Internal hub geared bikes

General cycling advice ( NOT technical ! )
normankr
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Internal hub geared bikes

Postby normankr » 19 Mar 2018, 2:32pm

Does anyone know of a good quality lightweight road bike with a shimano 8 or 11 speed internal hub gear.

Brucey
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Re: Internal hub geared bikes

Postby Brucey » 19 Mar 2018, 6:52pm

IIRC Thorn offer Alfine or Rohloff options on some of their bikes.

Genesis offer their 'day one' model with an 8s gear but IIRC this is currently a Nexus 8 'premium' (which also has roller bearings on the planet pinions) rather than an Alfine per se. There not much difference between the N8 and A8 hubs these days; the sealing is a little bit better on A8 and the shift pattern is reversed.

cheers
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dobbo800
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Re: Internal hub geared bikes

Postby dobbo800 » 20 Mar 2018, 11:18am

Not sure how you define 'road bike'. My road bike, used for commuting, is a 2017 Cube Editor which runs an 11-speed Alfine and belt drive.

https://www.cube.eu/cz/2018/bikes/trekk ... ange-2018/

I changed the seat, grips and pedals (off my old BMC) and fitted full mudguards. It's an excellent commuter which requires very little maintenance. I'm very pleased with it. The Alfine will take a little getting used to as you must release pressure, slightly, from the pedals as you change gear. This results in very smooth and very quiet changes (just the clicking of the bar lever). Being able to change into any of the 11 gears when stationary and pull away without any drama, is both handy and novel. The combination of the Alfine and belt drive make for a very quiet bike - other riders are amazed at how silent it is.

Cheers

Roadster
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Re: Internal hub geared bikes

Postby Roadster » 21 Mar 2018, 1:55pm

I'm not convinced that your Alfine with belt drive is any quieter than my Alfine with chain drive, Dobbo, despite your drivetrain being a lot more expensive than mine. Belt drive may have certain advantages (e.g. cleanliness, lower maintenance) over chain drive, but being significantly quieter isn't one of them.

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RickH
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Re: Internal hub geared bikes

Postby RickH » 21 Mar 2018, 2:52pm

Mrs H decided to get a bike last year & ended up getting hers from Temple Cycles in Bristol. Hers is the ladies lightweight with a 1x9 derailleur setup but they do an alfine 8 model as well. They seem to be well made bikes with a reasonable choice of components. I don't know if the spec/clearances are still the same (they look closer on the photos on the website, you'd have to check) but there was clearance with the Tektro 559 callipers fitted on Mrs H's to fit 38mm Vittoria Voyager Hypers in place of the supplied 28mm tyres which both shaved off a little weight & improved the comfort.

"Road bike" often implies drop bars which is not an easy option out of the box with the Alfine unless you go for the Di2 version, although there are other ways around that issue if need be.

Roadster
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Re: Internal hub geared bikes

Postby Roadster » 21 Mar 2018, 4:58pm

Yes, "Road bike" usually means "Road Racing bike", and hub gears are much more commonly found on what are now called "Hybrid" bikes. These are increasingly being offered with the choice between drop bar and flat bar versions and it's wise to decide on the right version for you before purchase.
That Temple Lightweight Premium cited by Rick looks very good to me and I wouldn't mind owning one myself!

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mjr
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Re: Internal hub geared bikes

Postby mjr » 21 Mar 2018, 5:35pm

More common on roadsters, town/city/Dutch bikes and e-bikes than hybrids, aren't they?
MJR, mostly pedalling 3-speed roadsters. KL+West Norfolk BUG incl social easy rides http://www.klwnbug.co.uk
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Roadster
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Re: Internal hub geared bikes

Postby Roadster » 21 Mar 2018, 6:22pm

Well, more or less commonly found on hybrid, roadster, town/city/Dutch, shopping, utility bikes but the point is, not commonly found on "Road" bikes.

Brucey
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Re: Internal hub geared bikes

Postby Brucey » 22 Mar 2018, 12:09am

FWIW you can make a sporty bike with an IGH by taking a fixed gear/singlespeed bike and whacking a hub gear into it. For some hub gears you have to alter the frame spacing, for others you don't.

cheers
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amediasatex
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Re: Internal hub geared bikes

Postby amediasatex » 22 Mar 2018, 9:46am

FWIW you can make a sporty bike with an IGH by taking a fixed gear/singlespeed bike and whacking a hub gear into it.


Sounds remarkably like going full circle back to 'English Clubman' style bikes of the first half of last century. A sporty steel lightweight frame, but with tyre clearance, guard mounts and an IGH, adaptable enough for commuting, club rides and weekend racing with the accessories removed, a good old proper bike ;-)

Would love to see a bit more of revival of this kind of thing but modernised, more than 3speed IGH, modern components and possibly even 'other' frame materials. I think they'd be ideal for a lot of uses, but sadly I still think they'd do poorly in the market place as club riding and racing has reached the point where specialised bikes are seen as a necessary requirement now.

Anyway, OP, I think the bars and shifter conundrum are one you need to decide on first as it can greatly sway the available options if you have a strong preference either way. also, tell us what you mean by 'road bike', the definition is quite wide and flexible.

pete75
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Re: Internal hub geared bikes

Postby pete75 » 22 Mar 2018, 10:59am

amediasatex wrote:
FWIW you can make a sporty bike with an IGH by taking a fixed gear/singlespeed bike and whacking a hub gear into it.


Sounds remarkably like going full circle back to 'English Clubman' style bikes of the first half of last century. A sporty steel lightweight frame, but with tyre clearance, guard mounts and an IGH, adaptable enough for commuting, club rides and weekend racing with the accessories removed, a good old proper bike ;-)

Would love to see a bit more of revival of this kind of thing but modernised, more than 3speed IGH, modern components and possibly even 'other' frame materials. I think they'd be ideal for a lot of uses, but sadly I still think they'd do poorly in the market place as club riding and racing has reached the point where specialised bikes are seen as a necessary requirement now.

Anyway, OP, I think the bars and shifter conundrum are one you need to decide on first as it can greatly sway the available options if you have a strong preference either way. also, tell us what you mean by 'road bike', the definition is quite wide and flexible.


The famous Raleigh Lenton for example - obviously meant as a multi purpose machine.

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Brucey
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Re: Internal hub geared bikes

Postby Brucey » 22 Mar 2018, 11:19am

My own hack/training bike is a more modern interpretation of the same idea, but it is built around an old frame that was originally fitted with 5s derailleur gears.

Unfortunately modern derailleur frames tend to have a very wide OLN, vertical dropouts, and unless carefully designed, cannot accept a narrow chainline either. All of which makes them less useful for IGHs, with the possible exception of Alfines, Rolhloff etc provided you are happy to run a tensioner.

A fixed/singlespeed frame usually makes a better home for a medium complexity IGH. The installation can be made neat by having the shifter under the saddle (which isn't as bad as it sounds if you have relatively few gears on offer) and the rear-facing dropouts can be made workable for wheel changes by using secu-clips or something similar to provide a QD action for the mudguard. PX pompino and Holdsworth la Quelda models are suitable for this kind of treatment.

BTW my own bike has two gear levers, a 5s hub and usually has two manually selectable gear ranges of 5s (i.e. 10 in total); a 22"-53" low range and a 40"-100" high range. This is configured such that there is a trivial weight increase, no tensioner required, and no reduction in gear efficiency. I plan to add a third gear lever and make the range shiftable via a mech.

Also, one of my cunning plans (on a long list...) is to rework an SA 3s hub to include roller bearings on the planet pinions; this ought to make the whole business of using gear 3 as the 'normal' gear more efficient.

cheers
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dobbo800
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Re: Internal hub geared bikes

Postby dobbo800 » 22 Mar 2018, 12:41pm

Roadster wrote:I'm not convinced that your Alfine with belt drive is any quieter than my Alfine with chain drive, Dobbo, despite your drivetrain being a lot more expensive than mine. Belt drive may have certain advantages (e.g. cleanliness, lower maintenance) over chain drive, but being significantly quieter isn't one of them.


Where in my post did I claim my alfine/belt combo is significantly quieter than your alfine/chain combo? :D I chose belt drive exactly because it is low maintenance and I can jump on my bike without having to worry about getting oil on my clothes. Cleaning the bike is a lot easier, too. In terms of noise, all I know is that when I ride alongside bikes fitted with chains and external gears my bike is eerily silent. One downside I've noticed is I get more pedestrians stepping of pavements in front of me.

I ride to commute. My bike is a tool to get me from A to B, like a car or a bus or a train. My current set up suits me fine and gets the job done.

Cheers

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barrym
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Re: Internal hub geared bikes

Postby barrym » 22 Mar 2018, 2:24pm

The noise from a chain and derailleur can be more or less depending on the lube used. I remember using a dry wax once and had gotten used to the noise. Had to use some regular motor oil in an emergency and it was transformed! Picked up loads of dirt though which reminded me why I'd used the wax.

How I lust after a belt drive. One day....
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Cheers
Barry

Roadster
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Re: Internal hub geared bikes

Postby Roadster » 22 Mar 2018, 4:58pm

dobbo800 wrote:Where in my post did I claim my alfine/belt combo is significantly quieter than your alfine/chain combo?

It was where you wrote, "The combination of the Alfine and belt drive make for a very quiet bike". The quietness of your bike is not due to the combination of the Alfine and belt drive, but to the Alfine hub alone.

It hardly needs saying that a poorly or inadequately lubricated chain will be noisier than a well lubricated one. The well lubricated chain on my Alfine-equipped bike runs silently and a belt would confer no advantage in that particular regard.