reohn2 wrote:Also thanks for mentioning the Chunky XXL and extra Chunky XXL grips,I was longing at some only the other day with the loop bars in mind,do you have first hand(sorry)experience of them and if so what's your opinion?
I've got Jones own brand H Grips
on my bars, but I had the chance to look at the ESI grips in a shop recently, and they seem to be a very popular grip (certainly for ordinary riser bars in the standard grip length and size). The ESI grips are silicone foam. They have a smooth surface and feel very squishy (probably more so in the retail packaging without their being fitted on a rigid handlebar tube). I suspect they might prove superior to the Jones' grips for vibration damping in the event of a very long day in the saddle over very rough ground.
The Jones' grips are EVA foam and are much more rigid/deform very little when gripped (which does not necessarily mean that they do not provide good shock absorption), and have a slightly roughened surface texture. Jones also offers another, more expensive version of the grips made with 'Kraton' rubber (whatever that is) and I cannot comment on those, although I suspect they might be more like the ESI silicone foam.
I had assumed that the Jones grips would be difficult to get hold of in the UK, hence my suggestion of the XXL versions of the ESI grips, but it seems that Bothy Bikes are selling them online (I cannot provide a link because my antivirus software doesn't like their website, so you'll need to Google it yourself), and Keep Pedalling are offering the Kraton version online for £36
(I guess they might also have the EVA version in the shop).
Having used the Jones EVA grips, I like them a lot, and I am not particularly tempted to try the others, so they would be my preference. However, if you have hand or wrist problems and/or do very long punishing rides, I can imagine that you might prefer the ESI Extra Chunky grips.
Incidentally, one thing I very much like about Jeff Jones is his attention to detail, not just in his frames and how they are designed and set up, but even down to the small things. So his grips come with extra wide plugs with a captive bolt, rather than the cheaper and simpler (and smaller) push in plug (as supplied with the ESI grips). I seem to remember that when I started cycling, bike shops would have a 'point of sale' card strip of similar bar end plugs with a captive bolt, which came in either black or white, and which you would buy separately from the rolls of cloth bar tape. It was and is a good design which just works, unlike the push in plugs which often fell out/disappeared.
reohn2 wrote:with 11cm stem on my Vagabond which has a 593mm ETT they're spot on for me.
Even though they felt good with your 11cm stem, if you have a shorter stem available, I would strongly recommend you try it, even if only to see what it feels like. I'm using a 70cm stem, and with the bars I have a body position which is probably not too dissimilar from those photographs of cyclists over a hundred years ago with an upright body and hands quite close to the body when gripping the bars at the widest points, and it feels very comfortable. Obviously I can lean forward more by simply gripping the bars at different points.
reohn2 wrote:Thanks for taking the trouble to advise on the set up,considering you didn't approve of the Jones copy,very gracious of you IMo.
I was a bit too forthright about that, but I was trying (and probably failing) to make a bigger point about how things like design rights protection etc. is skewed against small businesses and innovators, and too much in favour of big corporates like Specialized (and even Planet X at the smaller end of the scale) who can afford to implement aggressive and sometimes unfair business practices (and pay for lawyers to defend and implement those practices), especially now that the manufacturing is done by others in China where it becomes impossible/impractical to enforce intellectual property laws.