Cycling UK Forum

Jdsk wrote: ↑16 Aug 2023, 10:42am What's the regulation and the actual wording that this would breach?

Thanks

Jonathan

https://www.gov.uk/electric-bike-rules

A "twist and go" (throttle that doe not require pedal input) is allowed (subject to the power and speed limitations) as an EAPC (Electrically Assisted Pedal Cycle) but it has to be type approved by the manufacturer. I don't know if Chris has checked this for the bike or whether any manufacturers bother with this but it seems like the regs are framed to permit a solution to the hill start problem.

Carlton green wrote: ↑16 Aug 2023, 7:28am .........all I can think of is some form of hub gear but I haven’t done the maths to see what (overall) reduction might result, and hub gears can be pricey.

Yes it's hard for Vantage to find a solution that doesn't involve changing lots of stuff. I don't know of a hub gear that's guaranteed to take the torque from a powerful 1:1 input. Even going the non legal route means changing the motor unit.

In the past I've made 13-34 9 speed cassette by getting a 14 tooth sprocket and rejigging the 2 loose (11,13) sprockets to be 13,14. I seem to remember the 13 sprocket already had an integral spacer and notches - I could be wrong, in those days it was easy to buy individual sprockets from Roseversand. If you can still get a 13-26 9 speed cassette you could steal the first 2 sprockets from that, not cheap though. If you can find a 12 tooth first sprocket replacing the 11 is worth doing.

Vantage wrote: ↑15 Aug 2023, 11:50pm No the chainwheel limitation is due to the motors overall physical size. A smaller chainwheel wouldn't be dished and so the teeth would sit further out thus bending the living daylights out of the chain......

I was guessing that was the problem. It's what puts me off mid motor conversions, a hub motor conversion allows you to have whatever gearing you need.

Back to the original question, I think 250w is enough within the scope of what you'd normally expect from a bicycle. Whatever you set the legal limit to for an ebike I can come up with an outlier use case where it's not enough and the simple solution is to use an appropriate legal motor vehicle. I'd like to drive my car without having to have a driving licence and needing to tax, insure and MOT it (as long as everyone else has to of course).

harriedgary wrote: ↑3 Aug 2023, 4:29pm .......Sorry sir, but accept

Well, I choose what I accept or not and you'll need to accept that. I found the volume of similar responses unfriendly. OK, the humour of a schoolboy error is going to be pointed out but the 1+ page of other posters going out of their way to cover the same point was reminiscent of playground ganging up. It's normally better than that here.

I'm a bit disappointed in all these posts. I'll admit I had a wry smile when I saw the typo in the title and the missing information but there's an ocean of unkindness is the responses that's chilling.

maximus meridius wrote: ↑30 Jul 2023, 11:15am For information I drive a 17 year old tiny hatchback............

I know a cheapskate when I see one!

One amongst many others that will affect brake performance is the height of the pads in the slot. It effectively changes the length of the lower brake arm and the leverage in the caliper. Any brake with the pads at the top of the slot is going to have more MA than one with the pads at the bottom (and more cable pull needed). So a CP that has the pads at the bottom may be less effective than a DP with them at the top. Notwithstanding this generally a CP with the right length straddle wire is going to have more MA than a DP 'cos both pivots are closer to the rim.

AlanW wrote: ↑28 Jul 2023, 9:33pm ....Remove one link addressed the chain slack problem...

If the chain is too slack by only one link in the small/small combo I wouldn't regard it as a real problem.

What Gregory says, plus the old Sora chainset will be 130/74mm Bolt Circle Diameter so changing the chainrings is easy *Spa Cycles have plenty). Fitting a 28 tooth inner is cheap. Fitting 48, 38 and 26 rings will preserve the original spacings so is almost bound to work. I'd also be tempted to try a 24 tooth inner if I did this. As long as the front mech clears the chainstay.

Fitting an extender on the rear will make the change less precise. 11 to 30 or 32 (12 to 32 are available too) are an option if you drop the chainring size. The current rear mech may well handle a 30 tooth sprocket anyway. You've plenty of choices.

Chainline: in the past (not sure how long ago) Miche Team double chainsets ran on a 102mm ISO taper ST BB, just like Campag. They changed to JIS subsequently and run on a 107mm BB. I can't remember what the chainline on my ISO one was and can't find any Miche info on what the current chainline is. The OP may do well to measure what it is and adjust the BB length accordingly (103mm and upwards are around). IME Shimano FD's are finicky about chainline even when working properly.

Mick, aren't choughs a feature of where you live?

jdthebrit wrote: ↑17 Jun 2023, 7:29pm ......I can't tour in the UK with bike set up and dog. Which is a matter of regret.......

You can. You just need to register it, put a number plate on it, have a license and insure it. What's the problem? This is a rhetorical question cos I'm off to Glastonbury now and need to leave the arena for you to sort out your angst yourself. Or alternatively get a UK legal pedelec or a motor vehicle and avoid all this conflict.

Best wishes to you, the Labrador, the trailer and all the useful electrons on all your excursions.

jdthebrit wrote: ↑17 Jun 2023, 10:09am .....I am very happy pulling my dog and camping gear up the steepest Carpathian mountains....

If you're happy why do any laws need changing? Everywhere people are constrained by archaic laws about which side of the road they drive or ride on, having everyone decide for themselves would be crazy. Matt has given a very good summation of the rationale behind the UK legislation. Your rationale seems to be (insofar as we can tell because you haven't proposed any specific changes) that the UK legislation should cater for your edge use case in non-UK jurisdictions.

Let's be blunt. Nobody cares. It's really simple. If a pedal cycle or a a legal ebike don't fit your needs get a legal motor vehicle. Most other people do. What do you think is special about you?