Artistic cycling in the UK?

General cycling advice ( NOT technical ! )
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tykeboy2003
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Re: Artistic cycling in the UK?

Postby tykeboy2003 » 6 Jan 2017, 12:38pm

[XAP]Bob wrote:We always have judges in sports - deciding where the javelin landed, deciding whether a delivery really was lbw, deciding if the ball crossed the line, or was touched on it. Those decisions can often make more difference to the result than in the more artistic sporting endeavours.


Good points but I won't change my mind..... I'm an old git and allowed to be intransigent.

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[XAP]Bob
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Re: Artistic cycling in the UK?

Postby [XAP]Bob » 6 Jan 2017, 2:14pm

I fully support your 'old git' rights ;)
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landsurfer
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Re: Artistic cycling in the UK?

Postby landsurfer » 6 Jan 2017, 4:38pm

tykeboy2003 wrote:Good points but I won't change my mind..... I'm an old git and allowed to be intransigent.


I am no fan of any "subjective" sport.
If you cannot measure it by a repeatable system then it becomes less of a sport and more of a game or entertainment.

Gymnastics, superb levels of fitness, skill, dedication by all involved.
How many times have you heard the phrase "BILL SCROGGINS WILL HAVE TO IMPRESS THE JUDGES TO WIN A MEDAL" ..(jenny scroggins are also available).. No one should have to "impress" anyone to win, there must be criteria that personal preference cannot overrule.

When a cyclist crosses the line, or a swimmer touches home first they become a medal winner.
An Olympic medal for winning perhaps.
Not a medal for being the most popular with the judges on that day in that place.

Sorry gymnasts, divers, synchro swimmers etc .... But with out objective marking / scoring i cannot feel you are being served well by your associations.
Ulster will fight, and Ulster will be right ... Carson.
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reohn2
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Re: Artistic cycling in the UK?

Postby reohn2 » 6 Jan 2017, 4:54pm

landsurfer wrote:
tykeboy2003 wrote:Good points but I won't change my mind..... I'm an old git and allowed to be intransigent.


I am no fan of any "subjective" sport.
If you cannot measure it by a repeatable system then it becomes less of a sport and more of a game or entertainment.

Gymnastics, superb levels of fitness, skill, dedication by all involved.
How many times have you heard the phrase "BILL SCROGGINS WILL HAVE TO IMPRESS THE JUDGES TO WIN A MEDAL" ..(jenny scroggins are also available).. No one should have to "impress" anyone to win, there must be criteria that personal preference cannot overrule.

When a cyclist crosses the line, or a swimmer touches home first they become a medal winner.
An Olympic medal for winning perhaps.
Not a medal for being the most popular with the judges on that day in that place....


But is "subjective" sport not just a different way of measuring a winner by which is the nearest to a perfect score by another set of criteria than who gets to the end of their routine first?
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reohn2
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Re: Artistic cycling in the UK?

Postby reohn2 » 6 Jan 2017, 4:56pm

groberts wrote:Clever but belongs in the circus!

By what measure?
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landsurfer
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Re: Artistic cycling in the UK?

Postby landsurfer » 6 Jan 2017, 5:00pm

reohn2 wrote:
groberts wrote:Clever but belongs in the circus!

By what measure?


My son, John, does "Artistic cycling" at the circus school he goes to in Nottingham ..... and rope and aerial work. He thinks the time, on a unicycle, is good for his other balance work
Ulster will fight, and Ulster will be right ... Carson.
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reohn2
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Re: Artistic cycling in the UK?

Postby reohn2 » 6 Jan 2017, 5:06pm

landsurfer wrote:
reohn2 wrote:
groberts wrote:Clever but belongs in the circus!

By what measure?


My son, John, does "Artistic cycling" at the circus school he goes to in Nottingham ..... and rope and aerial work. He thinks the time, on a unicycle, is good for his other balance work


I don't understand how that covers the whole of artistic cycling?
His time on a unicycle is a means to an end not the end in itself
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reohn2
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Re: Artistic cycling in the UK?

Postby reohn2 » 6 Jan 2017, 5:25pm

If a course is set,by means of series of manueovres executed(performed if you will)the most artistically and efficiently withing a set criteria,judged by experts in the ruling of that criteria how is that not a sport?
This has been happening in motorcycle trials riding for donkeys and has always been considered a sport as has equestrian dressage.
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landsurfer
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Re: Artistic cycling in the UK?

Postby landsurfer » 6 Jan 2017, 5:34pm

reohn2 wrote:If a course is set,by means of series of manueovres executed(performed if you will)the most artistically and efficiently withing a set criteria,judged by experts in the ruling of that criteria how is that not a sport?
This has been happening in motorcycle trials riding for donkeys and has always been considered a sport as has equestrian dressage.


Well none of the trials i have ridden in give artistic points .... it was just foot down, dabs, stopping and rolling back, but i ride classic trials ....

Evening Mr. Angry ...... :D
Ulster will fight, and Ulster will be right ... Carson.
The Road Goes On Forever ...

reohn2
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Re: Artistic cycling in the UK?

Postby reohn2 » 6 Jan 2017, 5:44pm

landsurfer wrote:
reohn2 wrote:If a course is set,by means of series of manueovres executed(performed if you will)the most artistically and efficiently withing a set criteria,judged by experts in the ruling of that criteria how is that not a sport?
This has been happening in motorcycle trials riding for donkeys and has always been considered a sport as has equestrian dressage.


Well none of the trials i have ridden in give artistic points .... it was just foot down, dabs, stopping and rolling back, but i ride classic trials ....

So it's not just the getting to the end of the course that matters,but how you get there,there's a certain art in cleaning a section,no?


Evening Mr. Angry ...... :D

You must have me mixed up with someone else.
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malcolmlauder
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Re: Artistic cycling in the UK?

Postby malcolmlauder » 6 Jan 2017, 5:45pm

I've seen this kind of thing at the Chinese state circus recently. Very impressive!

landsurfer
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Re: Artistic cycling in the UK?

Postby landsurfer » 6 Jan 2017, 5:47pm

reohn2 wrote:
landsurfer wrote:
reohn2 wrote:If a course is set,by means of series of manueovres executed(performed if you will)the most artistically and efficiently withing a set criteria,judged by experts in the ruling of that criteria how is that not a sport?
This has been happening in motorcycle trials riding for donkeys and has always been considered a sport as has equestrian dressage.


Well none of the trials i have ridden in give artistic points .... it was just foot down, dabs, stopping and rolling back, but i ride classic trials ....

So it's not just the getting to the end of the course that matters,but how you get there,there's a certain art in cleaning a section,no?[quote]

Welllll i think it's skill not art ...... but lets be honest .... does it matter as long as it's fun ....
Ulster will fight, and Ulster will be right ... Carson.
The Road Goes On Forever ...

reohn2
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Re: Artistic cycling in the UK?

Postby reohn2 » 6 Jan 2017, 5:53pm

landsurfer wrote: Welllll i think it's skill not art ......


Which is debatable,which is why we're debating it.

There's skill in being fastest,there's also skill in art,whether that can be measured by a set of criteria is the debate,which it seems can.

but lets be honest .... does it matter as long as it's fun ....

But it can also be serious fun :)

Artistic cycling,like gymnastics can be a performance and ultimately is,but when the same performance is measured against other competitors it becomes a sport requiring skill,art and physical ability,which is arguably harder than just plain sport as in FPTP physical ability sport.
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landsurfer
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Re: Artistic cycling in the UK?

Postby landsurfer » 6 Jan 2017, 6:00pm

reohn2 wrote:But it can also be serious fun :)


lol ... very true, very true ....
I possibly take the skills route as i am artistically incompetent. I can design but not create.....
The only keyboard i could ever make music with was a 70's cassette recorder .. :)
Ulster will fight, and Ulster will be right ... Carson.
The Road Goes On Forever ...

reohn2
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Re: Artistic cycling in the UK?

Postby reohn2 » 6 Jan 2017, 6:02pm

landsurfer wrote:.......I possibly take the skills route as i am artistically incompetent. I can design but not create.....


By who's criteria?
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