What is the best Garmin or GPS (not smart phone) for touring

General cycling advice ( NOT technical ! )
Samuel D
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Re: What is the best Garmin or GPS (not smart phone) for touring

Post by Samuel D »

iandriver wrote:… when the Touring has a tantrum.

Depressingly often, in my experience. After all these years, Garmin apparently still cannot make a device that reliably stays on throughout a ride, doesn’t crash, and records the whole ride. In normal circumstances, you wouldn’t call any of these devices fit for purpose. They don’t remotely perform as advertised.
Graham O
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Re: What is the best Garmin or GPS (not smart phone) for touring

Post by Graham O »

Samuel D wrote:Garmin apparently still cannot make a device that reliably stays on throughout a ride, doesn’t crash, and records the whole ride


One problem I have had with the Edge Touring is near Flint railway station in N. Wales. Whenever I cycle over a particular point, the Edge switches off, loses satellite fix and takes a long time to find the satellites again. I've been over the same spot a number of times and know to the metre where it happens. It keeps route information, however.
iandriver
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Re: What is the best Garmin or GPS (not smart phone) for touring

Post by iandriver »

Samuel D wrote:
iandriver wrote:… when the Touring has a tantrum.

Depressingly often, in my experience. After all these years, Garmin apparently still cannot make a device that reliably stays on throughout a ride, doesn’t crash, and records the whole ride. In normal circumstances, you wouldn’t call any of these devices fit for purpose. They don’t remotely perform as advertised.


I must admit, if someone else could get it right and gain some traction, I think most of us wouldn't touch them again with a barge pole. Like so much tech now, it's new products for the sake of it, while never getting the existing one to work as it should.
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Mick F
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Re: What is the best Garmin or GPS (not smart phone) for touring

Post by Mick F »

Bez wrote:Garmin have always been rather optimistic about battery life.
Not in my experience.
My Garmin Edge 20 for instance is supposed to last 8hrs
I got 8hrs out of it fine.

My Montana will go for 18hrs on the Li battery despite Garmin saying 16hrs.
If you fit AA batteries, it'll go for over 24hrs instead of the stated 22hrs.

Can't remember about my Edge 305 or Edge 705.

Never had an issue with any of mine turning off and playing up. Main issue for me with the Edge 305 was there was no way of calibrating the altimeter. Some days, I set off below sea level. :lol:
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Paulatic
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Re: What is the best Garmin or GPS (not smart phone) for touring

Post by Paulatic »

I know the OP specifically says not a smart phone. But
I've just bailed out of Garmin. Sold my Oregon on fleabay for the same figure I'd bought it for 18months earlier on fleabay.
The reason I've done this is because I recently renewed my phone and moved from IPhone 4s to an SE. The battery life on the new phone is tremendous compared to the old one. 6 hrs tracking would have sapped the life out of old one. 6 hrs with new one is nothing to worry about. Routes are so much easier to make, I'm using MapOut, with a choice of apps to use. Also a larger clearer window to follow.
I've invested in a quad lock which, while not cheap, is rock solid and no worries of the phone falling off. My Oregon did fall off a couple of times when I can't have had it mounted correctly. :(
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Re: What is the best Garmin or GPS (not smart phone) for touring

Post by Bez »

Mick F wrote:Not in my experience.


Fair enough. I've seen a fair few reports of Garmins under-performing on battery life, but I guess people aren't so vocal about things that behave in accordance with the manufacturer's claims ;) Let's say they have rather variable performance, then…

Paulatic wrote:I've just bailed out of Garmin…I recently renewed my phone and moved from IPhone 4s to an SE.


I've used a few phones for navigation in the past and they do have some specific advantages but, broadly speaking, a phone can't be interacted with when you're wearing winter gloves or if it's wet (and if it's not a waterproof one it needs protecting anyway) and with the likely exception of the Lenovo P2 and maybe a few Chinese eBay specials the battery life is even worse than an under-performing Garmin ;)
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TrevA
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Re: What is the best Garmin or GPS (not smart phone) for touring

Post by TrevA »

I had an issue with my Garmin and short battery life, but I'd put the backlight on constant for winter/night use and forgotten to turn it off. No issues since I rectified this. A 3-4hour ride uses about 30% of the battery life.
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Mick F
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Re: What is the best Garmin or GPS (not smart phone) for touring

Post by Mick F »

Yep.

The display uses power, the brighter the more power consumed. The actual processor and the tracking uses not much at all. If you can set any device to turn off the screen when it's not needed, you can get a huge advantage in longevity.
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Re: What is the best Garmin or GPS (not smart phone) for touring

Post by PM999 »

I really want to recommend the Edge Touring because, when it works, it's great. Unfortunately, it's not sufficiently reliable. My use of GPS is primarily creation of a route/track .gpx file in a route creator website, load up, ride and follow the line aided by turn notifications. For some time, I used a Garmin Oregon (think Montana, but lower spec and fewer bells/whistles). This was retired a few weeks ago and replaced by an Edge Touring. First proper use of the ET was a 14 day tour, about 50 miles per day. During 11 of these days, it worked faultlessly. Day 2, however, was its first wobbly day. About 5 miles from destination, it refused to give any turn indications and all screens froze - no zooming in/out, switching screens. On power down/restart, it simply refused to show the track at all or navigate in any way - entering the destination town manually just led to an endlessly spinning graphic. We bailed out using roadsigns. Wobbly day 2 was some days later. After consistent 7-8 hours of battery life each day, and this when leaving it on the map screen (highest battery use), on this day it ran out of juice after about 4 hours. No change at all to mode of use compared to other days and fully charged overnight. Fallback was ViewRanger on a 'phone. The 3rd wobbly day was towards the end of our trip when frozen screens and refusal to navigate resurfaced, this time only half way into the day. We again fell back on ViewRanger, but a subsequent coffee stop and much on/off button pushing with the Edge eventually had it working again.

I'm far from being the only person reporting faults like these, and Garmin should really work hard on a firmware fix.

Paul
Bikegirl45
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Re: What is the best Garmin or GPS (not smart phone) for touring

Post by Bikegirl45 »

Thanks to everyone who has given me details, lots to think about. I agree there is no device which suits everyone and in the end I have to decide what is essential and what is nice to have and reach a compromise. I had never heard of the Montana but will look it up and build it into my list , which I will then sort into a short list and finally decide. What I want is to be able to down load a pre planned route that I then follow, also down load club rides so as to avoid wrong turns and getting lost!!!. Thanks again for the helpful advise.
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Mick F
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Re: What is the best Garmin or GPS (not smart phone) for touring

Post by Mick F »

Excellent! :D
Thank you for getting back to the question in hand.
It's good to see that someone who comes on here and asks a question as a first post on here, and then comes back for a comment and thanks for the advice.
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Samuel D
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Re: What is the best Garmin or GPS (not smart phone) for touring

Post by Samuel D »

If you decide on the Garmin Edge Touring, I could sell you mine for €120 by PayPal, shipped to the UK. Bought on 10 May 2017 as I chopped and changed to try to find a Garmin I like. Nope – same problems as all the others I’ve tried!

Used for a few rides and basically new condition.

Good luck otherwise.
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Re: What is the best Garmin or GPS (not smart phone) for touring

Post by yutkoxpo »

whizzzz wrote:After reading similar tales, I went for the Wahoo Bolt. Its a black and white screen, but other than that it seems better than more expensive options.

Decent battery life, you can plot maps using ridewithGPS.com, it links to wifi so you can in theory get routes when you are out ( if you have made them ) via your phone etc.

Easy to use, the maps and LEDs show the way whilst beeping if you want near to junctions.

Pretty impressed with it, certainly have a look at the review videos and stuff.



Hi Whizzzz,
I'm looking at the Elemnt for my touring needs. It's ,for me, huge advantage over Garmin, is the ability to create & load routes without a P.C.
I'm wondering if to create a route in RidewithGPS and load it to the unit you also need a subscription to RWGPS?

Also, any other feedback appreciated!

Frank
Bez
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Re: What is the best Garmin or GPS (not smart phone) for touring

Post by Bez »

You need a RideWithGPS account, but the free account will do, you don't need one of the paid subscriptions. Sign up and try it out.

The Elemnt syncs with your RideWithGPS account so you have access to all your routes on the device. However, you'll still want to use a PC in order to plan routes. The only way to create a route on the fly is to use your phone to plot a route to a destination, which requires a data connection (so if you're out of coverage it won't work) and you have little or no control over the actual route it chooses; in other words it's broadly comparable to using a routing-enabled Garmin to calculate a route, until you're out of phone coverage when the Garmin starts to win again. Mind you, a phone is an inherently poor device for plotting a route.

The Elemnt app will allow you to send GPX files to the device, too.

I'm working on a small tool which will get RideWithGPS routes onto a Garmin via an USB OTG compatible Android phone, which will make PC-free loading onto Garmins possible.

Basically if you have OTG support on your phone then you've got scope for PC-free route loading with either device. If you don't then the Wahoo has an advantage.
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Re: What is the best Garmin or GPS (not smart phone) for touring

Post by yutkoxpo »

Bez wrote:You need a RideWithGPS account, but the free account will do, you don't need one of the paid subscriptions. Sign up and try it out.

The Elemnt syncs with your RideWithGPS account so you have access to all your routes on the device. However, you'll still want to use a PC in order to plan routes. The only way to create a route on the fly is to use your phone to plot a route to a destination, which requires a data connection (so if you're out of coverage it won't work) and you have little or no control over the actual route it chooses; in other words it's broadly comparable to using a routing-enabled Garmin to calculate a route, until you're out of phone coverage when the Garmin starts to win again. Mind you, a phone is an inherently poor device for plotting a route.

The Elemnt app will allow you to send GPX files to the device, too.

I'm working on a small tool which will get RideWithGPS routes onto a Garmin via an USB OTG compatible Android phone, which will make PC-free loading onto Garmins possible.

Basically if you have OTG support on your phone then you've got scope for PC-free route loading with either device. If you don't then the Wahoo has an advantage.


Hi Bez,
it seems like you know your stuff! I had a chat session with Garmin and was told that none of their units, both cycling specific and handheld gps were compatible with uploading from a phone or tablet.
I'd be interested in hearing about your tool if you get it to work.

I know plotting courses on a phone is not exactly pleasant, but I would be hoping instead to "borrow" existing gps tracks that are already on the web. Finding them and downloading them is a much easier proposition on a phone. Using the phone to plot a course will only be in an emergency situation.

I've had the use of a Garmin Edge Touring for the past month or so and it is unbelievably poor. Crashes regularly, if I go off route it will recalculate to the shortest route to the destination - frustrating if I'm cycling a loop. Try crossing your route - it just dies! Given that this is a touring specific device it has really made me question the quality of Garmin products.

I'm going to do a bit more reading, but I'm leaning towards the Wahoo necasue it seems like it will work the way I want it to.

Many thanks

Frank
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