why the 'what three words' TV ad is so annoying?

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Will
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Re: why the 'what three words' TV ad is so annoying?

Postby Will » 27 Aug 2020, 3:47pm

simonineaston wrote:
This work could have been carried out by the open source community and the word dictionary would then be open to everyone, but it wasn't, so it isn't.
Ah good-old hind-sight! Being a successful entrepreneur means spotting a gap (or making one up...), developing a solution and then bringing it to market. The system of patents is the key to making sure third-parties don't leap on all the hard-work and simpy replicate it. How does one patent a digital idea?


Like this:

http://patft1.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Par ... PN/9883333

Will

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simonineaston
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Re: why the 'what three words' TV ad is so annoying?

Postby simonineaston » 27 Aug 2020, 3:58pm

Scimmed that. Jeppers - no wonder patent law has a reputation for being expensive...
byyeee,
SiE

Will
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Re: why the 'what three words' TV ad is so annoying?

Postby Will » 27 Aug 2020, 4:18pm

simonineaston wrote:Scimmed that. Jeppers - no wonder patent law has a reputation for being expensive...

I developed a security tool a number of years ago and the company I was working for patented it. The patent was about 10 times longer than the code I wrote, and I barely understood it myself.

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Mick F
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Re: why the 'what three words' TV ad is so annoying?

Postby Mick F » 27 Aug 2020, 7:01pm

simonineaston wrote:b) those who think the benefit sounds good can pay for it.

I keep asking, and you, and others, have not answered it.

It is FREE to use.

I can tell you where I am, and you can see where I am.
Zero money changes hands.

How and why does anyone need to pay?

Where was I?
retrieves.annoys.swinging
Did you have to pay to see where I was?

No you didn't.
Mick F. Cornwall

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Re: why the 'what three words' TV ad is so annoying?

Postby simonineaston » 27 Aug 2020, 7:26pm

I keep asking, and you, and others, have not answered it.
It is FREE to use.
Oh No It's Not (audience - Oh Yes It Is!) Oh No Its Not (audience - Oh Yes It is!) etc.etc., as long as cast can keep it going...
Their own explanation of the business model
TechRadar's explanation
and Wired
Standard approach, called freemium, where individuals get to use the product for free, businesses pay and get additional features.
That's it, I'm done.
byyeee,
SiE

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mjr
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Re: why the 'what three words' TV ad is so annoying?

Postby mjr » 27 Aug 2020, 7:36pm

Will wrote:[Populating the word dictionary] could have been carried out by the open source community and the word dictionary would then be open to everyone, but it wasn't, so it isn't.

It has been, repeatedly, with slightly different spins on the dictionary, with w3w using DMCA takedown notices and other similar proceedings to get rid of them. Some of the less threatening, less useful ones like http://www.what3emojis.com survive for now.

The mostly likely outcome for the investors to make a profit (or even just get their investment back) is for it to be adopted by commercial companies all over the world (who pay for API key to access the data directly), or for it to be bought out by someone like Amazon. Amazon would be a good fit as it would help them to expand their business into areas where addressing can be an issue (such as in the developing world).

I guess we'll have to wait and see about that - but until then, using it is a gamble.

You clearly have issues with people holding a different view to yourself, and I can only pity you.

Not at all. If I have issues with anything, it's the people spreading misinformation (w3w ain't free, no matter how many times Mick F uses it without being asked for payment) and metaphorically herding others towards the pig pens to be the commodity.
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LittleGreyCat
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Re: why the 'what three words' TV ad is so annoying?

Postby LittleGreyCat » 27 Aug 2020, 7:55pm

Reading through this, I'm not sure that most people will have software on their phones with geolocation features apart from Google Maps.

I'm looking at Google Maps and I don't see any location information apart from a blue dot where I am on the map.

Hmmmm.....if I tap on the dot I do get some information.
Seems to be an XnnX-XX code of some sorts.
So this is the most commonly available location reference (I assume that almost all Android phones and many Apple phones have Google Maps).
Presuming further, I assume that the emergency services would ask you to:
(1) Open Google Maps
(2) Tap on the blue location dot
(3) Read off the location.
I can, however, see that in an emergency situation with someone who was not familiar with this way of finding a location it might take a while to get the end user to manage this.

Hmmmm.....OK {Imagine me installing the W3W App} I've just installed W3W, clicked on the GPS icon, and been given a 3 word code.
I've then gone to the web site what3word.com, put in the 3 words and it has correctly located me.
So it seems to work.

For this to be effective, it seems the user has to have the App already installed?
Hmmm...again.
No, it works on my Android phone if I go to the web site, but this is also a cumbersome way to do things in an emergency and the already discussed issues of talking over the phone might take a while to correctly spell "what3words.com".
[Wotthreewerds you said? Don't seem ter be workin mate.]

OK

For this to be a fast and effective method of locating someone in an emergency with minimum hassle that person has to have W3W App installed, and to be familiar with its operation.
So the publicity is required to persuade people to install the App and try it out.
After that they should be able to (reasonably) quickly get enough information to share their location.

Having done this small bit of testing, I would be interested to know how I could share my location with a button press and/or find for example an OS reference for my location with no previous experience nor some kind of publicity campaign.

Quick conclusion;
Google Maps supplies an alpha-numeric code but a user might have to be coached to find it.
W3W supplies a 3 word code and is straightforward as long as the user has installed the App and used it at least once.

Interested to see a quick walk through of any equally simple methods.
Preferably where they don't require the installation of mapping software (which many people will not have).

For those saying that there are lots of other ways to do this; yes, but do you remember MySpace? Wiped out by Facebook.
There are plenty of alternative to Twitter, but without the same coverage.
There are plenty of alternatives to WhatsApp, but without the same coverage.

For an App to be globally effective it has to have both capability and market dominance.
Saying "but you could do it another way" can be true but relatively pointless.
So unless some other organisation feels the need to mount a publicity campaign to ensure everyone knows how to confirm their location to the emergency services using some other feature/facility/App then W3W seems like a good approach.

I would also be interested in how easy it is to juggle between a voice call and W3W to read the details and then pass them on to the operator.
As I said upstream, I would manage this a lot better using words than using numeric or alpha-numeric strings.

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Re: why the 'what three words' TV ad is so annoying?

Postby LittleGreyCat » 27 Aug 2020, 7:59pm

Mick F wrote:PS

I was here yesterday for an hour.
Where was I?

retrieves.annoys.swinging


Near the River Tamar not far from Gunnislake Station.

Nice spot?

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Mick F
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Re: why the 'what three words' TV ad is so annoying?

Postby Mick F » 27 Aug 2020, 8:54pm

simonineaston wrote:
I keep asking, and you, and others, have not answered it.
It is FREE to use.
Oh No It's Not (audience - Oh Yes It Is!) Oh No Its Not (audience - Oh Yes It is!) etc.etc., as long as cast can keep it going...
Their own explanation of the business model
TechRadar's explanation
and Wired
Standard approach, called freemium, where individuals get to use the product for free, businesses pay and get additional features.
That's it, I'm done.
Still not explained it.

How can you and I need to pay to use a free application?
Sounds to me, like those links show, is that firms will pay ......... but they don't need to.
LittleGreyCat wrote:
Mick F wrote:PS

I was here yesterday for an hour.
Where was I?

retrieves.annoys.swinging


Near the River Tamar not far from Gunnislake Station.

Nice spot?
Yes, nice spot, but I was in the bar of the Rising Sun Inn.
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@50.51881 ... 312!8i6656

Screen Shot 2020-08-27 at 20.52.30.png
Mick F. Cornwall

philvantwo
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Re: why the 'what three words' TV ad is so annoying?

Postby philvantwo » 27 Aug 2020, 9:03pm

I downloaded the app and used it Mick F and I never got charged anything, I couldn't see the point in it myself, if I need to let the Mrs know which Wetherspoons I'm in I just use WhatsApp and I can send a photo of my pint of Abbot ale as well!
:lol: :lol: :lol:

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Mick F
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Re: why the 'what three words' TV ad is so annoying?

Postby Mick F » 27 Aug 2020, 9:06pm

:lol: :lol: :lol:
Exactly that!

No charge, just the price of a pint or three.
Mick F. Cornwall

Navara
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Re: why the 'what three words' TV ad is so annoying?

Postby Navara » 27 Aug 2020, 9:08pm

mjr wrote:Not at all. If I have issues with anything, it's the people spreading misinformation (w3w ain't free, no matter how many times Mick F uses it without being asked for payment) and metaphorically herding others towards the pig pens to be the commodity.

OK so you keep saying.
Show me where I have to pay or have had to pay in all the time I've had the app.Please I'm curious.

I've been on Facebook 11 years and Instagram 4 years.They too a free.....or are you going to also show me where I've paid for them too :?: :roll:

You are accusing others of "trying to drag you" into your imaginary pig-pen yet you think it's OK to name call and ring-fence anyone as some sort of "corporate slave" who doesn't share your,quite frankly verging on paranoid,point of view regarding this app!

We're all "commodities".Fact is if you own a PC/Laptop/tablet/mobilephone/satnav or even a driving licence and passport then all your details are there for the World to see.

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Re: why the 'what three words' TV ad is so annoying?

Postby Mick F » 27 Aug 2020, 9:34pm

Navara wrote:Show me where I have to pay or have had to pay in all the time I've had the app.Please I'm curious.
Show me too.

I can use it endlessly.
Where (and why) do I pay?
Mick F. Cornwall

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Re: why the 'what three words' TV ad is so annoying?

Postby mjr » 28 Aug 2020, 12:26am

Navara wrote:
mjr wrote:Not at all. If I have issues with anything, it's the people spreading misinformation (w3w ain't free, no matter how many times Mick F uses it without being asked for payment) and metaphorically herding others towards the pig pens to be the commodity.

OK so you keep saying.
Show me where I have to pay or have had to pay in all the time I've had the app.Please I'm curious.

I've been on Facebook 11 years and Instagram 4 years.They too a free.....or are you going to also show me where I've paid for them too :?: :roll:

You've almost certainly paid for Facebook, by buying products from companies who advertise with them. Do you not understand how advertising-supported services are ultimately paid for by you?

It's less certain that you've yet paid anything for w3w, unless you've bought a recent Mercedes or something like that, but you might be required to one day. That's a feature of their continued control of the system. That's the point several of us are trying to make, that it's not free just because you've not yet had to pay!

We're all "commodities".Fact is if you own a PC/Laptop/tablet/mobilephone/satnav or even a driving licence and passport then all your details are there for the World to see.

I think that sort of defeatism is quite frankly verging on paranoid. I believe we can keep technology under our control if we choose to - at least for now.
MJR, mostly pedalling 3-speed roadsters. KL+West Norfolk BUG incl social easy rides http://www.klwnbug.co.uk
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Will
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Re: why the 'what three words' TV ad is so annoying?

Postby Will » 28 Aug 2020, 6:43am

mjr wrote:
Will wrote:[Populating the word dictionary] could have been carried out by the open source community and the word dictionary would then be open to everyone, but it wasn't, so it isn't.

It has been, repeatedly, with slightly different spins on the dictionary, with w3w using DMCA takedown notices and other similar proceedings to get rid of them. Some of the less threatening, less useful ones like http://www.what3emojis.com survive for now.


The open source community would have had to invent the method of using a 3 word address to describe a location in order to be able to use that method in a word dictionary. They didn't, What3Words invented it and patented it - The open source community using this patented method in their own implementation is a clear breach of the patent - I am quite frankly surprised that someone who develops software doesn't understand this.


mjr wrote:
Will wrote:
The mostly likely outcome for the investors to make a profit (or even just get their investment back) is for it to be adopted by commercial companies all over the world (who pay for API key to access the data directly), or for it to be bought out by someone like Amazon. Amazon would be a good fit as it would help them to expand their business into areas where addressing can be an issue (such as in the developing world).

I guess we'll have to wait and see about that - but until then, using it is a gamble.


Well, Hermes have now added W3W addresses to their app, so their customers can now add their exact delivery location to their user profile. All sorts of organizations are adopting it, both public and private, large and small, so things are progressing in the right direction for W3W

mjr wrote:
Will wrote:You clearly have issues with people holding a different view to yourself, and I can only pity you.

Not at all. If I have issues with anything, it's the people spreading misinformation (w3w ain't free, no matter how many times Mick F uses it without being asked for payment) and metaphorically herding others towards the pig pens to be the commodity.


You are quite happy to let others who don't like W3W to spread disinformation. Richard Fairhurst posted a totally misleading and factually incorrect interpretation of the venture capital investment model, and not only did you not challenge it, but you also repeated it in one of your own posts.

I think Navara sums it up in a post lower down:

"You are accusing others of "trying to drag you" into your imaginary pig-pen yet you think it's OK to name call and ring-fence anyone as some sort of "corporate slave" who doesn't share your,quite frankly verging on paranoid,point of view regarding this app!"

If you didn't have issues with people holding a different view to yourself then you would play the ball, not the man.

Will