COVID Lockdown - Guidance versus the Law

General cycling advice ( NOT technical ! )
atoz
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Re: COVID Lockdown - Guidance versus the Law

Postby atoz » 10 Jan 2021, 6:24pm

Oldjohnw wrote:I read that the Home Secretary supports the Derbyshire police.

Any possible suggestion that I may have made which might possibly have shown even a modicum of support for them has now, therefore, been withdrawn.

If she supports them, I don't.


One of the 2 people who were fined in Derbyshire has a brother who is a doctor.

thirdcrank
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Re: COVID Lockdown - Guidance versus the Law

Postby thirdcrank » 10 Jan 2021, 6:42pm

There seem to have been quite a few covid-related fixed penalties issued in Derbyshire recently, but AIUI, the two women whose case triggered most of the publicity drove five miles to exercise together in the open air.

Also AIUI they received fixed penalties because somebody in the chain of command in Derbyshire Police decided that visiting the county's open air beauty spots was in itself a breach of the regulations: a blanket ban.

Now, even taking the government's advice as being part-and-parcel of the regulations, I'd struggle to interpret travelling five miles as not being local.

I'm not sure what the Home Secretary and Health Secretary are supporting here, and I fear that they aren't either.

Oldjohnw
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Re: COVID Lockdown - Guidance versus the Law

Postby Oldjohnw » 10 Jan 2021, 6:46pm

Of course the government insists on being vague, but it is hard to imagine that the term "stay local" would stand up to much scrutiny in a court.

If they want to make it strict they should give a specific distance. It might get criticism but at least it would be precise.

I believe Scotland does that.
John

thirdcrank
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Re: COVID Lockdown - Guidance versus the Law

Postby thirdcrank » 10 Jan 2021, 7:11pm

Meanwhile, in other news management

Bench arrest video 'stage-managed by anti-lockdown protestors'

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-dorset-55609185

This seems to show that spin works both ways.

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mjr
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Re: COVID Lockdown - Guidance versus the Law

Postby mjr » 10 Jan 2021, 7:13pm

mattsccm wrote:Surely our collective attitude should not be, "can I get away with it?" but "can I avoid doing it?"

I don't think so because most of our neighbours will decide they can avoid exercise, stay home, stuff their face with junk, get fat, get ill and stress the NHS.

Stay apart but keep fit. It could save your life.
MJR, mostly pedalling 3-speed roadsters. KL+West Norfolk BUG incl social easy rides http://www.klwnbug.co.uk
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mjr
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Re: COVID Lockdown - Guidance versus the Law

Postby mjr » 10 Jan 2021, 7:15pm

Oldjohnw wrote:Of course the government insists on being vague, but it is hard to imagine that the term "stay local" would stand up to much scrutiny in a court.

If they want to make it strict they should give a specific distance. It might get criticism but at least it would be precise.

I believe Scotland does that.

Indeed it does, but to be fair, gov.uk/coronavirus does define "stay local". It is completely unreasonable and impractical, but it is a definition.
MJR, mostly pedalling 3-speed roadsters. KL+West Norfolk BUG incl social easy rides http://www.klwnbug.co.uk
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Jdsk
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Re: COVID Lockdown - Guidance versus the Law

Postby Jdsk » 10 Jan 2021, 7:22pm

mjr wrote:Stay apart but keep fit. It could save your life.

Excellent advice. Just the sort of thing that should have been relentlessly communicated throughout the last year.

Jonathan

thirdcrank
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Re: COVID Lockdown - Guidance versus the Law

Postby thirdcrank » 10 Jan 2021, 8:10pm

Jdsk wrote:
mjr wrote:Stay apart but keep fit. It could save your life.

Excellent advice. Just the sort of thing that should have been relentlessly communicated throughout the last year.

Jonathan


And here's Matt Lucas with what's actally been communicated (with apologies to those who have posted this before but it seems very apposite here.)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sfrThV6DJu4

gbnz
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Re: COVID Lockdown - Guidance versus the Law

Postby gbnz » 10 Jan 2021, 8:45pm

Jdsk wrote:
mjr wrote:Stay apart but keep fit. It could save your life.

Excellent advice. Just the sort of thing that should have been relentlessly communicated throughout the last year.

Jonathan


What!

By HM Gvt who for six months out of the past 9.5 months, have effectively blocked me from doing 60 minutes intense cardio 5-6 days a week; who've blocked me from doing 4-5 Hr's on the weights a week; who've blocked me from 5-6 Hr's in the pool a week.

While being perfectly happy if I were to choose to binge out on Big Mac's or other forms of takeaway, because that's ok and Covid friendly!

No wonder the lockdown no longer applies to me. Acceptance and compliance is a core part of any legal process. HM Gvt have lost me (Nb. Like most, on the introduction of Tier 4 last week, I had to head down the gym to have a second 2-3 Hr workout prior to midnight. This is a joke)

Jdsk
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Re: COVID Lockdown - Guidance versus the Law

Postby Jdsk » 10 Jan 2021, 8:53pm

gbnz wrote:
Jdsk wrote:
mjr wrote:Stay apart but keep fit. It could save your life.

Excellent advice. Just the sort of thing that should have been relentlessly communicated throughout the last year.


What!

By HM Gvt who for six months out of the past 9.5 months, have effectively blocked me from doing 60 minutes intense cardio 5-6 days a week; who've blocked me from doing 4-5 Hr's on the weights a week; who've blocked me from 5-6 Hr's in the pool a week.

From what you've previously told us it wasn't possible to stay apart from other people during that indoor exercise, changing, and accessing the building.

gbnz wrote:While being perfectly happy if I were to choose to binge out on Big Mac's or other forms of takeaway, because that's ok and Covid friendly!

Who is "perfectly happy" about that, please?

Thanks

Jonathan

prestavalve
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Re: COVID Lockdown - Guidance versus the Law

Postby prestavalve » 10 Jan 2021, 8:57pm

gbnz wrote:... 60 minutes intense cardio 5-6 days a week... 4-5 Hr's on the weights a week...5-6 Hr's in the pool a week.


COVID or not, I think it might be a good idea if someone did tell you settle down a bit: 17 hours of intense exercise a week is quite alot.

thirdcrank
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Re: COVID Lockdown - Guidance versus the Law

Postby thirdcrank » 11 Jan 2021, 10:35am

This morning, I caught a snatch of the Derbyshire Police and Crime Commissioner -Hardyal Dhindsa - being interviewed on the box about the tickets being issued by his force. I was too busy to stop and listen but at one point he was taking the line that policing is a tough job and mistakes will be made.

The main point for me is that PCCs are Teresa May's creatures, introduced to clip the wings of chief constables. They decide policy. On that basis, IMO, the broad approach taken by Derbyshire Police is his personal responsibility. He has no direct control over operational policing, but as the person who appoints the chief constable and has their continued employment in his remit, when he says "Jump" the only question is "How high?"

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al_yrpal
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Re: COVID Lockdown - Guidance versus the Law

Postby al_yrpal » 11 Jan 2021, 11:10am

I know of this woman in Formby. She is in a bubble with her boyfriend in Beverly, in another bubble with her 80 yo mother locally and yet another bubble with her local walking group. She is really thick and the sort of idiot that can potentially spread the virus around like wildfire. She thinks she is doing nothing wrong and wont be told. Plenty around like her I believe.

Please post any examples that you know about so we can gauge compliance?

Al
Touring on a bicycle is a great way to explore and appreciate the countryside and towns you pass through. Make a difference...

Brucey
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Re: COVID Lockdown - Guidance versus the Law

Postby Brucey » 11 Jan 2021, 11:33am

near to me a family is 'heavily involved in the local church'. Needless to say the while family has contracted Covid and presumably the rest of the congregation has been exposed too.

Just one of several anomalies in the current situation.
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Ride-sleep-repeat
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Re: COVID Lockdown - Guidance versus the Law

Postby Ride-sleep-repeat » 11 Jan 2021, 11:36am

thirdcrank wrote: I'd struggle to interpret travelling five miles as not being local.

I agree.
What constitutes 'local' can be vague.Do you base it on one side of (your)Town to another?Your county?It's all open to individual interpretation IMO.
I can cycle into a different County in less than 10 miles,have two large Towns and a City centre all within 7 miles and all within the same postcode.
I would consider all the above to be 'local' to me.
Derbyshire Police haven't had the best reputation for common sense or being truthful throughout the last year :|