Legally Can you Cycle on the A77?

General cycling advice ( NOT technical ! )
thirdcrank
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Re: Legally Can you Cycle on the A77?

Post by thirdcrank »

a01020304 wrote: ... I ask this as TomTom maps are adament this is classified as a Motorway status the whole way. ...


If it was a motorway, it would have an "M" classification, like the nearby M77.

Not being a motorway does not mean, however, that cycling is always allowed on a road. The official term for motorways is "special roads" and there are a few special roads which do not have M classification. AFAIK, at least part of the A55 in North Wales is a special road. Otherwise, cycling can be banned on a road by the use of a traffic regulation order (TRO) which would be made clear with NO CYCLING signs.
a01020304
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Re: Legally Can you Cycle on the A77?

Post by a01020304 »

BigFoz wrote:BTW - meant to ask - why do you need to know? If taking a trip down that way, there are some epic rides (including parts of the Ayrshire alps ) slightly inland that would take you to the same destinations (Ayr / Girvan / Stranraer etc) and would be both a quieter and much nicer ride.


because the map is wrong and i am trying to tell them that
i agree its not best to ride on however maps should be accurate and not have restrictions that do not exist
Cyril Haearn
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Re: Legally Can you Cycle on the A77?

Post by Cyril Haearn »

I do wish people would use 'can' and 'may' correctly :?
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Vorpal
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Re: Legally Can you Cycle on the A77?

Post by Vorpal »

Cyril Haearn wrote:I do wish people would use 'can' and 'may' correctly :?

Like it or not, 'can' now means 'may'. May has almost fallen out of use, especially for those under 50. I've given up telling my children, they don't and won't use it. It's not used on television or film. It's not taught in school, and most teachers don't use or insist on 'may'.

I think if you look up definitions of both words, 'be permitted to' is under both.
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AdamS
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Re: Legally Can you Cycle on the A77?

Post by AdamS »

thirdcrank wrote:Not being a motorway does not mean, however, that cycling is always allowed on a road. The official term for motorways is "special roads" and there are a few special roads which do not have M classification. AFAIK, at least part of the A55 in North Wales is a special road. Otherwise, cycling can be banned on a road by the use of a traffic regulation order (TRO) which would be made clear with NO CYCLING signs.

All traffic which is prohibited should be signed, even on a 'special road'. Here's an example from the A55 https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@53.28072 ... 312!8i6656
OT, but note the 70mph speed limit signs in the picture. The national speed limit does not apply to special roads.
The 'start of motorway regulations' sign does both these jobs for motorways.

(At the ripe old age of 31 I mostly use 'can' and 'may' interchangeably. My wfe is careful not to say "can I get" instead of "may I have" when I'm in earshot. That really does sound horrible to my ears!)
mercalia
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Re: Legally Can you Cycle on the A77?

Post by mercalia »

I may be able to do some thing and I can do it?
AdamS
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Re: Legally Can you Cycle on the A77?

Post by AdamS »

I think you meant something rather than some thing :)
(Perhaps there ought to be a grammar sub-forum/ghetto)
Cyril Haearn
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Re: Legally Can you Cycle on the A77?

Post by Cyril Haearn »

AdamS wrote:I think you meant something rather than some thing :)
(Perhaps there ought to be a grammar sub-forum/ghetto)

+1, to collect scattered material
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Cyril Haearn
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Re: Legally Can you Cycle on the A77?

Post by Cyril Haearn »

Vorpal wrote:
Cyril Haearn wrote:I do wish people would use 'can' and 'may' correctly :?

Like it or not, 'can' now means 'may'. May has almost fallen out of use, especially for those under 50. I've given up telling my children, they don't and won't use it. It's not used on television or film. It's not taught in school, and most teachers don't use or insist on 'may'.

I think if you look up definitions of both words, 'be permitted to' is under both.

Hej Vorpal
Neither you nor I live in English-speaking countries, +2!
In German I insist on using 'kann' & 'darf' correctly, how is it in Norwegian?
Venligst bp :wink:

PS how *may* one convey in English the idea of something being possible but not allowed?
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David9694
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Re: Legally Can you Cycle on the A77?

Post by David9694 »

Apart from the handful of exceptions already mentioned, where a traffic regulation order is in placeprohiting cycling, the A77 irrespective of the number of lanes or speed limit or Tomtom is open to all traffic. I couldn’t see anything different on s quick Google Street cruise where it changes from motorway to A road. My Nissan built in Satnav sometimes tries to route me down gravel tracks in country areas.

Appreciating that you’re likely to be toast if mr lorry driver has found something more interesting to watch than the road, and given similar traffic volumes isn’t a dually safer in that there’s more road space for motor vehicles to overtake, than on some winding old A road where your overtaker is going to meet oncoming, as suddenly it’s ok to pass on a blind bend or the brow of a hill?
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bogmyrtle
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Re: Legally Can you Cycle on the A77?

Post by bogmyrtle »

If I put Fenwick to Portpatrick in the driving option into Google maps, the instruction is "get on the M77 from Skernieland Rd" The next command is "Continue to Stranraer" and then "Follow the A77 to St Patrick Street in Portpatrick".

OP, is this what you are talking about?
If so, this isn't saying the whole road is motorway. If you head south on the M77 no further instruction is required because the M77 takes you onto the A77 without any manoeuvres.

If you put Fenwick to Portpatrick in the Google cycle option, into as you would expect, it doesn't direct you onto the M77 at the start.

What happens if you reverse the route on Tomtom? Bet it doesn't mention motorway at all.

It looks to me that TomTom is for driving and not reliable for cycling but I don't believe it is wrong.
Last edited by bogmyrtle on 7 Apr 2018, 9:16am, edited 2 times in total.
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BigFoz
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Re: Legally Can you Cycle on the A77?

Post by BigFoz »

Indeed the M77 ends at Fenwick, with some celebratory huge potholes, and goes back to being the A77, all the way down, so technically you wouldn't need to leave the motorway as it simply becomes the A77 at its end. If coming north on a bike, at the point it becomes the M77. there is a parallel A77 with a huge cycle track that runs all the way to Glasgow. Likewise you can follow the A77 all the way from Glasgow to Portpatrick if you wish, though the first 5-6miles is traffic light heaven.
largeallan
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Re: Legally Can you Cycle on the A77?

Post by largeallan »

Why anyone in their right mind would want to cycle on there is beyond me.....The same goes for the M8 where it does a similar thing by changing into the A8 between Langbank and Port Glasgow. I see cyclists on there regularly and think they must have a slate loose. I don't speak for anyone else, but I personally would rather be alive than exercising my legal right of way, while being bypassed at 90mph by folk who are more interested in their smartphones than the road ahead. I would consider myself to be pretty confident among traffic, but I draw the line on roads that are Motorway in all but name.
BigFoz
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Re: Legally Can you Cycle on the A77?

Post by BigFoz »

Ah, that is the main WoS TT course - start at the roundabout where the M8 becomes the A8, runs down towards Greenock. 10 and 25 courses. Regularly used on Sunday mornings. And compared the F1 series courses in North Herts / Beds / Cambs on the A1, it's very peaceful. Even though it's busy by Scottish standards...
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