A reasonable walking GPS that's good for cycling too?

[andrew_s]

The issue of mapping is important I think, especially when using for both walking and cycling. I prefer OS mapping for walking but I think some form of vector mapping is more versatile for cycling, especially on a device with a small screen. The advantage of most Garmin devices is that you can have both types maps. You can even store them on different cards.

OS mapping would normally come on an SD card.
I believe that it's tied to the physical card, so you can't copy it to a different card and have it work, and a Garmin will only take one card.
Swapping cards regularly is an invitation to lose a card, so you'll probably want to use OS maps from the card, and keep the OSM vector maps on internal memory.
If you can get the maps by download, you'll almost certainly have to register them to the GPS you put them on.

I believe that Harvey maps are only available for the Satmap GPS, and various smartphone apps such as Viewranger.

[Mick F]

Copy as a many maps onto the SD card as you want. Garmin maps can be copied easily.
https://www.gpsurl.com/garmin-s-softwar ... nlock.html

My SD card is 8Gb, but you can get bigger ones of course.

I have Garmin City Navigator Whole of Europe plus Garmin Discoverer (OS maps) for Great Britain, plus an OSM.
Also a dozen or more waypoints stored on it.

8Gb with 690Mb available.

My Montana had a fault after years of use, and returned it to Garmin and they sold me a replacement for £180. My SD card went straight in and my maps are working fine.

[pwa]

So far as the actual maps go, 50k does cycling nicely but ideally you want 25k Explorer for walking. I have walked with 50k Landranger and it is better than nothing, but when you really need to know which side of a hedge you are meant to be walking 50k doesn't work. A 50k gps map used in conjunction with a 25k Explorer paper map does work, but is more stuff in your hands.

[Mick F]

This is a screen shot from my Montana with the OS map.
Screen size is 4" tall. ie a bit bigger than the size here.

[Tangled Metal]

I'm planning on carrying maps again too because I've started to try and train my 6 year old in navigation techniques. Since we've always walked in areas I've known well (for about 90% of our walks at least) I had stopped carrying maps or navigation kit of any kind.

I know that's bad but with a young child you're not going to get into much difficulty and I really know the lakes quite well. Forgotten more of it than most people get to know I reckon. If I've not been on a path I've seen it from another nearby.

So I'm going to get into better habits when walking. Map, compass and GPS. The cycling bit is about not being tied to charging my edge 25 bike GPS. I figure a hiking GPS is a good option.

Satmap gps units come bundled with bike bracket. At one time they were considered the best GPS units you could buy. But that was before Garmin got os I reckon. Now it seems people just recommend Garmin units.

[AMMoffat]

Just found a good site for information. They carry out GPS training courses but also sell units. Good reviews and recommendations.

One point they made is bundled mapping. It is cheaper to buy mapping with the unit. For example full UK 50k mapping bought with the GPS might cost £50 or separately £200. Apparently some GPS units aren't sold bundled with mapping. I think the etrex 20x/30x don't come bundled but etrex touch 25/35 do ss do the Montana and iirc oregon units too. The touch range have 3 axis electronic compass.

It looks like the touch range or Montana one fit larger screen. Depends on what I want to spend I guess.

If the site you've found is GPS Training then I'd recommend them. I got my Montana from them. Not the cheapest but I got 2 free training seminars from them plus a years access to their considerable training resources. They also run site-based training courses at various locations around the country.

With regards to your later post, a GPS unit, even with excellent screen/mapping, is not a substitute for a map and compass (and knowing how to use them), especially when walking, or cycling, in remote areas. Don't be like the person I met once who had his GPS route (which was more or less just a line with very sketchy mapping background) all planned out without noticing the cliff 2/3 of the way along his route which he'd have happily walked off if the visibility had been bad but for whoever would have had to scrape him off the ground.

[Tangled Metal]

Trust me I'm not that kind of guy. I'm mid forties and have been walking in the countryside since probably 5 years old. I've been reading maps from before joining cubs. I'm a firm believer in paper maps (or more recently the plastic ones) as the best navigation tool you can have. Second only to your own knowledge and experience.

However when you know the streets around your house you don't need a street map to get around. In my case the places we walk I could probably navigate in anything except complete whiteout or fog without map or compass. When I'm there on the ground something triggers the memory of the routes and terrain around the area. I might not describe the area well away from it but on the spot I do recall it.

So I've got complacent and simply don't even think of packing maps. I want to get out of that habit or my son might not get the good habits. IMHO map, compass and GPS skills are something kids need to learn you can't leave tech out of their training in the modern age. So I want a unit that's good enough.

[freeflow]

freeflow wrote:
Your smart phone?

IMHO never a good answer. Especially if your smartphone is a few years old like mine is with non-replaceable and aging battery. Even so if you're using your GPS on a tour or backpack with limited charging capability you don't want to waste phone charge on gps use IMHO

We obviously have different experiences. My 3 year old phone runs fine when Navigating by GPS. It will allow a 100km Audax if fully charged at the start (6 hours worth of navigation) with the screen on and it is the screen that takes 90% of the power. Last weekend, I rode 221km on a 200km Audax. The battery pack powered my phone for 9.5 hours before I needed to swap batteries in the battery pack. My Phone charge was down to 95% at that stage.

IMHO you would be much better off spending your money on a new smartphone and battery packs with replaceable batteries rather than a Montana.

[Mick F]

Is your phone waterproof?
Can you operate it wearing thick warm gloves?
Will it go for fifteen hours without the faff of battery packs?
Can you drop it and it bounces?

If so, you could be correct.
If not, you're wrong.

[freeflow]

Is your phone waterproof?

No, and it doesn't need to be. If I need waterprooofness I use a mk1 plastic bag. The phone holder on the bike allows this very easily and doesn't prevent me from simultaneously connecting to the battery pack.

Can you operate it wearing thick warm gloves?

If the gloves have a suitable fingertip then yes. But generally its not needed whilst I'm navigating so really this is a moot question.

Will it go for fifteen hours without the faff of battery packs?

When it was new almost. I can extend the 6 hours considerable by turning of mobile data and and the screen and just using voice navigation. I have completed a double Audax RTTY (which included rides longer than 200km) using an older phone with similar sets ups with very little problems. I am aware of the devices limitation's and am happy to work within that scope.

Can you drop it and it bounces?

For the majority of the time, yes. I dropped my phone twice this morning for example. The phone lives in a close fitting plastic case that covers the salient bits of the back and sides of the phone but not the screen. When navigating on the bike it is firmly attached in its holder, no chance of it dropping out. If the phone bounces in that configuration you can guarantee my focus will be on things other than the phone

[Mick F]

There's some No's there.
This thread is for walking and cycling.

If you need to keep your pride and joy in a plazzy bag to protect it from the weather, and you need "special" gloves to operate it, then a mobile phone isn't the complete answer.

I reckon that you are better having different tools for different uses.
Phones for text and phone calls with internet access.
GPS devices for GPS issues like navigating or following routes.

Mix and match with versatility perhaps?
I rarely leave home without my iPhone, but it's kept in a pocket and I have to take a glove off to operate it.

[thelawnet]

I have quite a bit of experience with using a phone as GPS.

On one occasion I was coming back at duskish, got a puncture, the darkness closed in and basically the way I had come was sort of following the river round a bend but you had to go the left side of a ditch and then down a bank.

Anyway what happened was :

Torrential monsoon rain
No phone signal


It was impossible to use the phone in the rain because it was so heavy and I had nothing that was dry no clothing nothing. Everything was soaked.

Eventually it did calm down a bit but we had to get across a now rather swollen river.

Another time the problem was a faulty power bank in the middle of nowhere with no idea the right way out and a flat phone.

Anyway you can mitigate this with downloaded maps and perhaps a better selection of apps, but IME when there is rain and sweat even unlocking a phone is very difficult.

I think dedicated gpses can be rubbish in their own ways but I would hesitate to say phones work perfectly either

[freeflow]

This thread is for walking and cycling.

I never said or recommended anything that wasn't consistent with that sentiment.

If you need to keep your pride and joy in a plazzy bag to protect it from the weather, and you need "special" gloves to operate it, then a mobile phone isn't the complete answer.

A bit like paper maps then. In this case its just selecting the type of waterproofing I'm happy with and understanding the limitations/benefits. An Audax RTTY means riding 200km every month of the year. As for needing special gloves that's definitely not what I said,. They are available but not needed as I don't need to adjust my phone whilst I'm navigating on the bike.

reckon that you are better having different tools for different uses.
Phones for text and phone calls with internet access.
GPS devices for GPS issues like navigating or following routes.

The phone comes with GPS built in so it is a GPS device. It may take some additional consideration to use it as such in some environments but its still a GPS device.

but it's kept in a pocket and I have to take a glove off to operate it.

Similarly, if I want to use my phone as a phone or internet device whilst navigating then I stop and if needed remove the phone from the holder and take off my gloves.

Torrential monsoon rain
No phone signal

Very likely no GPS signal either.

Another time the problem was a faulty power bank in the middle of nowhere with no idea the right way out and a flat phone.

Just like finding out you forgot to pack your spare batteries.

but IME when there is rain and sweat even unlocking a phone is very difficult.

And a paper map is immune to these conditions, how?

Seriously guys, I've never met so many negative views to the proposal of a simple alternative. I now have 6 years+ of navigating Audax by smartphone and I don't recognise any of the challenges put forward as showstoppers, just management of circumstances. Like putting your paper map in a map holder or waiting to phone home until you find a public phone box (not likely these days I'll admit but its the sentiment that counts).

[Tangled Metal]

It's obviously personal choice. I prefer to use a phone for the communication aspects of modern life and a modern GPS unit for navigation. If a phone works out for you with your battery packs, plastic bags, etip style gloves and phone holders great.

I own an early version of the GPS6x range without mapping just a breadcrumb. Tbh I didn't use it much. With mapping it'll only be a confirmation look most of the time for hiking. For cycling it will probably be used for touring. Although most tours don't have routes. We turn up and guess which way to go. At least last tour we set off with maps.

Gostraining website is where I've been looking for more information. Their recommendation is Garmin oregon 700 or etrex touch 25 for budget.

[freeflow]

I got turned off dedicated GPS due to the internal contacts between the battery and electronics in my then Garmin 305 started fatiguing which led to disconnections everytime I went over a bumpy bit of the road, and by being tied into a specific website to upload routes to a Bryton 650(?).