Quads get tired too quickly...?

General cycling advice ( NOT technical ! )
Stevek76
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Re: Why do my quads hurt and tire so quickly?

Post by Stevek76 »

Depends heavily on the flats used also. Actual MTB flats + skate style flat soft sole shoes provides a decent amount of grip at the top/bottom of the pedal cycle, something you don't get with harder shoes and/or plastic or caged pedals (unless the latter are shin shreddingly sharp :shock: )

MTBers can get quite... enthusiastic :lol: on the flats Vs clipless issue so I feel it's worth taking views from either side with a heap of salt.

I use MTB flats on my utility as I find it's a good balance between wet weather grip and shoe/leg destruction.

For mtbing I actually prefer the stability of clipless. Power (burst) can definitely be higher clipless for me as I can output beyond the level at which control is reduced without slipping off. Efficiency i can't really say I've noticed but there is likely the complicating factor that clipless allows use of far stiffer shoes and how much is down to that rather than greater use of the pedal cycle?

I'd agree with others though that this isn't likely to do much for the OPs issue. If your quads are done going up a particular hill on flats, it's unlikely you're going to bounce up it spring chicken style with clipless!
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Jim
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Re: Why do my quads hurt and tire so quickly?

Post by Jim »

I'm sure it will go away with gentle practice. Keep it up and you'll enjoy it - you don't have to go faster or further than anyone else.

As an aside one of the advantages of clipping in (or strapping with toeclips) is that it places the ball of the foot over the axle of the pedal, enabling the calf muscles to come into play, taking some of the load from the quads. This also means having the saddle high enough to flex the ankle when pedaling. I too like the "heel on the pedal with straight leg" approach to saddle height.
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531colin
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Re: Why do my quads hurt and tire so quickly?

Post by 531colin »

If you set your riding position up properly then 3 of the largest muscle groups in the body will contribute to propelling your bike.
The glutes and hamstrings extend the hip, ie. they pull the knee down.
The quads. extend the knee, ie they straighten it.
Set your feet up so the ball of your foot is above or just in front of the pedal axle, and your saddle height so there is a slight bend in the leg with the foot level on the pedal at the bottom.

Imagefoot level on bottom pedal by 531colin, on Flickr

Set your saddle far enough back so that you are in balance, NOT supporting your torso by leaning on your arms.

ImageBalanced position by 531colin, on Flickr

The further back you sit, the more you will recruit your glutes and hamstrings into pedalling.

Read my DIY bike fit piece linked below
Slothman
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Quads get tired too quickly...?

Post by Slothman »

have been running on/off for many years. I'm not great at it and do it for fitness not to be competitive.
I am 5'8" and around 12.5 - 13st in weight, so yes a little over weight at present.
However, due to a repetitive lower Achilles strain on my left side I have tried to take up cycling to stay fit without aggravating and buggering up my Achilles.

I ride a CB Cape Wrath (2002/3) MTB with Schwalbe Marathon Supreme road tyres on, and have tried to set the front suspension as hard as possible (no option to lock it out completely I'm afraid).
I have also fitted Ergon grips and risers and a Selle SMP TRK saddle. The saddle helps a lot compared to the factory fitted one.
My riding position is such that when the pedal is in the lowest position, my leg (with my foot fairly flat on the pedal) is still slightly bent and not fully extended. I was told that was correct?

Anyway, there's the background, if relevant.

My issue is that although I like to think I'm fairly fit, having been a runner for years, I really struggle with leg fatigue after a very short time in the saddle, especially (and disproportionately so) on hills, even slight ones.
Basically my quads hurt like heck and run out of power very quickly and I often really struggle up hills.
My calves and glutes don't give me any issues, yes I feel it, but not a problem like my quads.

It's like I hit the 'wall' or as they say in cycling circles 'bonk' when going up hills.

I am only doing between 6 & 12 miles max and more often than not between 6 & 8 miles.
However, it seems that my quads just do not want to play nicely and let me down on hills, even fairly early in the ride, I often have to change right down the gears to where my legs are spinning rapidly but the bike is barely moving!!! Even then I often have to stop as my legs simply run out of power.
Once I was literally barely keeping pace with two people simply walking up the hill...embarrassing!!!
I have even tried standing on the pedals to pump up hills but when my legs are tired, that hurts as much as sitting on the saddle and my legs still run out of steam very quickly.

Is it me?
Is it just a matter of perseverance due to using different muscles or in a different way to running?
or... have I got a rooky error thing going on I need to address? (i.e. riding position or technique?)

Can anyone advise as it is taking a lot of the pleasure out of my rides.
Jdsk
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Re: Quads get tired too quickly...?

Post by Jdsk »

Slothman wrote: 22 Jul 2021, 9:23amMy riding position is such that when the pedal is in the lowest position, my leg (with my foot fairly flat on the pedal) is still slightly bent and not fully extended. I was told that was correct?
That's often recommended as an initial position. It's very similar to putting your heel on the pedal and then fitting so that your leg is straight.

And once you have that initial position I recommend experimenting with all of the adjustments that are available.

Slothman wrote: 22 Jul 2021, 9:23am Basically my quads hurt like heck and run out of power very quickly and I often really struggle up hills.
My calves and glutes don't give me any issues, yes I feel it, but not a problem like my quads.
Can you add a photo with you pointing with one finger to where it hurts?

And a side-on photo or video of you riding past the camera?

Jonathan
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Audax67
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Re: Quads get tired too quickly...?

Post by Audax67 »

Keep at it is my advice. I cycled as a teenager then gave it up for around 30 years. When I started cycling for the second time I was rubbish on hills - I'd do five pedal-strokes before the burning pain got too much, pause for a second or two, then start in again for another 5. The uneven number meant that alternate legs got to rest in the vertical position.

I can still remember one particular hill I had to do this on. Last time I went that way (admittedly 27 years later) I was surprised at how un-steep it was.
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Tigerbiten
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Re: Quads get tired too quickly...?

Post by Tigerbiten »

It just sounds like you are just trying to go to fast, to soon, before you're anywhere like cycling fit.
When I start my spring training after slowing down over winter, the first 6 weeks are hard and hurt as I start to build up my fitness and it's only after around 12 weeks that I'm cycling fit at the new level and it gets easy.
So slow down a bit and take your time.
Things like, on some rides try and get up hills using as little energy as possible rather than as fast as possible.
In runners terms, treat the ride as a jog around the block rather than a full out training session.

Luck ............ :D
Slothman
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Re: Quads get tired too quickly...?

Post by Slothman »

Jdsk wrote: 22 Jul 2021, 9:59am
Slothman wrote: 22 Jul 2021, 9:23amMy riding position is such that when the pedal is in the lowest position, my leg (with my foot fairly flat on the pedal) is still slightly bent and not fully extended. I was told that was correct?
That's often recommended as an initial position. It's very similar to putting your heel on the pedal and then fitting so that your leg is straight.

And once you have that initial position I recommend experimenting with all of the adjustments that are available.

Slothman wrote: 22 Jul 2021, 9:23am Basically my quads hurt like heck and run out of power very quickly and I often really struggle up hills.
My calves and glutes don't give me any issues, yes I feel it, but not a problem like my quads.
Can you add a photo with you pointing with one finger to where it hurts?

And a side-on photo or video of you riding past the camera?

Jonathan
Hi, I'm going to struggle with providing most of that but am happy to try and explain.
The burning, aching and general tiredness is on the front/middle of my quads and radiates across to the upper sides and up to my hips a little.
I have raised my saddle a little but not ridden since doing it so don't know if it will help yet (been away on holiday).
Actually I was surprised as to how much I needed to raise it to allow my foot to be perfectly straight when resting my heel on the pedal! Perhaps it will help.
I am probably back to square 1 and also probably going to suffer a bit when I go out again due to not riding for nearly 3 weeks.
Slothman
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Re: Quads get tired too quickly...?

Post by Slothman »

Thanks again for the replies.

I suspect my issues stem from more than one place.

I reckon you are all correct in that...

1/ My seat may have been too low (I'll try it out this weekend although will have lost some fitness as I've been away and not ridden for nearly three weeks!)

2/ I am trying too hard and not using my gears correctly.

3/ I am not yet used to cycling and need to condition my legs.

4/ My tyre pressure may be too low and thus losing power (soon to be remedied when I get a decent pump)

5/ My front fork has suspension that can't be locked out completely so I'm losing power there also, despite setting it as firm as it will go.

6/ I need a lighter more road specific bike (working on that)

7/ I am built more like a running sprinter not for distance and carry too much weight up the hills (a lighter bike should help with that as will persisting in my rides, easing off the beer and curry and losing some weight)
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Paulatic
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Re: Quads get tired too quickly...?

Post by Paulatic »

Raising the saddle will engage the quads even more. You should try lowering and sharing the workload with the hamstrings a bit more.
Getting your initial saddle height using a slight bend in the leg is too vague. A slight bend can mean many things to many people.
While rolling down a hill put heels on pedal and pedal backwards. Leg should be straight without hips rocking to maintain it.
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Re: Quads get tired too quickly...?

Post by Vorpal »

Slothman wrote: 22 Jul 2021, 11:50am Thanks again for the replies.

I suspect my issues stem from more than one place.

I reckon you are all correct in that...
I would recommend taking a look at 531colin's bike fitting guide linked in his signature.
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nez
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Re: Quads get tired too quickly...?

Post by nez »

All of the notes about getting the position right are true. Then there was a good note further up the thread about it taking 6 weeks after winter inactivity to be properly cycling fit. I think that's true - if you coming from a low level of cycling fitness you need to allow about six weeks. Then suddenly the place on the hill where it hurt too much will glide past and you will wonder what the fuss was. But further up the hill it will hurt. :shock:

What was it LeMond said - it doesn't hurt less you just go faster.
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531colin
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Re: Quads get tired too quickly...?

Post by 531colin »

Move the saddle back a bit....10mm should be enough to feel a difference.
Moving the saddle back recruits the hamstrings and glutes, and spares the quads. (a bit).
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Mick F
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Re: Quads get tired too quickly...?

Post by Mick F »

Sorry, guys. Late to the party here.

Words of one syllable please. Keep it simple.

What are quads?
Front or back of of thigh, or bum muscles, or what?

I know I can look it up, but I've just tried and it's rather more info than I want.
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Re: Quads get tired too quickly...?

Post by Vorpal »

quads = quadriceps = general term for the large muscle(s) on the front of the thigh
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