Dog Attack! - Apparently not.

General cycling advice ( NOT technical ! )
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pete75
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Re: Dog Attack! - Apparently not.

Post by pete75 »

bigjim wrote:I think most dogs these days are off their heads. Plus a lot of the owners. Many dogs appear to be some sort of child substitute, treated unaturaly and in unatural surroundings. No wonder they are crazy, plus I suspect, inbred.


No it ain't that - if it was people from Norfolk would be off their heads too. :lol:
'Give me my bike, a bit of sunshine - and a stop-off for a lunchtime pint - and I'm a happy man.' - Reg Baker
Cyril Haearn
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Re: Dog Attack! - Apparently not.

Post by Cyril Haearn »

tykeboy2003 wrote:
fastpedaller wrote:Indeed. During the conversation I had on Sunday with the Police Operator she said "If you see them loose again, call 999 because they could cause an accident if there was a car going past". I was VERY tempted to say "don't bike riders or pedestrians count then?"


Speechless.... You should have said it.


Try telling her the dog is causing consternation to motorists, then the girls in blue will spring into action
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PJ520
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Re: Dog Attack! - Apparently not.

Post by PJ520 »

fastpedaller wrote:Indeed. During the conversation I had on Sunday with the Police Operator she said "If you see them loose again, call 999 because they could cause an accident if there was a car going past". I was VERY tempted to say "don't bike riders or pedestrians count then?"
In fairness to the operator I think she may have meant that you could have been forced into the path of a passing car.
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fastpedaller
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Re: Dog Attack! - Apparently not.

Post by fastpedaller »

I've now identified the property, and have provided the info to the Council Dog Warden dept.
Airsporter1st
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Re: Dog Attack! - Apparently not.

Post by Airsporter1st »

I (fortunately) cannot claim much experience of dealing with the police or associated ancillary workers, but at the end of the day, they are an organisation of human workers. That being the case, if you don't get satisfaction speaking to one of the lower echelon, you need to escalate and keep doing so until you get to a level where an appropriate response is forthcoming.
thirdcrank
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Re: Dog Attack! - Apparently not.

Post by thirdcrank »

The owner of a dog dangerously out of control sentenced to four years:-

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-tyne-42322897
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NATURAL ANKLING
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Re: Dog Attack! - Apparently not.

Post by NATURAL ANKLING »

Hi,
IIRC they changed the law on cruelty to animals from 6 months to six years imprisonment.

Trouble is that in my experience when a dog bites a human for first time nothing happens, and do they even bother to record it?
If some one was to sell a dog would police know it has bitten before.
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tykeboy2003
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Re: Dog Attack! - Apparently not.

Post by tykeboy2003 »

NATURAL ANKLING wrote:IIRC they changed the law on cruelty to animals from 6 months to six years imprisonment.


Contrast this with the ridiculously lenient sentences given to dangerous drivers who have killed pedestrians or cyclists.....
pete75
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Re: Dog Attack! - Apparently not.

Post by pete75 »

tykeboy2003 wrote:
NATURAL ANKLING wrote:IIRC they changed the law on cruelty to animals from 6 months to six years imprisonment.


Contrast this with the ridiculously lenient sentences given to dangerous drivers who have killed pedestrians or cyclists.....


The maximum sentence for which is 14 years - not many get that and not many will get the maximum 6 years for animal cruelty.
'Give me my bike, a bit of sunshine - and a stop-off for a lunchtime pint - and I'm a happy man.' - Reg Baker
thirdcrank
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Re: Dog Attack! - Apparently not.

Post by thirdcrank »

NATURAL ANKLING wrote:Hi,
IIRC they changed the law on cruelty to animals from 6 months to six years imprisonment.

Trouble is that in my experience when a dog bites a human for first time nothing happens, and do they even bother to record it?
If some one was to sell a dog would police know it has bitten before.


Apart from involving dogs, I'm unclear of the connection here with cruelty to animals. :? I doubt anybody would get six years for fighting off a mutt with a bike pump.

I think that the identification of a dog as "dangerous" which traditionally has meant the first bite is on the house, and the subsequent identification of a dog as having had that first chance is problematic as is the identification of a dog as the biter unless the investigation is almost immediate. All this is probably amenable - at least in theory - to the use of DNA, specialist examination by a canine orthodontist, and I could even imagine some extention of facial-recognition technology to man's best friend. In the real word, no chance and offences have to be proved to the criminal standard. I'm not saying it's impossible, as the case in my link shows, but it's not easy. I can't remember if it's in my link or if I read it elsewhere but initially the defendant in this case was apparently intending to plead not guilty, on the grounds that it was subject to a confiscation order so it belonged to the courts, even though she had not complied and still had the dog in her possession.
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NATURAL ANKLING
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Re: Dog Attack! - Apparently not.

Post by NATURAL ANKLING »

Hi,
Some connection as its 6 years cruelty, and max 5 years if injured by dog.
Death is up to 14 from just two years, since 2014.
https://www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk/ne ... -offences/

Sorry if a similar link has already been posted.

P.S.- I will have no problem in, fighting off a mutt, off me with anything I can put my hand on.
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thirdcrank
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Re: Dog Attack! - Apparently not.

Post by thirdcrank »

The offences in connection with dangerous dogs have been an ongoing problem, which is part of what I've been trying to say. Substantially increasing the punishment for any offence may be symptomatic of some failure of enforcement. This isn't one of those things that can be written off to inadequate policing: the evidential "chain" is not easy to establish as I've already posted.

I don't claim any particular knowledge about cruelty to animals, especially changes made since I retired (1997) but it seems that the Animal Welfare Act 2006 is the principle legislation. It appears that the offences under this act are triable summarily with a max of 51 weeks imprisonment.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/45/section/32

(It illustrates how much I am out-of-touch. :oops: I didn't know that the sentencing powers of magistrates' courts had been increased from 6 months to 51 weeks.)

Remember also, we are a nation of animal lovers: the RSPCA is one of our biggest charities and there are plenty more. Plenty of advocacy for animal rights.
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tykeboy2003
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Re: Dog Attack! - Apparently not.

Post by tykeboy2003 »

pete75 wrote:The maximum sentence for which is 14 years - not many get that and not many will get the maximum 6 years for animal cruelty.


Yes you're quite right of course. I guess some would argue that the ratio of 6 to 14 undervalues the lives of animals. As I get older I have begun to agree with them, basically in terms of the natural world, the human race is a plague on the face of the Earth. We destroy the environment with scarcely a thought.

However, in the case of motorists killing or maiming cyclists and pedestrians, the latter are the "good guys" by not burning unnecessary fossil fuels, the motorist is the "bad-guy" unthinkingly burning petrol/diesel.

I also think I've got too much time on my hands to be writing this drivel....
hazecellar
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Re: Dog Attack! - Apparently not.

Post by hazecellar »

i was attacked by a dog while walking once
i was bitten and was very annoyed when the owner come walking from half a field away saying ooo he's never done that before !
i phoned the police to find out what my rights are as to protecting myself and they said - if you are in fear of a dog that is not under control you are within your rights to do whatever you have to do to stop it biting , i asked if i had hit it with a stick and done damage to the dog what would happen
i was told even if i had killed the dog with a stick i was protecting myself from a dog out of control
i am a dog owner before anyone shouts animal cruelty and didnt do anything but miss aim a couple of kicks and shout a lot - but i know if i was in the same situation again with a stick , i would swing with all my might ! dog bites hurt
Cyril Haearn
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Re: Dog Attack! - Apparently not.

Post by Cyril Haearn »

I would try to get that police advice in writing

An average person is bigger, higher, taller than most dogs
Many dogs are cowards I think
Just bellowing at them should usually work but the "keeper" would not like that :?
Is "keeper" the right word?
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