Cycling UK Forum

I generally recycle them onto my lesser steeds until they end up on the gaspipe clunker(s) where modern refinements like index gear changes are largely of academic interest.

Jezrant wrote:

Brucey wrote:

Jezrant wrote:
The "weird" geometry of Randonneur can be overcome by changing the stem. There is also another somewhat unconventional detail about the frame. The trail is relatively short. Some will love the responsiveness; others may find it "twitchy".

change the stem? -sure, but there are limits... and with that geometry there are going to be plenty of people who can't get a stem short enough on small frames and folk who can't get a stem long enough on the tall frames.

Stem length also greatly influences steering feel which is another reason for not forcing folk to use extreme stem lengths, especially if you have already pushed the steering geometry into a corner, as it were.

cheers

Yes,there are limits of course, but I am sure most people can make a Randonneur fit better by experimenting with stems without compromising the steering. There was an assumption about stem length in the past that was partly based on aesthetics. There are many bikes today with much shorter stems than what used to be the norm that steer fine. I'd also like to add that even when you think there is a noticeable change in the steering after swapping stems, you get used to it after a while, but I take your point that this can be pushed too far. I'd like to further add a real world example from personal experience. I normally need a 9cm or 10cm quill stem on a traditional road frame that doesn't have a sloping top tube. On a Randonneur, I found a 7cm stem did the trick. Granted a 7cm quill stem was never the most common size, but they can still be found today (I think Nitto make them down to 5cm!). If there was any change to the steering, I never noticed it.
cheers

Inline seatpost?

markjohnobrien wrote:

jimlews wrote:Brucy,
Could you elaborate on the "weird geometry" of (some?) Raleigh frames.
I should declare an interest; I own a 531st Randonneur that is a delight to ride loaded or unloaded. But put a bar bag on it and an oscillation propagates through the frame making it impossible to ride.

It sounds like your bar bag as you mention in a later post that's it's not very rigid and flexes. What's the make?

I have used an Ortlieb bar bag with Rixen and Kaul for years on a Reynolds 708 Randonneur and never a problem although, of course, it's a different tubing. It's the earlier non oversized top tube.

PM, sent
I am heartened to learn that you're 708 Randonneur is ok with a bar bag; I am lusting after one at present.
I am intrigued by 708 tubing. It has eight flats or thicker portions running along the inside length of the tube. Stiffer?
Jim Lewis

Hi Brucey.

Thanks for the reply. Comprehensive as usual.

I only used the bar bag on that bike once; that was quite enough. I suspect the Rixel & caul click fix system is the source of the problem. This is riveted to the rear face of the bag which is stiffened with correx corrugated plastic. This correx is not rigid enough and flexes, setting up the standing oscillation that is the cause of the problem. I fitted same bag to a Thorn XTC (in my opinion a somewhat overbuilt machine) - same problem but less evident due to damping from the oversize frame tubing.

I also have an old '81 Galexy. The visible lugwork is not as lovely as the Raleigh and the frame geometry is very weird - slack seat tube angle and steeper head tube angle with a long TT. Toe clip clearance is marginal. I have to set the saddle at the front of its adjustment and use a short handlebar stem. Having done that it is pretty comfortable.

Brucy,
Could you elaborate on the "weird geometry" of (some?) Raleigh frames.
I should declare an interest; I own a 531st Randonneur that is a delight to ride loaded or unloaded. But put a bar bag on it and an oscillation propagates through the frame making it impossible to ride.

Nice job!

And how does it ride?

Use the TV - about all its good for!

The underbar push-push type gear levers completely knacker my thumbs wrists etc.
My remedy was to bin them altogether and use bar end shifters mounted into the end of cut down or 'stubby' bullhorns. Up changes become very easy, the l/h lever being pulled up by four fingers. Up-changes on the rear (r/h changer)can be effected with only the index finger.
Someone posted a picture of such a set-up on this site a few years ago.

Thanks again Brucey!

Thank you Gaz.

That looks like what I am looking for.

And thanks also to you Brucey, you answered my question comprehensively based on the limited info I provided.

Brucey wrote:- depending on the brakes you wish to use,

I wish to use Weinmann Centre pull calipers but dispense with the pivot carrier-the yoke that bolts through the fork crown and replace this with brazed on bosses.

I am inspired by Tony Oliver's excellent 'Touring Bikes' book where he says 'it is not commonly known that braze-on pivots exist for these brakes'.He shows a picture of braze-on centre pull Mafac brakes and later of Dia Compe. The pivots of course, are right up at the fork crown.

My question is prompted by the onset of pain in my hands when applying the brakes (drop HBs) especially going down steep hills. Oliver says that the set- up is 'ideal for cyclists with weak hands'...'because they have a high mechanical advantage'. He cites as disadvantages the need for 'precise inter pivot spacing.... and the flats that align the tension springs must be positioned even more precisely' (presumably than with cantilever bosses). Also cited as a disadvantage is the need to run absolutely true rims due to having to position the brake blocks close to the rim to achieve best results.

The above suggests to me that special bosses are required but, a frame builder I spoke to said (in effect)that they are all the same for canti's, V brakes and centre pulls.

For a traditional touring cycle (old Dawes Galexy et al), are these identical to cantilever/V-brake bosses and if not, are they still available?

Abergavenny to Llanfoist
B4269 to Gilwern ( some local traffic).
Join the Monmouthshire Brecon Canal in Gilwern
follow canal to just outside Brecon (locks at B4558) turn right under A40
to Groesffordd. But turn right again onto unclassified road (Sustrans R8) before entering the village
Follow R8 to Talgarth.
Nothing taxing or strenuous on this route, just wonderful scenery and several ok pubs.
Enjoy!

Edit.
Talgarth to Bronllys , cross A470 onto unclassified lane, rejoin A470 and follow through Llyswen.
Turn right across the Wye (last pub) then turn left into Boughrood. Follow lane (Sustrans R8) to its junction with A481.
Follow A481 into Builth.

Strada Florida to Dolgoch is certainly do-able, I've done it on an old road bike (Viscount with 27"wheels) very enjoyable.I rode through the streams except one where, midstream I was brought to a dead stop by a submerged rock so I had to get my feet wet. Great fun!

iow wrote:thanks - sounds good, but you're braver than me - taking a hammer and water to a new saddle.

Hi "iow".
I'm not advocating bashing seven shades of "doo-doo" out of the saddle; TAP was the word I used. I'm merely simulating what the human derriere does to the saddle anyway, but with less discomfort to the rider and over a much shorter period of time.

any chance of posting a photo of the top your quickly broken-in wharfe saddle?
thanks[/quote]

Hi iow,
thanks for your interest.

Now the embarrassing bit.
Being an old dinosaur from an antediluvian-pre digital age I am unable to get my head around anything complicated on the computer. I do have a digital camera (cheap Aldi) but can't get it to talk to the computer. If I can rope in a twelve year old to do it, we're in with a shout.

But actually, the exercise would be pretty pointless. My 'Warfe' looks just like any other new Warfe . No dents, no sag; nothing like that.

The point is that the leather under my sit bones is more supple than the rest of the top. I want the rest of the top to be less supple than the area under my sit bones. I don't want the rest of the top to sag and chafe the tender inter-pubic area and I don't want the sides to splay and rub the equally tender top inner part of my leg (I forget what it's called).

Hope this helps.

PS. Nice Lab!