What premium to support LBS?

[PH]

NB date.


signal-2021-07-22-103350.jpeg


Spotted in London outside bike shop. Small mark-up.

Anyone seen anything similar before?

Jonathan

viewtopic.php?f=16&t=132765&p=1397682&h ... g#p1397682

[Jdsk]

Thanks

Jonathan

[fastpedaller]

Viewing 'the problem' from another industry I can see the parallels, and IMHO the distributors are the issue here, not the 'general public' who are the final end-user or the retail customer. As has been said, the online seller is offering an item for the same price that the trade are paying or less. The UK distributors, wholesalers (call them what you like) are working a 'price maintenance system' and are happy to say "you have to buy from us" to support their cause. I see this in a lot of industries. This was happening over 30 years ago, when a friend in the cycle trade was told he shouldn't be buying from Dave Lloyd (whose price was lower) because the product was a 'grey import' - when challenged with the question " are you saying they are illegal or fake?" the wholesaler became very defensive and eventually said 'no, but you shouldn't buy them' I buy polyester resins, and a friend who is 'in the trade' is being taken for a ride with the prices he pays his 'wholesaler to the trade', regularly paying some 20% higher than I pay as a retail customer (same product, different seller). I'm sure many more examples are available.
Smacks of cartel/price fixing practice!

[Bmblbzzz]

I wonder if it would be worth extending the vending-machine approach to some other components, perhaps cables and chains?

[Bmblbzzz]

Viewing 'the problem' from another industry I can see the parallels, and IMHO the distributors are the issue here, not the 'general public' who are the final end-user or the retail customer. As has been said, the online seller is offering an item for the same price that the trade are paying or less. The UK distributors, wholesalers (call them what you like) are working a 'price maintenance system' and are happy to say "you have to buy from us" to support their cause. I see this in a lot of industries. This was happening over 30 years ago, when a friend in the cycle trade was told he shouldn't be buying from Dave Lloyd (whose price was lower) because the product was a 'grey import' - when challenged with the question " are you saying they are illegal or fake?" the wholesaler became very defensive and eventually said 'no, but you shouldn't buy them' I buy polyester resins, and a friend who is 'in the trade' is being taken for a ride with the prices he pays his 'wholesaler to the trade', regularly paying some 20% higher than I pay as a retail customer (same product, different seller). I'm sure many more examples are available.
Smacks of cartel/price fixing practice!

I haven't read the rest of this thread, but what do you mean by "the online seller is offering an item for the same price that the trade are paying or less"? Firstly, there's a semantic difficulty, in that the online seller is the trade, or to view it from the the other end, the trade are sellers. Secondly, there are very often the same people: a physical shop will often have an online presence selling the same items more cheaply, or likely several online presences (on Ebay, Amazon, perhaps other platforms, as well as "bikeshop.com") with differentiated pricing structures.

[PH]

I wonder if it would be worth extending the vending-machine approach to some other components, perhaps cables and chains?

In Amsterdam, some of the cycle parking places have vending machines with a variety of items, I didn't have a close look, but they certainly contained cheap lights and chain lube.

[rogerzilla]

Mine aren't all that good. Limited range is the biggest problem. Hargroves don't even have rim tape when I want it. The only remaining function seems to be for workshop jobs I can't do myself, and another LBS (not Hargroves) cocked up the last one of those, having the frameset for a week to face it for a headset and then forgetting to do the crown race seat.

There were good LBSes in other places I've lived.

[fastpedaller]

Viewing 'the problem' from another industry I can see the parallels, and IMHO the distributors are the issue here, not the 'general public' who are the final end-user or the retail customer. As has been said, the online seller is offering an item for the same price that the trade are paying or less. The UK distributors, wholesalers (call them what you like) are working a 'price maintenance system' and are happy to say "you have to buy from us" to support their cause. I see this in a lot of industries. This was happening over 30 years ago, when a friend in the cycle trade was told he shouldn't be buying from Dave Lloyd (whose price was lower) because the product was a 'grey import' - when challenged with the question " are you saying they are illegal or fake?" the wholesaler became very defensive and eventually said 'no, but you shouldn't buy them' I buy polyester resins, and a friend who is 'in the trade' is being taken for a ride with the prices he pays his 'wholesaler to the trade', regularly paying some 20% higher than I pay as a retail customer (same product, different seller). I'm sure many more examples are available.
Smacks of cartel/price fixing practice!

I haven't read the rest of this thread, but what do you mean by "the online seller is offering an item for the same price that the trade are paying or less"? Firstly, there's a semantic difficulty, in that the online seller is the trade, or to view it from the the other end, the trade are sellers. Secondly, there are very often the same people: a physical shop will often have an online presence selling the same items more cheaply, or likely several online presences (on Ebay, Amazon, perhaps other platforms, as well as "bikeshop.com") with differentiated pricing structures.

The point I was making is that the wholesalers aren't supporting the retailers - when the retailer is expected (by the wholesaler) to remain 'loyal' to the wholesaler, but anyone (including the retailer, presumably) can buy the same item online for a lesser sum, there is something amiss

[mattsccm]

Will the( as I see it) recent/current increase in new cyclist help? As said, advice etc when buying a bike plus spanner work. I wander into bike shops on the rare occasions I visit the bike city just in case the sale bins have something. Other wise I have no use. I have all the spares, many times over that I am likely to need and many more times tools. I think the only thing a shop might offer me is a re-gas on a shock aborber if I had a bike with one. I build wheels and if not happy with the finish I take them to the old boy locally who has done them for decades.
Most shops carry the same range of stuff with little to excite. The best are the recyle places as there is the excitement of finding a rare bargain that they haven't spotted.

[TrevA]

I think LBS have had their day.

If I need spares, I get them online, or in an emergency, from Halfords or Decathlon, who are open 7 days a week and weekdays until 8pm and 9pm respectively, unlike the LBS who closes at 5.30 and closes completely 2 days a week. If I want a bike, accessories or clothing I can go to Rutland Cycles, Decathlon or Evans or online, all of whom have a better selection than the LBS. That only really leaves repairs and we have several bike mechanics locally who can do repairs quicker, cheaper and to the same standard as the LBS. I do most routine maintenance myself, so would only go to a mechanic for wheel building and repair, or a specialist job that I don’t have the tools for.

I did venture into my LBS recently in search of a new summer road bike. The only one they had was £2300, A Cinelli carbon frame but only Tiagra groupset. I went home and googled it and it’s only £1999 on the Cinelli website. A £300 premium for the pleasure of shopping at my LBS? No thanks.

[Jdsk]

Pretty similar here, with a mobile mechanic whom I trust in the next village.

And no taking the bike in and coming home somehow, and then going in somehow and bringing it back.

Jonathan

[rogerzilla]

Bromptons are bad for needing dealer attention, since they have a couple of consumable parts that are hard to swap out*, and getting more so. You can't buy the tools or some of the parts** anymore - they are dealer-fit only. In London this might be acceptable but, in the provinces, the dealer might be tens of miles away so you need a car to get the bike there.

*the rear hinge and the seatpost bush. In daily commuting use, both could need doing every year or two. They both need reaming in situ.

**a stem, for instance. Many dealers won't sell you the hinge kit or seat bush either, but (currently) some still will.

[mjr]

And no taking the bike in and coming home somehow, and then going in somehow and bringing it back.

When I do need to take it to a shop, I either I put the bike (or offending bit of bike) there in/on the trailer or sometimes I ride the offending bike with it carrying a folding bike.

Most people seem to just wheel the broken bike there (if they live nearby) or put the bike in/on a car.

Bizarre to read above of an LBS that still closes at 5.30 and is only open 5 days a week. I think all here are open at least 6/7 and most later than 5.30 some days. Maybe the aforementioned LBS doesn't need more work. So be it.