Any feedback about Hilltrek Kintail Shirt?

[thirdcrank]

I've searched through several threads which have comments about both Hilltrek and Ventile, but I can't find anything specific about this shirt.

https://hilltrek.co.uk/clothing/shirts- ... ail-shirt/

I'm thinking of getting one for outdoor wear of a general, not very strenuous kind. I'd be grateful to hear if anybody has experience of this garment, both any general comments and also these points:

It has stud fasteners rather than buttons. Have these been durable? With other fabrics, I've occasionally had studs tearing away from the fabric.

How accurate is the sizing? eg As expected, larger than expected. I know stuff bought mail order can be returned but I like to get it right first time.

Any comments on the difference between the L24 and L34 weaves?

I appreciate that Ventile needs the right washing, but as a shirt will be washed more frequently than a jacket, does it involve a lot of faffing if the shirt is not to deteriorate?

[Tinnishill]

I used a lot of ventile in the 80's . I had a contact in the factory and was getting samples, test pieces and rejects for free. This wasn't Hilltreck's stuff. It didn't work well in the UK climate. When damp it goes board stiff and scratchy. Trousers and shirts were particularly uncomfortable. Think serious chaffing. I still have a big parka which is very good in snow, but poor in rain. For shirt and trousers I would go with Craghoppers type poly cotton.

From Hilltrek's current range I would buy the gaiters and mitts for mountaineering use.

Cheers.

[andrew_s]

I use to have ventile trousers and parka when in the Antarctic (many years ago).
They were fine there, but as Tinnishill says, when they get wet, the material goes stiff (and heavy), though it's fine when dry.

Ventile is just (very) tight weave cotton, so I wouldn't expect much deterioration on washing.

Think about whether it is actually what you want.
It is effectively completely windproof, except for design holes, between the buttons/studs. It will fend off rain well, at the expense of stiffness, but the layer beneath will be touching the wet/damp cotton ventile, so won't remain completely dry (which is why anything that's intended to be properly waterproof is double ventile). The windproofing means air circulation is restricted, so you'd sweat more.
I'd expect the lighter version to be less waterproof, and you may get some penetration in heavier rain, especially initially, before the fibres swelled.

I'd use it as an outer layer for hill walking, to add some windproofing and avoid waterproofs for possible occasional showers.

I've other stuff with plastic studs rather than buttons (Patagonia fleece shirt, Paramo shirt), and they've been fine for several (~10) years. Obviously, if there is a problem, it's more difficult to do anything about it compared with sewing a new button on.

[tatanab]

I have one of their near copies of a Greenspot Nomad. It is pretty stiff, but it is double Ventile versus the shirt which I imagine is single. It is a lot stiffer than I remember the Nomad in Poplin or Gaberdine. It is a nice jacket, although I think not really suitable for cycling - mostly because of the stiffness. Size - I am 5ft 8in with 36 chest, so bought a small (I am sure I was medium in Greenspot) which is a generous fit. Generous enough that I can wear a down gilet under it easily if I wanted to.

I found Hilltrek excellent to deal with. When I placed my order, about May last year, the boss man got straight back to me to say that they were so busy that pretty much everything was made to order with no stock held. He held delivery until I was back from holiday, and phoned to make sure I was back too.

[slowster]

I have one of their near copies of a Greenspot Nomad. It is pretty stiff, but it is double Ventile versus the shirt which I imagine is single. It is a lot stiffer than I remember the Nomad in Poplin or Gaberdine. It is a nice jacket, although I think not really suitable for cycling - mostly because of the stiffness.

Hilltrek now make a single layer version of the Greenspot jacket (https://hilltrek.co.uk/clothing/jackets/greenspot-sv-light-jacket/), which I suspect is more like the originals. The original Greenspot Nomad jacket was never intended to be a waterproof jacket. It was a highly breathable windproof jacket made of a natural fibre with a wide comfort range, over which cyclists would put on a cape if was raining. Greenspot did briefly make a Goretex version of the Nomad before they ceased trading, but it was not very successful and lacked sealed/taped seams.

I would not buy a double Ventile jacket, especially not for its waterproof qualities because they come at the price of slow drying and stiffness. However, I might buy a single layer jacket for its windproof qualities, for the greater comfort and better appearance of cotton compared with nylon (and of natural fibres compared with synthetics generally), and for the wider comfort/useability range. Hilltrek themselves describe it as 'a warm weather/commuting cycle jacket', but it should be suitable for cold weather by judicious choice of insulating layers underneath as well as being suitable for warmer weather than double Ventile.

[tatanab]

Hilltrek now make a single layer version of the Greenspot jacket (https://hilltrek.co.uk/clothing/jackets/greenspot-sv-light-jacket/), which I suspect is more like the originals.

The reason I did not buy one of those is because of the collar shape. I agree it seems closer to the original, but I am happy enough because I wanted a jacket for winter pedestrian uses.

Greenspot did briefly make a Goretex version of the Nomad before they ceased trading, but it was not very successful and lacked sealed/taped seams.

I had one in the early/mid 80s, but it delaminated and was replaced without much fuss. It was superseded by another material, Aquatex I think, which was their final offering. I was certainly using an Aquatex one into the very late 80s or early 90s.

[deliquium]

Not able to comment on the specific Kintail shirt - but can offer feedback on the single Ventile Greenspot jacket, which one assumes is a different grade/weight of 'Ventile' to the Kintail?

https://hilltrek.co.uk/clothing/jackets ... ht-jacket/

if at all helpful?

What I do know is dealing with Hilltrek was a pleasure

. . . but not at all sure or convinced about any 'merits' of the material itself, after 6+months (cycling) and attempting to maintain it and keep it clean without faff and expense And as others have posted, it gets stiff when wet + heavier

[thirdcrank]

Thanks for all the advice. Bearing in mind it's the sort of thing I often post, this is important:

... Think about whether it is actually what you want. ...

For weatherproof outdoor togs I'm a Goretex and Windstopper fetishist. I've more than enough for every sort of occasion and then some to spare. I've posted before that I have some Ventile trousers, a snip in TKMaxx at a tenner, down from £300. I've been wearing them this week for what I rather pretentiously call gardening, which mainly consists of getting my thorny hedges under some sort of control: the graveyard of anything depending on a membrane. They are excellent for that but I don't stand about with the loppers in a downpour. I suppose I was looking for an excuse to buy the shirt on a whim. FWIW, while browsing more widely for info, I found this trenchant criticism of just about everything to do with Ventile.

http://welldresseddad.com/2017/05/20/ve ... -tell-you/

[Graham]

Thank you all for this topic. You have helped me avoid an expensive mistake. . . .
I can now move on to my next one

[thirdcrank]

I've been unable to resist the temptation. Following a suggestion higher up I've bought a Greenspot Single Ventile jacket in the lighter weight L34 fabric. I cannot imagine having a shirt made from that fabric. My favourable review of the jacket is here:

viewtopic.php?f=18&t=130184

[Lance Dopestrong]

Just a word on price...I get my regular shirts tailored to fit me because of my chest size, and they don't cost £105 each! I know the fabric is a special weave and all that malarkey, but even so that's a touch pricy.

[Bmblbzzz]

I have one of their near copies of a Greenspot Nomad. It is pretty stiff, but it is double Ventile versus the shirt which I imagine is single. It is a lot stiffer than I remember the Nomad in Poplin or Gaberdine. It is a nice jacket, although I think not really suitable for cycling - mostly because of the stiffness. Size - I am 5ft 8in with 36 chest, so bought a small (I am sure I was medium in Greenspot) which is a generous fit. Generous enough that I can wear a down gilet under it easily if I wanted to.

I found Hilltrek excellent to deal with. When I placed my order, about May last year, the boss man got straight back to me to say that they were so busy that pretty much everything was made to order with no stock held. He held delivery until I was back from holiday, and phoned to make sure I was back too.

I have one of these jackets too and I agree with all tatanab says, except I'm not in a position to compare to the original Greenspot.

[thirdcrank]

One of the things for me has been not being able to try on before buying. That's normal with mail order of course, unless you are a serial returner of stuff, but with widely sold items you can see them in the shops or in use. The only double ventile garments I've seen "in the flesh" in recent years have been the Country Innovations ones, sold at some RSPB reserves to Bill Oddy types. Ideal for whiling away the time in the cold and wet waiting for a KitKat moment but never a cycling jacket.

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PS In my queries above I asked about cleaning. I'm now even more confused because the sewn-in instructions say dry clean only, but Hilltrek's own swing ticket says to use only Nikwax products for washing.

[Bmblbzzz]

I think you can wash it in a machine but best send Hilltrek an email asking about it.