Help Choosing A Helmet

General cycling advice ( NOT technical ! )
Mike Sales
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Re: Help Choosing A Helmet

Postby Mike Sales » 13 Aug 2019, 6:05pm

Sweep wrote:
Mike Sales wrote:Why is this thread not in the isolation ward?
The pros and cons of helmets have been mentioned.

Don't understand.
It's someone asking for advice on buying one.


But the pros and cons have crept in, as they tend to.

Mike Sales
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Re: Help Choosing A Helmet

Postby Mike Sales » 13 Aug 2019, 6:18pm

100%JR wrote:There is evidence from both sides of the coin...it all depends on what you choose to believe :wink:


There is evidence of sorts from both sides, of a sort.
Myself, looking at the debate, find no difficulty in judging which studies are more convincing.
Luckily two professionals in the fields of public risk and harm, Goldacre and Spiegelhalter, have assessed the evidence. They could find no evidence that helmets make any difference.
I would have thought that if helmets did any good, we could tell.

scottg
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Re: Help Choosing A Helmet

Postby scottg » 13 Aug 2019, 7:50pm

Independent testing results. Good ones from $75 to $275

https://www.helmet.beam.vt.edu/bicycle- ... tings.html

Off topic.

There is a famous study that show jumping from airplanes with or with out
a parachute has no effect on survival rates.
Study had been duplicated, with consistent results.

The essential parameter is altitude, all testing must be done whilst
the plane is on the ground.
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Re: Help Choosing A Helmet

Postby Mike Sales » 13 Aug 2019, 7:59pm

scottg wrote:Independent testing results. Good ones from $75 to $275

https://www.helmet.beam.vt.edu/bicycle- ... tings.html

Off topic.

There is a famous study that show jumping from airplanes with or with out
a parachute has no effect on survival rates.
Study had been duplicated, with consistent results.

The essential parameter is altitude, all testing must be done whilst
the plane is on the ground.


I suspect this is a criticism of the evidence that helmets have no measurable effect on survival rates.
In fact, in real world situations, out on the road, worn by cyclists, they have no effect on head injury and death rates.
Spiegelhalter and Goldacre are experts in the fields of epidemiology and of risk, and I think they might have noticed which studies are absurd and which are rigorous.

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mjr
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Re: Help Choosing A Helmet

Postby mjr » 13 Aug 2019, 8:02pm

100%JR wrote:
mjr wrote:Ah the good old self-advertising helmet. No evidence it improves outcomes in general, but they sure do smash up impressively.

Ah the good old "everyone who wears a helmet is being conned by the manufacturers/fallen for marketing" moderated.Typical non-wearers moderated.
Your post would have been much more helpful had you not bothered with the first line :roll:

And your post would have been much better if you had bothered to read what I actually wrote and not invent your own reinterpretations and misattribute them to me.

As far as I can recall, I have never said "everyone who wears a helmet is being conned by the manufacturers/fallen for marketing". I'm unlikely to do so, having worn a helmet in the past until I was injured by one. Marketing is much less the problem (because there are rules about marketing so they do not lie as wildly as some helmet enthusiasts?) than the evidence-ignoring well-meaning sadists.

There is evidence from both sides of the coin...it all depends on what you choose to believe :wink:

Sure. That's true for many things, like if you choose not to believe any evidence after 1940, then smoking tobacco is still a good idea.

RE Mips I personally don't get on with it,or at least the ones I've tried.Fit is the most important feature for me.I've had £100+ helmets and I've had sub £25 helmets.I'm currently wearing a £60 Kask [...]

Some years ago, I complained and an advert for the Kask Mojito was ordered withdrawn because it contained obvious lies, so I wouldn't trust them.
MJR, mostly pedalling 3-speed roadsters. KL+West Norfolk BUG incl social easy rides http://www.klwnbug.co.uk
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mjr
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Re: Help Choosing A Helmet

Postby mjr » 13 Aug 2019, 8:05pm

Mike Sales wrote:
scottg wrote:Independent testing results. Good ones from $75 to $275

https://www.helmet.beam.vt.edu/bicycle- ... tings.html

Off topic.

There is a famous study that show jumping from airplanes with or with out
a parachute has no effect on survival rates.
Study had been duplicated, with consistent results.

The essential parameter is altitude, all testing must be done whilst
the plane is on the ground.


I suspect this is a criticism of the evidence that helmets have no measurable effect on survival rates.
In fact, in real world situations, out on the road, worn by cyclists, they have no effect on head injury and death rates.
Spiegelhalter and Goldacre are experts in the fields of epidemiology and of risk, and I think they might have noticed which studies are absurd and which are rigorous.

Ironically, the cycle helmet testing problem seems the opposite of the parachute test one described: for cycle helmets to seem as if they have a protective effect, the essential parameter is for all testing to be done with a simple top-down vertical drop. As soon as you look at real-world crashes, things get complicated and any protective effect seems to vanish... or if you're really unlucky, as in at least one example I half-remember, wearing a helmet also seems to prevent limb fractures!
MJR, mostly pedalling 3-speed roadsters. KL+West Norfolk BUG incl social easy rides http://www.klwnbug.co.uk
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Sweep
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Re: Help Choosing A Helmet

Postby Sweep » 13 Aug 2019, 8:17pm

All the best with your new helmet witterings.
As mike says, thread has been hijacked.
Please report back on views on what you get.
Sweep

slowster
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Re: Help Choosing A Helmet

Postby slowster » 13 Aug 2019, 8:32pm

Getting the thread back on topic...

I think that buying helmets can be a bit like buying shoes, in that some people find particular brands (or more specifically their lasts) suit them and others don't fit, and similarly some people have Specialized shaped heads and others a Giro shaped head. So it's probably best to try before you buy, or if buying online then order several helmets from Wiggle and use their free returns to send back the ones that don't fit/suit you.

One thing I don't like about helmets generally is the wind noise they create which means that I don't hear a car approaching from me behind as soon as when not wearing one. Arguably that happens in winter anyway if you wear a hat which covers your ears, but I suspect that wind noise is less with some helmets, e.g. the Kask Protone has a much bigger gap between the bottom of the helmet and the ears than many other helmets.

Something else you might want to check when trying a helmet is whether the plastic parts of the adjustable cradle will clash with your spectacles or sunglasses, especially if you wear Oakley sunglasses which have long straight temples.

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TrevA
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Re: Help Choosing A Helmet

Postby TrevA » 13 Aug 2019, 10:11pm

I would go to a shop that has a decent selection of different brands of helmet - Halfords Bike Hut, Decathlon (if there’s one near you), Evans or Cycle Republic. Try them on and see which ones are comfortable on the your head and fit well ( don’t move around). I find Specialized and Bell helmets fit me, but Giro and Kask ones don’t. Then it’s down to your budget, which is most comfortable and fits best. I wear a mid-range Specialized Echelon, which was around £55.

You can get things called Cats Ears (small bits of fur like material which fit on the straps), which are meant to cut down wind noise, though I’ve not used them myself. I wear a Buff under my helmet to soak up the sweat in summer and to keep my head warm in winter. If it’s really cold you can get skull caps that fit under helmets which keep your head warm.

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Re: Help Choosing A Helmet

Postby backnotes » 17 Aug 2019, 4:32pm

Turns out Halfords are giving away RIdge Cierzo helmets (meets EN1078) for free at the moment, if you spend £30 or more on cycle accessories. I just went in to pick up some "collect in store" tyres, and was offered a free helmet. It looks like any other helmet, and even has a light on the back. I went for an L and this adjusts 58-62cm. I wasn't looking for a helmet, but handy to have a spare for visitors who prefer to wear one etc. Receipt says the RRP was £27.

IMG_2090.JPG
IMG_2092.JPG


It looks like every other "value" helmet, and I am sure you would go much faster if you paid £280 for one "as used by Team xxx" that has more holes and less polystyrene. Anyway, even if you think helmets are worthless, you are still getting exactly what you pay for this way :D

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Sweep
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Re: Help Choosing A Helmet

Postby Sweep » 17 Aug 2019, 7:35pm

That's an excellent offer. Thanks for posting.
Sweep

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gaz
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Re: Help Choosing A Helmet

Postby gaz » 17 Aug 2019, 8:15pm

Mike Sales wrote:Spiegelhalter and Goldacre are experts in the fields of epidemiology and of risk, and I think they might have noticed which studies are absurd and which are rigorous.

I'll grant you that the test parameters for the parachute experiment may be absurd but it was rigorous enough to be published by the BMJ :wink: .
Parachute use to prevent death and major trauma when jumping from aircraft: randomized controlled trial.
Therefore, although we can confidently recommend that individuals jumping from small stationary aircraft on the ground do not require parachutes, individual judgment should be exercised when applying these findings at higher altitudes.
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Re: Help Choosing A Helmet

Postby LollyKat » 17 Aug 2019, 11:18pm

:lol:

rmurphy195
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Re: Help Choosing A Helmet

Postby rmurphy195 » 19 Aug 2019, 8:17pm

Tha halfords offer looks a good one, as long as the helmet fits. The lamp on the back could be a useful visibility aid if you come off the bike, especially at night.

I have a a peak attached to mine, very useful when the sun is at certain angles I can just tip my head down a little and keep the sirect sunlight out of my eyes. Helps keep some of the rain of my glasses as well!

Mike Sales wrote:Why is this thread not in the isolation ward?
The pros and cons of helmets have been mentioned.


More to the point - why have the debaters even got onto this thread, given the OP's opening words.

"I came off the other week and absolutely smashed my head into the ground and my helmet and my head was the only bit of me that impacted and came out totally unhurt .... I think was a £15 Tesco's jobbie the Mrs picked up for me from when I was more of just a leisure cyclist and she was trying to persuade me to wear a helmet at all .... thank goodness I listened in the end!!"

The OP knows what he's doing (based on personal experience), and what he wants, he's just asking for advice on how to get it.
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Re: Help Choosing A Helmet

Postby mjr » 19 Aug 2019, 9:11pm

The opening post taunts the helmet rationalists, that's why, plus the rationalists tend to know much more about the standards than the believers.
MJR, mostly pedalling 3-speed roadsters. KL+West Norfolk BUG incl social easy rides http://www.klwnbug.co.uk
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