Ridgeback Panorama Deluxe

General cycling advice ( NOT technical ! )
2008sean

Ridgeback Panorama Deluxe

Postby 2008sean » 2 Dec 2015, 5:17pm

just found this on offer has anyone any experience of this bike is it a good buy it looks ok for £999.99?

looking to start touring next year and this seems to have everything i need and price seems good?

http://www.swinnertoncycles.co.uk/bikes-c97/touring-c114/ridgeback-panorama-deluxe-touring-bike-p49928

phil parker
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Re: Ridgeback Panorama Deluxe

Postby phil parker » 2 Dec 2015, 5:55pm

Although I'm not familiar with the actual bike, it looks like a good specification, good value and should make a great touring bike!

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tykeboy2003
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Re: Ridgeback Panorama Deluxe

Postby tykeboy2003 » 2 Dec 2015, 6:26pm

Nice bike but not over £400 better than the Edinburgh Bicycle Co-op Revolution Country Explorer.

the snail
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Re: Ridgeback Panorama Deluxe

Postby the snail » 2 Dec 2015, 8:00pm

I reckon that's a cracking deal -I've had the lower spec Voyage for a few years and I can't really fault it as a tourer/all-rounder

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cycleruk
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Re: Ridgeback Panorama Deluxe

Postby cycleruk » 2 Dec 2015, 8:05pm

tykeboy2003 wrote:Nice bike but not over £400 better than the Edinburgh Bicycle Co-op Revolution Country Explorer.


You can't really compare the two bikes as they are different. Frame material for a start and the running gear is higher spec' on the Ridgeback.
As for the Ridgeback, good bikes, but if you want real full luggage touring then I don't think the forks have fittings for front racks?
Do you want "disc brakes" as these can have drawbacks especially if overheating on long loaded downhills (warping?).
Recent review of another Ridgeback, by Breton Bikes, will give you some idea of the quality. But again not the same bike :-
http://www.bretonbikes.com/homepage/cyc ... 016-review
Linked to this CTC forum post:-
viewtopic.php?f=16&t=102043
There's no such thing as a tailwind.
It's either a headwind, or you're going well.

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cycleruk
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Re: Ridgeback Panorama Deluxe

Postby cycleruk » 2 Dec 2015, 8:16pm

I would add that the Ridgeback wheels are only 32 hole rims whereas 36 hole would be stronger.
Have you looked at the offerings from SPA :-
http://www.spacycles.co.uk/products.php?plid=m1b0s21p0

Need to check the specifications if comparing.
There's no such thing as a tailwind.
It's either a headwind, or you're going well.

Brucey
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Re: Ridgeback Panorama Deluxe

Postby Brucey » 2 Dec 2015, 11:29pm

if you want that kind of bike then it isn't bad value.

BTW It does have fork bosses I think; you can check this on the ridgeback site.

If I am critical;
I think the rear rack is a bit flimsy if you are going to carry any real load, I think the wheels are not strong enough similarly. I'm not sure whether disc brakes are the right thing for a touring bike; there are pros and cons; for me a significant con being that the unladen ride quality usually suffers because the fork is more likely to be overbuilt.

If you are going to have disc brakes whilst the spyres can work well there are simpler more reliable brakes that work almost as well.

You might find it is perfect for you but then again you might be better off getting something else as a first touring bike; swings and roundabouts....

cheers
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~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Brucey~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Rich_Clements
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Re: Ridgeback Panorama Deluxe

Postby Rich_Clements » 3 Dec 2015, 8:39am

I have one of these I got mine in August and its a nice bike, I cant compare it with other similar bikes but its a nice ride and as Brucey says perhaps disks are not really required and they (the spyres) are my first foray into mechanical discs and have found them easy to adjust (once I had looked on youtube).
The rack is cheap and cheerful I havent had panniers on mine yet so cant say how strong it is.

I have swapped out the front wheel for a dyno hub and mavic rim but I still have the original rear wheel which has had no issues so far, the weird looking original saddle was binned in favour of a charge spoon.

The oddity is the drop outs on the forks they face forward and really confused me to begin with as I had undone the quick release and the wheel wouldn't drop out you have to slide it forwards, it was certainly a new one on me.


Overall Im happy with mine.

I can confirm there are bosses on the forks, at least there are on mine :D
Rich

loch eck steve
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Re: Ridgeback Panorama Deluxe

Postby loch eck steve » 3 Dec 2015, 8:43pm

Looks like a cracking deal , I too have the voyage and can't fault it .

rmurphy195
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Re: Ridgeback Panorama Deluxe

Postby rmurphy195 » 3 Dec 2015, 9:55pm

Brucey wrote:for me a significant con being that the unladen ride quality usually suffers because the fork is more likely to be overbuilt.

If you are going to have disc brakes whilst the spyres can work well there are simpler more reliable brakes that work almost as well.



I have a Condor Heritage with the Spyre TRP brakes. Front forks are made by Tange, not Condor so I expect they are generic. It rides at least as well - if not better than - the 20-year old 531-framed Galaxy that it replaces. My use is mainly day or morning rides, carrying just me (c80kg), and a pannier with sarnies, lock, waterproofs etc. i.e. lightly laden.

I know the two bikes are likely to be chalk and cheese in any case due to different frame materials/design etc. however while the forks are clearly more beefed-up than the slender 531 forks on the Galaxy they do seem to work well enough for me.

The Spyres work just as well in the dry as the original Galaxy brakes - perhaps a little better - and in the wet they simply work smoothly, the braking is there when you want it. No scraping of rims! And no wear on rims resulting ultimately in the rim bending when the tyres are pumped up, or even splitting - something which happened to my friend's bike one cold, foggy November evening on a day ride around the Peak district, about 10 miles from where we had parked the car.

I anticipate that adjustment will not be a problem, now they are properly set up - so far as they wear the barrel adjuster alone on the cable just needs tweaking, when they need replacing I anticipate I'll just need to slacken it off.

Heating? Not tried heavy laden braking down mountain passes with lots of weight but I suspect there may be a trade-off between overheating the disc, and overheating the rim and bursting the tyre. Braking technique is needed whichever way.

NB this particular bike was on my shortlist to purchase, however I could not get to see one at any bike shop within 40 miles of my home at the time - a problem I think for anyone buying a tourer. And I won't buy what I cannot see in the flesh, in case I don't like it. I did see one in a shop about 18 months ago and liked the version available at that time very much, but was not in the market for a new bike at the time.

I would say if you like the bike, go for it especially at that price, if you can get the right size.
Brompton, Condor Heritage, creaky joints and thinning white (formerly grey) hair
""You know you're getting old when it's easier to ride a bike than to get on and off it" - quote from observant jogger !

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Re: Ridgeback Panorama Deluxe

Postby Brucey » 4 Dec 2015, 10:38am

a 20-year old galaxy would likely have 531ST fork blades; these are (in an unladen context) a pretty stiff blade too, not that comfy when unladen.

Any touring bike is a compromise between how it rides when it is loaded vs when it isn't, but IMHO a disc brake is liable to tip it in one direction.

Put it this way, if you had gone out looking for a bike with disc brakes and a better unladen ride quality than the old Gal, you would have struggled. People tell me that you can get carbon forks that will do it, but the resulting machine isn't what I usually think of as a touring bike.

Spyres work well when they are working but it is easy to set them up so that they will fail and Tektro have had to revise both the brakes and the instructions because of problems of this kind.

Personally I can live with the (well known) shortcomings of rim brakes -yes rims wear out just like tyres do and there are wear indicators on both. Worn discs/pads are less easy and it seems to me that there are more, (and less obvious) failure modes with disc brakes that can leave you with no brake at all. There is a learning curve for sure and the required maintenance is different, so different systems may suit some folk better than others for that reason too.

cheers
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rmurphy195
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Re: Ridgeback Panorama Deluxe

Postby rmurphy195 » 4 Dec 2015, 4:21pm

I think 531ST is what they were - you could see the fork tips flexing as you rode along, but not for too long for obvious reasons! I can see the same on the Condor, but I couldn't say if it was to the same extent.

Still have the Galaxy forks, attached to a rather bent frame, and they really do look most elegant. With Lugs yet :)
Brompton, Condor Heritage, creaky joints and thinning white (formerly grey) hair
""You know you're getting old when it's easier to ride a bike than to get on and off it" - quote from observant jogger !

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Re: Ridgeback Panorama Deluxe

Postby bretonbikes » 6 Dec 2015, 9:08am

rmurphy195 wrote:I think 531ST is what they were - you could see the fork tips flexing as you rode along, but not for too long for obvious reasons! I can see the same on the Condor, but I couldn't say if it was to the same extent.

Still have the Galaxy forks, attached to a rather bent frame, and they really do look most elegant. With Lugs yet :)


The old ST fork blades were narrower (side-to-side) than the 531c promarily to increase wheel clearance, but yes they do 'buzz' nicely to give a decent ride.

Thinking about it I'm not sure that disc brakes require any stronger forks than V-brakes - the bending forces are the same and as both are capable of going well beyond the adhesion of the tyre (or tipping you over the handlebars) that forms the stress limit not any theoretical increase in braking power. The only possible weakness might be the 'knee' formed where the heafty disc mount ends at the top which would stress that particular point. But with any brake the main force will just be the tyre on the road trying to fold the fork back into the frame - where the brakes are actually mounted - drum, disc, rim won't make any difference - though intuitively you feel that isn't the case.

For me the jury is still out on discs. I fit them to the rear of our Dawes hire tandems (because I think tandems need three brakes) and they work fine, but I also had a batch of 10 bikes that used front discs and after 2 or 3 week's hire all had discs enough out of true to rub and you never get the things straight. I was surprised how easy pads were to change, and also how many different pads there were - you'd need to carry specific spares for a long tour. As with the wear issue on rims I think that by the time rims are worn through it's probably time to rebuild the wheel anyway.
35 years of cycletouring, 30 years of running cycling holidays, 5 years of running a campsite for cyclists - there's a pattern here...

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cycleruk
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Re: Ridgeback Panorama Deluxe

Postby cycleruk » 6 Dec 2015, 9:43am

With disc brakes all the braking force has to transfer through the spokes to the rim. Yes the tire has the same braking friction whether rim or disc brakes.
With discs, the force on the forks is also different where the forks have to be more rigid at the ends so as not to bend. Logically this to me would make the ride less comfortable.
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Re: Ridgeback Panorama Deluxe

Postby bretonbikes » 6 Dec 2015, 10:51am

cycleruk wrote:With disc brakes all the braking force has to transfer through the spokes to the rim. Yes the tire has the same braking friction whether rim or disc brakes.
With discs, the force on the forks is also different where the forks have to be more rigid at the ends so as not to bend. Logically this to me would make the ride less comfortable.


I don't think so. The spokes will carry the same force with either brake - otherwise the hub would just rotate;-) Whether you stop the wheel turning at the rim or the hub the spokes are still transmitting all the force (othersies the wheel wouldn't stop;-), the main stress on the fork is the bending force between the axle and the headset ragardless of brake used. If you don't believe me stand over your bike, hold the brake on and try to rack the bike back and forth - the fork will flex in the same way regardless of brake type. The extra strength at the fork tip is because of the stress riser caused by the disc mount itself acting as a knee to bend the ends, but to be honest I'm not sure how significant that is.
35 years of cycletouring, 30 years of running cycling holidays, 5 years of running a campsite for cyclists - there's a pattern here...