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by 53x13
21 Jul 2016, 10:22pm
Forum: The Tea Shop
Topic: Do you think Scotland should hold a second referendum
Replies: 48
Views: 2917

Re: Do you think Scotland should hold a second referendum

For me it's got to be the greatest philosophical mind and political economist ever to be born in these Isles, Adam Smith.

Adam Smith, a Scottish moral philosopher, pioneer of political economy, and a key figure in the Scottish Enlightenment. Like all great philosophical thinkers, his ideas have been purloined and twisted to fit market forces in ways that doubtless even he wouldn't recognize.

Born: June 16, 1723, Kirkcaldy
Died: July 17, 1790, Edinburgh

Influenced: Noam Chomsky, Milton Friedman, Carl Menger, Ludwig Wittgenstein, Karl Marx.


Quotes:


The propensity to truck, barter and exchange one thing for another is common to all men, and to be found in no other race of animals. Dogs do not exchange bones with other dogs.

Humanity is the virtue of a woman, generosity that of a man.

No complaint... is more common than that of a scarcity of money.

All for ourselves, and nothing for other people, seems, in every age of the world, to have been the vile maxim of the masters of mankind.
by 53x13
21 Jul 2016, 9:35pm
Forum: The Tea Shop
Topic: Do you think Scotland should hold a second referendum
Replies: 48
Views: 2917

Re: Do you think Scotland should hold a second referendum

Or maybe:

John Loudon McAdam (was a Scottish engineer and road-builder. He invented a new process, "macadamisation", for building roads with a smooth hard surface, using controlled materials of mixed particle size and predetermined structure, that would be more durable and less muddy than soil-based tracks. That surface was eventually called Tarmacadam, or Tarmac for short.

Eventually that Scottish idea too was usurped by the US cycle manufacturer Specialized, who liked the idea so much they named a bike after it.

Or perhaps :

Alexander Graham Bell (March 3, 1847 – August 2, 1922)[was a Scottish-born scientist, inventor, engineer and innovator who is credited with patenting the first practical telephone.

Or even:

Antibiotics transformed medicine. The discovery of antibiotics began by accident. On the morning of September 3rd, 1928, Professor Alexander Fleming, a Scot, was having a clear up of his cluttered laboratory. Fleming was sorting through a number of glass plates which had previously been coated with staphyloccus bacteria as part of research Fleming was doing. One of the plates had mould on it. The mould was in the shape of a ring and the area around the ring seemed to be free of the bacteria staphyloccus. The mould was penicillium notatum. Fleming had a life long interest in ways of killing off bacteria and he concluded that the bacteria on the plate around the ring had been killed off by some substance that had come from the mould. Thus heralded the discovery of antibiotics.
by 53x13
21 Jul 2016, 9:28pm
Forum: The Tea Shop
Topic: Do you think Scotland should hold a second referendum
Replies: 48
Views: 2917

Re: Do you think Scotland should hold a second referendum

merseymouth wrote:Hi 53, Didn't need the family history of JLB, I wasn't disputing the location of his birth! No, just the claim that he invented television. I think a read of the book called "Eureka", by Edward De Bono, that would set things straight.
A bit like the pneumatic tyre history, common falacy that won't go away. TTFN MM


He presented the first true television picture in the world on a mechanical device he made himself to the general public in 1926. It was a human face.

The face in question belonged to Daisy Elizabeth Gandy, the business partner of John Logie Baird, the Scottish scientist who is regarded as the inventor of the mechanical television.

What part of 'he did it first' don't you understand?
by 53x13
21 Jul 2016, 9:25pm
Forum: The Tea Shop
Topic: Do you think Scotland should hold a second referendum
Replies: 48
Views: 2917

Re: Do you think Scotland should hold a second referendum

Ah, you're thinking of Dunlop, that he was the bloke who first patented the pneumatic tyre...?

I'm afraid it was another Scotsman beat him to it:

Dunlop then put pneumatics on both rear wheels of the tricycle. That too rolled better, and Dunlop moved on to larger tyres for a bicycle "with even more startling results."[ He tested that in Cherryvale sports ground, South Belfast, and a patent was granted on 7 December 1888. Unknown to Dunlop another Scot, Robert William Thomson from Stonehaven, had patented a pneumatic tyre in 1847."
by 53x13
21 Jul 2016, 5:53pm
Forum: The Tea Shop
Topic: Do you think Scotland should hold a second referendum
Replies: 48
Views: 2917

Re: Do you think Scotland should hold a second referendum

merseymouth wrote:Hi there, Can someone please explain to me who the Scotsman was that invented television?
If one is referring to John Logie Baird then I say Poppycock!
His concept of television was nothing remotely like what the first working system was.
His "Electrically Heated Socks" worked though :lol: :lol: :lol: TTFN MM



John Logie Baird (1888 - 1946) ... John Logie Baird was born on 14 August 1888 in Helensburgh on the west coast of Scotland, the son of a clergyman. On 26 January 1926 he gave the world's first demonstration of true television before 50 scientists in an attic room in central London.

Fixed that for you.

What is the greatest ever English invention?

Sandwiches...
by 53x13
21 Jul 2016, 8:18am
Forum: The Tea Shop
Topic: Highest Temperature for a Leisure Ride
Replies: 10
Views: 670

Re: Highest Temperature for a Leisure Ride

I cycled on Rhodes a few years back when they were having a particularly hot summer. We were in the north of the island where it was 51C, cycling to the south it peaked at 55C but we had a lovely strong sea breeze to cool us. Even so, if you stopped for 30 seconds it was oven like and the only option was to get moving again.

I slept outside on the balcony of or apartment on the warmest nights as it was the only way to get any sort of kip 8)
by 53x13
21 Jul 2016, 7:58am
Forum: The Tea Shop
Topic: Songs for Brexit
Replies: 10
Views: 764

Songs for Brexit

Now that all the hoohah is over and we face the high wall of mind-numbing complexity, that may or may not take us out of Europe (nothing is certain in this fluid period we dumbs ourselves) what's your favourite song for Brexit?

Here's one, the Remain supporter Theresa May is probably considering every morning she wakes up, sweating probably (It's the Clash in case you were wondering!):

https://youtu.be/cLQJVKP3YlM
by 53x13
21 Jul 2016, 7:51am
Forum: The Tea Shop
Topic: 14 month streak of Record Breaking temperatures
Replies: 20
Views: 1017

Re: 14 month streak of Record Breaking temperatures

It's true that CO2 has had fluctuations and variations over the eons, and well recorded in ice sampling, but it's rate of change that's completely unprecedented. Basically we're seeing a similar rate of change that would have take c. 5000 years to occur, in less than 100 years.

That's not something easily dismissed as a 'climatic anomoly'.
by 53x13
21 Jul 2016, 7:02am
Forum: The Tea Shop
Topic: Do you think Scotland should hold a second referendum
Replies: 48
Views: 2917

Re: Do you think Scotland should hold a second referendum

+1 The English do seem to have an inordinate amount of racial insults to hurl at the Scottish, (much like the Eskimos have for snow) but my wife is currently racking her brains to think of similar Scots /English. Perhaps the Scots are more circumspect about who they insult?

Mind you, the Scots have their own language, Theatre, dictionary, law system, newspaper style, parliament and cinema. Some of that difference is explained here:

http://www.scotsman.com/heritage/more-h ... -1-4059257
by 53x13
21 Jul 2016, 5:51am
Forum: The Tea Shop
Topic: Do you think Scotland should hold a second referendum
Replies: 48
Views: 2917

Re: Do you think Scotland should hold a second referendum

al_yrpal wrote:Except it will be long term economic grief.. "Corbyn calls it austerity, we call it living within your means!"


<moderated>


Al


That's the second time you've used your 'Sporran' joke. I think once was more than enough. My wife's Scottish and she's had it up to 'here' with Jock, Porridge head (and it's derivative) and the rest of the anti Scottish sentiment that floats about as 'jolly wheeze'. It's an insult, well used at the last referendum 'what will the jocks use for bawbees in their sporran now? '. Racial stereotyping, which in these times we live in, no once tolerates. The Scots aren't living in caves with wode and tartan ear muffs.

They invented television, the bicycle you ride, the pneumatic tyre that keeps your teeth in, and the very roads, TarMacAdam you cycle on. There's a lot to be thankful for. Respect is something that those south of the border seem to have forgotten about.

Wonder Woman? That's straight out the Daily Maul.

It's not 'funny'. Highland dress is a purely ceremonial attire. It's worn maybe once a year, by the few Scots who posses it. They use a sporran for everything else except money.

So 'contents of one's sporran is completely spurious and not that far away from any other race insult, I don't expect to see it in these forums again. And the English wonder why they are not well liked by the Scots...

Oh, and 70% of the poll think they SHOULD have a referendum. I assume your 'friends in the North' are English ex pats? If not then why not call them by their proper name : Scots?
by 53x13
20 Jul 2016, 10:14pm
Forum: The Tea Shop
Topic: Do you think Scotland should hold a second referendum
Replies: 48
Views: 2917

Re: Do you think Scotland should hold a second referendum

irc wrote:
53x13 wrote:What stone the rUK can use to bash them with next time round (and there WILL be a next time) is beyond my ken.

Fool them once...


It's an SNP MP saying Scottish public assets would be required to finance a currency and that the deficit would need tax rises or spending cuts. It isn't bashing it's stating facts.


It's scare mongering, which just won't work the second time around. Like the Brexiters, they'll vote with their hearts this time. A little short term economic grief is no price to pay for total autonomy, back in the EU and well rid of a plus en plus right wing Westminster grasping hand politics.
by 53x13
20 Jul 2016, 5:13pm
Forum: The Tea Shop
Topic: Islamically motivated terrorism and freedom of movement
Replies: 164
Views: 6634

Re: Islamically motivated terrorism and freedom of movement

Freddie wrote:
53x13 wrote:In what way have these two (non terrorist attacks, no one terror group admitted nor was ascribed responsibility) made anyone change the way they act? They are simply the result of persons with extreme mental illness lashing out at unfortunate and tragic victims.
Tanveer Ahmed attacked and killed the minority Ahmadi Muslim man, Asad Shah, because he found this Facebook videos to be disrespectful and blasphemous towards Islam. He travelled 200 miles to kill the man. This is obviously going to have a knock on effect, which I suggest was intended by the attacker, in that more moderate or progressive Muslims, especially Ahmadi, will be afraid to express views on Islam that may be considered by other less liberal Muslims as disrespectful or blasphemous.

It seems that the feeling that Ahmadi Muslims are a) not true Muslims and/or b) disrespect the faith through their unorthodox beliefs, could hold true with a number of Muslim groups in Glasgow, as they failed to attend an event against extremism organised by an Ahmadi group, when Sikhs, Christians and others did attend:

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/201 ... ch-glasgow

I'd also like to point you in the direction of the article below:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Definitions_of_terrorism

By the definitions in the link, both the Jo Cox attack and the attack on Asad Shah could be considered terrorism, as they both fulfil the criteria in one way or another. Both attacks were intended to have an effect on society at large and were done in the hopes of changing behaviour.

It is true that terrorism is hard to define, but I don't think it necessarily requires being part of a specific group. Anders Breivik was convicted of terrorism; even though he was a lone wolf, his violence was obviously in pursuit of a political and ideological aim.

There is another interesting article here, if you care to read it:

http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=92340&page=1

53x13 wrote:Tragic they are: unforeseeable and completely unpreventable. I've had experience of mental illness in my own immediate family. People with such illnesses have no control over their actions. They are seriously ill, and have to be treated as such.
So everybody with mental illness has no control over their actions? I'm sorry, but that is patently untrue. Those who have no control over their actions are typically sectioned or cared for away from the community at large. Most people with mental illness are considered responsible for their actions, until proven otherwise.

Mental illness may be a factor, but given that large numbers of people in the UK take anti-depressants (and therefore are considered to be mentally ill), by your logic none of them should be considered responsible if they brutally murder somebody.

People kill each other all the time; though it is not something most people do, it does not automatically relinquish people that do it of responsibility for their actions, even if they are known to have some degree of mental illness.

Maybe that is not the point you were trying to make, but it is the point your words convey.



And what does ANY of this (confusedly erroneous statements) have to do with immigration post Brexit?

Please don't obfuscate what is a very serious discussion with non sequiturs. Stay on topic, nearly all of the UK terror attacks in the past 20 years have been perpretated by home grown British citizens.
by 53x13
20 Jul 2016, 4:19pm
Forum: The Tea Shop
Topic: Do you think Scotland should hold a second referendum
Replies: 48
Views: 2917

Re: Do you think Scotland should hold a second referendum

irc wrote:It works both ways. Last time the SNP made some fantasy economic projections based on the high price of oil amongst other things. Two years on and Scotland had a deficit of 14.9Bn in 2015, per capita twice that of the UK.

Meanwhile in The Herald today George Kerovan, part of an SNP group looking at currency options for an independent Scotland says it would require selling off Scotland's public assets to bankroll it. He also said spending cuts or tax rises would be needed. A bit harder to sell than the utopia promised last time.

As for anecdotes I know yes voters from last time who would switch to no as they think a Brexit UK would be better than a Scotland in the EU.



As with Brexit, economic arguments, and what colour the currency is going to be are no longer 'clever' enough arguments to scare the plucky Scots.

What stone the rUK can use to bash them with next time round (and there WILL be a next time) is beyond my ken.

Fool them once...
by 53x13
20 Jul 2016, 4:16pm
Forum: The Tea Shop
Topic: Brexit consequences
Replies: 326
Views: 12760

Re: Brexit consequences

Vorpal wrote:I'm really looking forward to the UK taking control of it's unitary systems again and reverting to fahrenheit and shillings.


Oh for a return to the days of cubits and perches.

As Jack Taylor was once quoted saying 'I don't like progress'!
by 53x13
20 Jul 2016, 4:01pm
Forum: The Tea Shop
Topic: Islamically motivated terrorism and freedom of movement
Replies: 164
Views: 6634

Re: Islamically motivated terrorism and freedom of movement

mjr wrote:
Freddie wrote:
mjr wrote:Going back to Nice - TV showed a copy of the attacker's residence permit, so doesn't that mean he was a non-EU national who passed whatever checks to live in France? As France and the UK currently have broadly harmonised visa processes, is there any reason to suspect he wouldn't have been about as likely to gain UK residency? Trying to hang this on freedom of movement seems absurd.
What I asked for was input on whether people think increased attacks will affect freedom of movement to the UK post Brexit?

Yes, you asked for that while suggesting that "stopping freedom of movement to the UK from Europe may be one answer to limiting [Nice-style attacks]", so I'm replying to highlight that freedom of movement seems to have been completely irrelevant to that attack and stopping it probably wouldn't make any difference to such attacks.

Have many recent terrorist attacks in the UK have been by non-UK EU citizens or non-EU citizens using freedom of movement somehow? I think the last one was about 15 years ago.


Precisely. Almost ALL of the terror attacks on the UK in the past 20.years have been perpretated by home grown British citizens.

What immigration has to do with that unshakeable fact is something only Freddie can answer. And how has brexit changed ANYTHING vis a vis home grown terrorism?