. It is up to cyclists to look where they are going and to be able to stop if necessary (whether that is for a group of pedestrians, a dog or even a cyclist stopping in front of you).

Ellieb
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Re: dog causes accident

Postby Ellieb » 26 Jul 2014, 10:17pm

^ ah right. The little girl was at fault.... Well let's hope she's learned her lesson!

I would have thought that 'in control' means that the owner is able to directly able to influence the dog's activities. How do they do that from 200 yards away?

Flinders
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Re: dog causes accident

Postby Flinders » 26 Jul 2014, 11:32pm

Pete Owens wrote:If this was an incident on the road - where a cyclist had stopped for some reason (any reason) and an Audi had plowed into the back of them, then there would be no dispute whatsoever here that the Audi driver was at fault. They should be able to stop in the distance they can see to be clear.

We are talking about a shared use path - a place where pedestrians have priority and where walking dogs as a perfectly acceptable. A dog wandering erratically about a path does not constitute being out of control. "out of control" means jumping up at people nipping cyclists ankles and so on. It is up to cyclists to look where they are going and to be able to stop if necessary (whether that is for a group of pedestrians, a dog or even a cyclist stopping in front of you).


If the conditions of using the path state that the dog should have been on a lead, the owner is 100% directly responsible as they were breaking the rules.
If the rules do not insist a dog is on a lead, the owner is still responsible because a dog 'wandering around' on a cycle path is clearly not 'under control' as all dogs ought to be by law in a public place. It should be walking at heel, and if the dog is too badly trained to do that, it should be on a lead. A cycle track is not a dog run.
Personally I don't think dogs should be allowed on cycle tracks, I used to think differently, but I have seen far to much dangerous behavior by inconsiderate dog owners.

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Vantage
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Re: dog causes accident

Postby Vantage » 26 Jul 2014, 11:54pm

According to this site, http://www.cornwall.gov.uk/environment- ... mel-trail/ it isn't specifically a cycle track, but a multi purpose trail.
This site http://www.thisisnorthcornwall.co.uk/camel_trail.htm states that leads should be used if necessary to control dogs, but isn't in itself mandatory.
As already stated, walkers have right of way so if yer bikes got brakes and it should, use'em :)
Bill


“Ride as much or as little, or as long or as short as you feel. But ride.” ~ Eddy Merckx
I am not a cyclist. I am a Dad!

fretsaw
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Re: dog causes accident

Postby fretsaw » 27 Jul 2014, 1:06am

the site you linked,states;"do not cycle with your dog,it is extremely dangerous" my point exactly.and made to the dogs owners;who merely stated their rights (to be on the trail with their dog).i witnessed exactly the circumstance of the incidence,and blame the accident solely with the dogs owners.

pete75
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Re: dog causes accident

Postby pete75 » 27 Jul 2014, 1:12am

If someone be it car driver, cyclist, pedestrian etc is following so close behind another road/path user that they can't stop if whatever they are following has to brake hard then the fault is theirs, not the person who stops nor whatever causes them to stop. .

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[XAP]Bob
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Re: dog causes accident

Postby [XAP]Bob » 27 Jul 2014, 9:01am

fretsaw wrote:the site you linked,states;"do not cycle with your dog,it is extremely dangerous" my point exactly.and made to the dogs owners;who merely stated their rights (to be on the trail with their dog).i witnessed exactly the circumstance of the incidence,and blame the accident solely with the dogs owners.

Not the dog then...

Glad we're not blaming a dog or a 5 y/old.

Dog owner primarily maybe, but unless the dog had been hidden in bushes until it jumped out (and the owner wasn't visibly carrying a lead_ then the lead cyclist needs to take responsibility as well.
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way.
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Si
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Re: dog causes accident

Postby Si » 27 Jul 2014, 9:34am

Should it not be all about using the paths communally and with thought to all others?

Dog owners shouldn't let their dogs wander in front of cyclists, likewise parents shouldn't let their children run out in front of cyclists, but cyclists should be aware that there will be dogs, children, wildlife, etc etc on the path that might act erratically (from their POV) and as such must be ready to deal with such situations - riding without proper observation, at too high a speed, or riding close to the person in front of you (thus your view is blocked and you have very little stopping space) is not riding in a manner that suits such a path.

If everyone starts thinking: "what might go wrong, how can I mitigate against it?" rather than: "it's up to everyone else to get out of my way so I'll just carry on regardless", such paths would be much happier places, wouldn't they?

fretsaw
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Re: dog causes accident

Postby fretsaw » 27 Jul 2014, 9:41am

oh if only the world was perfect;we live to learn :arent we losing track here.not everyone is cycle proficent on the trail;even professional cyclist crash in groups after all;a dog ahead when running wild, is a definite threat to anyone.my heading, dog causes accident is merely the title; and not in order to prosecute that argument.perhaps"lesson learnt" would have been more appropiate?

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Re: dog causes accident

Postby Vorpal » 27 Jul 2014, 10:10am

I wouldn't blame the child, however, but perhaps the parents could have prevented it? When cycling with young children, I usually ride behind them, so that I can anticipate problems, and give them instructions, or explanations, as appropriate. If Mr. V is along, he goes first, and I bring up the rear.
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