Psamathe wrote:SA_SA_SA wrote:Psamathe wrote:My understanding is that there are two completely separate issues going on. GB has decided to delay import checks (which it can do as a sovereign nation) - because it is "not ready" (customs posts not built). So goods EU into GB wont be properly checked.
Completely separate are the GB/NI checks which were negotiated and UK Government agreed. So it either signed an international treaty without understanding what they were signing (and had negotiated) or they signed in bad faith. Either possibility shows the world the nature of our Government (in an unbelievably bad light). GB/NI is a very special case to address the issues created by NI not being an EU member state but having an open border with an EU member state. So to facilitate such a difficult border special case procedures have been put in place between Gb and NI as negotiated by Johnson/Westminster and as signed and ratified by Johnson/Westminster. So it can't really be compared to borders between EU countries nor with borders between EU and non member states. If Johnson does not like the deal he should not have negotiated nor signed it.
IAn
But the protocol isn't fixed, eg article 16, thats why it has a joint committee, so it was reasonable for the UK government to take the EUs claim to view N Ireland as special, at face value, and assume they(the eu) would, like them, thus interpret the protocol in a reasonable manner, to minimise checks, and respond to problems.
It is the Eu commission that has been acting in bad faith to Northern Ireland. If it was interested in N Irelands well being the eu commissions response to Britain acting to safeguard an internal part of itself wouldnt be legal action, and that after it itself instigated article 16 to block vaccines....
1 We have always known the EU would protect the single market. That's why there were negotiations and an international treaty signed. Dissuasions were ongoing when the UK Government unilaterally decided to announce they were breaking the agreement.
As I see it a large part of the numbers of checks relate to the nature og GB/NI logistics - single lorry with lots of different products/suppliers meaning lots of checks and lots of paperwork. Had the UK Government listened to UK hauliers or had the UK Government understood business practice then they could have negotiated a better deal. But they didn't and now are just spending their time insulting the EU. UK/Westminster negotiated and agreed the deal so it's pretty pathetic when they complain now all caused by their own shortcomings and incompetence.
2 But confusion also comes because this thread is about being in GB and buying products in from the EU - where the UK Gov. has also made a complete pig's ear of a mess and has had to massively extend "no checks" which will put UK business and a bad disadvantage (relative to EU business) - and that's all a UK Gov. failing to prepare for UK being a 3rd country (nothing to do with deals negotiated/signed).
Ian
1 I dont accept that they need so many checks to 'protect' the single market. The point of the ni protocol is to reduce the checks to minimum:
Logically one should therefore minimise checks, monitoring for problems, and deal with them as found hence committee, not presuppose problems and do lots of unnecessary checks. And try to avoid requiring actual paperwork in 2021.
yes the uk could have done without mrs mays non negotiation but the northern ireland protocol is still better than mrs mays one despite the actions of remaining-remainers in. And similarly imo lord frost managed more than could be expected given the antics of rebelling-remainer mps ...
The eu commission deserve criticism over Northern Ireland.
I do not think the Uk are breaking the protocol yet, even if you dissagree wuth lords frosts view, if necessary by april they can use article 16 under its rules, if the Eu commission are going to be awkward about it.
But again that itself undermines their claim to be interested in Northern Ireland above other concerns.
I am glad the Uk acted for the interests of Northern Ireland.
2 it is mid pandemic,
I apologise for going off topic a bit ....anyway it seems
that this thread Op answer amounts to wait and see.