Cycling UK Forum

I've hired a Trek PF5 a couple of times, and really enjoyed it off-road. The second or third time I tried it (this was over a few years' time), I deliberately took it up a long steep road in the Yorkshire Dales to see how it behaved. Like off-road, it was unflappable. But it's a beast. So I too have been hoping to find a much lighter e-bike mainly for tarmac and am also waiting til the spring. I'm pretty sure the Editor's gearing is wrong for that motor (it has a 44T chainring and 11-39 cassette). Seems a 38T chainring could be fitted, but not sure what then needs to be rejigged on the motor's software and whether you need Mr Bosch's approval to keep the warranty valid. I'm still keen to hear about peep's actual experiences of the SX, so if you're reading this and have tried it, don't be shy.

FWIW, I very briefly tested a new Cube with this motor. They're now using it in a much-lightened CF version of the Kathmandu 'trekking' e-bike and a much less pricey 17kg alu 'e-Urban' type bike called Editor. Neither of those has suspension; they both use a CF fork. I have the impression the motor was originally intended for 'light' FS eMTBs, which use peak assistance in very short bursts. I'd seen stuff online about the 100rpm cadence business. I'm not sure how accurate that is, or whether it only applies to eMTBs, but Bosch motors, unlike say Shimano motors, do deliver peak power at high cadences. Shimano motors work in the opposite manner in my experience with power dropping off at high cadences. Bosch themselves say something like 70-90 rpms if I'm not mistaken. The thing I discovered quite quickly is it feels very different to the 85Nm CX. There's noticeably less power at normal cadences, and the gearing on the bike has to be low enough to keep the cadence high enough when riding uphill. If you've ever tried a bike with the Mahle X35 hub motor, the SX's assistance while riding on hilly roads doesn't feel markedly different, which was disappointing. It's possible Cube haven't quite got it set up right on the Editor. Unless there was a software fault or something wrong with the power settings, the gearing of that bike was also way too high (lowest gear is 33"!) to take full advantage of this motor on a road e-bike. BTW, that bike had 700x 50mm tyres as standard.

rareposter wrote: ↑28 Aug 2024, 3:11pm

Jezrant wrote: ↑28 Aug 2024, 10:06am Honestly, why bother with tubeless? Genuine question.

Your search engine of choice will turn up reams of articles and forum threads debating the pros and cons.

Pros: they more or less eliminate punctures, especially if you ride on gravel roads or lanes plagued by hedge trimmings. Can run lower tyre pressures therefore more grip and comfort.

Cons: if you change tyres regularly, they're a major faff. For many people the initial hassle of setup outweighs the (often relatively minor) risk of a puncture. Can't use it in very high pressure/very narrow tyres so if you've got an old road bike with 23c clearance only, you're out of luck.

For "entry level", I'd say it's not worth it. For performance MTB and gravel, they've pretty much become de rigeur. You'll probably find your spot on a line between those two extremes.

FWIW, my MTB and gravel = tubeless.
Road - I've got and used tubes and tubeless but I have no real preference either way.

You, and the poster before you, are missing the whole point of my query. I know the pros and cons, and I'm pretty sure Colin does too. However, he's asking about the availability of a 36h 27.5" tubeless-ready rim (in the UK), and he's only found one so far. If he widened the search to include conventional hooked rims, there are then a couple more possibilities such as the Ryde Andra 321. Rather different rim to the Halo he's spotted at SJS, but there's a 36h 650B version available. It's also a brand I'm sure he knows well from his former wheel-building days at Spa, and this version appears to be in stock at the shop at a good price. Maybe too heavy for what he's after? Anyway, why not let Colin speak for himself?

Honestly, why bother with tubeless? Genuine question.
PS: Are Ryde Andra 321 any good?

Anyone tried an e-bike with the newish Bosch SX motor? Be interested to hear about any real experiences (rather than educated guesswork, speculation or regurgitating stuff read online).

rareposter wrote: ↑25 Aug 2024, 5:28pm

Jezrant wrote: ↑25 Aug 2024, 5:09pm I suppose you need to decide what info you want to see on a screen on your bars while riding and what info you want to look at later on some app.

Yep, very much this.

If the OP wants to create and navigate a route, view the climbing etc then a laptop and access to an online route planning tool like Strava, RideWithGPS, Cycle.Travel etc which can send the route to a Garmin or Wahoo is way better than anything a phone can manage.

If the OP wants a central point to gather info like HR, cadence, speed, distance and so on, then again a dedicated cycle computer is the answer cos it saves running lots of different apps and the battery life is way better.

On the other hand if you're simply going to ride around and not care too much about any of the above, a phone will generally do the job of just showing you where you are on a Google Maps display.

That's a nice and clear summary, but are you sure about the battery draining so much faster in the second scenario if using a phone with screen off? I thought that was only the case if the screen was left on. If the phone screen is off while the sensors are doing their HR and cadence thing, isn't the battery life much longer? That's been my experience. I only switch the screen on when needed.

rareposter wrote: ↑25 Aug 2024, 4:12pm

Jezrant wrote: ↑25 Aug 2024, 3:06pm Do you know an app that does cadence accurately without a sensor on the crank?

Shimano's old Flight Deck computer used to do that.

It was wired into each shifter (in the pre-Di2 days) and the computer was programmed with the gear ratios on the bike so it could display what gear you were in and so on.

But, because it also knew your speed via the normal magnet on the wheel method, it could calculate a "virtual cadence".

I've never investigated whether a modern Garmin paired to Di2 could do that, I suspect it's far more useful in terms of training info to just have a wireless cadence sensor but - in theory anyway - a bit of basic maths should be able to calculate and display a virtual cadence based on speed and the gear you're in.

That's what I was trying to get at. It sounded for a sec upthread as if there were now apps without any sensor that somehow magically calculated cadence.

I'm sort of with Gazza on this except on Strava. I don't see why you'd need a Garmin, or a pricey Wahoo unit for that matter, if you were mainly interested in HR, cadence, speed and distance, as I thought the OP said in answer to Jonathan's cut-to-the-chase question. You just need a cheap HR strap and cheap cadence sensor, and you're good to go with your phone. Add whatever free cycling apps you want for other stuff if you don't have something that gives you speed and distance. But, and there's always a but, I get the Strava thing and that's why I asked the OP if they were also using Strava or interested in it.

I suppose you need to decide what info you want to see on a screen on your bars while riding and what info you want to look at later on some app. I'd like to get to a Zen state of not needing any sort of info on any screen on my bars whatsoever. I can always have a peek at phone whenever needed. And then having all the data afterwards to analyse.

Hi Jonathan, this is sort of turning into an episode of Sliced Bread. I have a Wahoo cadence sensor that syncs with my iPhone. I have the impression it's fairly accurate. Do you know an app that does cadence accurately without a sensor on the crank?

More to the point, if you were mainly interested in HR, cadence, speed and distance (putting aside GPS, maps, Strava etc), why would you need to spend £££ on a Garmin when a couple of cheap Wahoo sensors connected with your phone and free apps did what you wanted? I've yet to run out of battery starting from a nearly full charge and carry a little battery pack on a long day or tour.

Sorry, I meant what are you using to record HR? A chest strap? A wrist fitness tracker? Or wot?

Re cadence, I'd be interested in hearing about an app that does that accurately. Anyone know one for sure?

How does the Garmin do HR?

Do you know a good accurate app that tracks cadence and records it?

How will you monitor and record heart rate and cadence?

ForwardGhoul wrote: ↑25 Aug 2024, 8:08am To answer Jonathan I'm only really interested in Heart, Cadence, AVG Speed and more importantly miles cycled however if this unit gives me all that plus GPS then what's the harm.

I'm only really interested in the same data, although less so for GPS. I use cheap Wahoo sensors for heart & cadence that sync with Apple Health on the iPhone in the pocket on my jacket/jersey. They seem fairly accurate. For distance & speed, I use cycling apps on my iPhone, but I also have cheap old Cateye computers on the bars of a couple of bikes that are small and discreet but easy to read and very easy to use while cycling. They also have a few other functions that can be useful. For maps and GPS, I use my iPhone when needed and whichever app depending on the type of riding (Komoot, Cycle.travel or OS Maps, but I think only Komoot syncs with Apple Health for keeping track of rides). Years ago I used to have a Garmin but I now find an iPhone better for my needs. Are you using or interested in using Strava?

Think that article post-dates discs on push bikes. Could have also mentioned Geoff Apps.

Years ago you occasionally used to run into those Rough Stuff fellows bouncing around on the bridleways in the Yorkshire Dales on their steel touring bikes with maybe 32mm tyres at best with mudguards and saddlebags flapping on the back if they weren’t pushing them. For wherever the track was steep or rocky or muddy, they were off their bikes walking. Eventually they must have wised up and got MTBs with suitable tyres and disc brakes or just got too old to carry on with these endeavours as you rarely see this sight anymore. So much more enjoyable on a bike designed for off-road.