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New wheels recommend please

Posted: 5 Feb 2016, 7:41pm
by AlastairS
Hi,
My Dawes Galaxy tourer is my second bike, I only use it commuting or going to the shops.
The rims on my wheels are noticeably concave, should I buy new wheels and if so can you recommend something as I wouldn't know where to begin other than I would like
28mm tyres and the wheels , I don't want to spend much.
Thanks

Re: New wheels recommend please

Posted: 5 Feb 2016, 8:27pm
by scottg
I'd buy new rims and spoke nipples then rebuild the wheels.
I've re-rimmed the same wheel 3 times, with the same spokes.
Never broke a spoke, but I am the worlds slowest wheel builder.

Re: New wheels recommend please

Posted: 5 Feb 2016, 8:58pm
by AlastairS
Thanks Scott,
I've never done this, wheel building, but willing to give it a try if you think it would be possible for someone with no experience.
Is there a Youtube video that might help .
And advice on where to buy rims would be good.
How much will it cost roughly ?
And, is it straightforward to swap cassette and hubs over ?
Thanks

Re: New wheels recommend please

Posted: 5 Feb 2016, 9:35pm
by pete75
I'd recommend this downloadable book http://www.wheelpro.co.uk/wheelbuilding/book.php . Roger Musson provides the best guide to building wheels yourself that I've seen . Musson even includes drawings and instructions on how to build your own wheel building stand and other useful tools.

A good source of rims and spokes at a fair price is nidderdale cycles who seem to trade entirely on Ebay. If you wnat strong touring rims for your Galaxy these would be a reasonable choice. For some reason they don't sell nipples but these are not overly expensive elsewhere - I pay under £2 for packs of 40 Dt swiss brass nipples.

Re: New wheels recommend please

Posted: 6 Feb 2016, 12:24am
by MikeF
The front wheel is much easier than the rear as it is symmetrical. Check Sheldon Brown's website http://www.sheldonbrown.com/wheelbuild.html. Don't buy Musson's book - at least not before you read Sheldon. You need to determine the spoke pattern of the rim especially if it's an old bike. Musson almost ignores this. You can buy rims from Spa Cycles for example. Tape the old new rim to the old and match the spoke alignment - they will alternate around the rim - loosen the spokes and swap spokes one by one. That way each spoke is kept in the same alignment on the rim and hub.

Re: New wheels recommend please

Posted: 6 Feb 2016, 2:08am
by mercalia
hmm building your own wheels. I just did it but I had a spoke tension meter which helped a lot - very necessary when your dont really know what you are doing. I would NOT have liked to do it without - experienced people here will tell you such a meter not necessary but they are EXPERIENCED & they have long since forgotton what it feels like to be inept. It took me some time and mine turned out ok as the rims were heavy duty so probably even a monkey could have done it. But I think there was a lot of luck in it. How heavy are you? if you are light you might be able to get away with some cheap wheels from Ebay

Re: New wheels recommend please

Posted: 6 Feb 2016, 7:16am
by nosmarbaj
I've built a number of wheels using Sheldon Brown's instructions and none of them has let me down. I don't have a tensiometer, and I'm pretty much tone deaf so I struggle with Sheldon's suggestion of "plucking" spokes and using the tone generated as a guide to tension, but the wheels still seem OK. These were MTB/touring wheels with fairly beefy rims - it might be more difficult to get lightweight rims right. I'm not saying a tensiometer is not useful - I'm sure my wheels would be even better if I had one.

The suggestion of taping new rim to old one and moving spokes across one by one is good, but only if the "effective rim diameter" (ERD) is the same or very close (<2mm different), otherwise you will need different length spokes.

Building wheels is fun (for most people). If you have another bike available anyway, you're not risking much by giving it a go.

Re: New wheels recommend please

Posted: 6 Feb 2016, 8:31am
by Phileas
I've built a fair number of wheels for use on a commuter bike. The first set of instructions I tried to follow left me tearing my hair out, then I discovered Sheldon's and it all became relatively straight forward. It's really not as difficult as you might think.

I use a cheap truing stand but I dare say it can be done using the bike frame. I've never used a tensionmeter- I just use the tone method. I don't worry about perfect even tension, it's never caused any issues as far as I can tell.

Re: New wheels recommend please

Posted: 6 Feb 2016, 8:35am
by pwa
If you do opt for new wheels you can expect to pay £150 for a good pair from somewhere like Spa Cycles. You will want an MTB style hub like Shimano Deore and a rim that will take tyres of 32mm width. 36 spokes front and rear. (How old is your Galaxy. It gets more complicated for very old bikes)

Re: New wheels recommend please

Posted: 6 Feb 2016, 10:28am
by nirakaro
I’m just building a pair of wheels, and it’s definitely fun, and not difficult - ok, I’ve done it before, but the first time I did it I hadn’t! - and I’d describe it as easy, but not simple. Certainly wise to have another wheel to look at while you’re lacing it up. And be ready to undo and redo it a time or two if necessary.
It’s certainly economical - my Rigida rims were under £25 for two (look at Yframediscounts, or Fatbirds.co.uk), stainless spokes if you need them are £13 for 36 on ebay, and you’d expect to reuse the hubs.
Truing the new wheels is a lot easier if you’ve got a stand, but can certainly be done on an upside-down bike. For tension, I’ve just squeezed each pair of spokes together with my hand, and compared how it feels with an existing wheel. Never been a problem.
Give it a try!

Re: New wheels recommend please

Posted: 6 Feb 2016, 10:31am
by rmurphy195
Have you tried your local bike shop yet for a quote for new rims? Assuming you are happy with the hubs.

The cassette is easy to remove and put onto a new hub if you have the tools - a chain whip and cassette remover to remove it, I then use my car torque wrench to put it back on - the setting is stamped on the cassette, about 40 ft lbs oops newtonmetres I think. They lock on with a serrated edge, trying without the torque wrench (and I know a lot of people manage to do so) can leave you thinking its tight but then you find the thing comes loose after a few hundred miles (got the T shirt :( ) Once you've done it though its surprisingly easy the next time around, and of course just replacing the cassette as it wears becomes cheaper.

I've found the park tools website a useful resource for this type of thing e.g. http://www.parktool.com/blog/repair-hel ... stallation

Re: New wheels recommend please

Posted: 6 Feb 2016, 10:35am
by mercalia
I found the tension meter VERY useful just as much to know when to STOP tightening the spokes - I used the known good Spa wheels as a model. No amount of plucking will tell you that. Experienced people dont need them but first timers do I think. I found plucking spokes as a way to get tension eveness incredibly hard and could never get it, that just added one more uncertainty to what was already something full of doubt. I am rather pleased I DID get the wheels built - since I had the hubs already and got the rims and spokes off ebay for just £26 I now have a spare set of not bad wheels :)

Re: New wheels recommend please

Posted: 6 Feb 2016, 10:49am
by pwa
mercalia wrote:I found the tension meter VERY useful just as much to know when to STOP tightening the spokes - I used the known good Spa wheels as a model. No amount of plucking will tell you that. Experienced people dont need them but first timers do I think. I found plucking spokes as a way to get tension eveness incredibly hard and could never get it, that just added one more uncertainty to what was already something full of doubt. I am rather pleased I DID get the wheels built - since I had the hubs already and got the rims and spokes off ebay for just £26 I now have a spare set of not bad wheels :)


I put a new rim on a rear wheel and did it without a tension meter. I just made sure that I didn't overdo the tension. Enough to get it true and solid, with repeated pressing down on a matted floor (wheel flat on the floor, hands pressing down on the rim) to work out any bedding in, followed by repeated minor truing. When a spoke felt too stiff to tighten further I loosened a spoke on the other side to get the rim true. It sounds hit and miss but that wheel has now done a two week tour and thousands of miles of local use without going out of true or any problems at all. I think you just need to tell yourself that you are not going to use too much force on any individual spoke.

Re: New wheels recommend please

Posted: 6 Feb 2016, 11:03am
by Freddie
I think with the very stiff rims of today you can actually get too much tension into a rim, which when you add time and corrosion from road salt, can cause cracking at the eyelets. If anyone has ever laced up an old single wall rim, they'll know at what relatively low tensions they tend to deform. Given that such wheels can stay in true in such low tensions, there is probably more tension range in the typical double walled rim than people imagine. The main concern is that the non-drive side spokes are taught enough not to slacken off in use, this being a problem with more heavily dished wheels.

OP, if you don't want to build wheels, you can buy some from Rose Bikes, then stress relieve and true them, achieving much the same effect for less time and effort than a completely handbuilt wheel.

Re: New wheels recommend please

Posted: 6 Feb 2016, 11:16am
by Phileas
You really don't need a tensionmeter to tell you when to stop. Plucking really does work. My commuting wheels stay true for as long as the rims last which is all that matters. (Although now I've switched to disc brakes I might start finding something else fails first. :shock: )