Ortlieb panniers?

[rogerzilla]

My mate's yellow Ortliebs are not in a good way, being chafed and failing at the seams

[pete75]

Anyone know why Ortlieb panniers last indefinitely?

Suppose mine are now 14 years old. And yet as I stuffed approx. 12-15kg of food shopping into one (I.e. 12 pints of milk), I can't quite believe they're still not showing the slightest sign of fabric wear, the straps are still in place, the draw cords haven't needed replaced. Quite incredibly, the tiny plastic "snap on" fittings the panniers are attached to the rack with, still haven't shown the slightest issue, despite the fact that they've done thousands of fully packed journeys over 14 years carrying 10-15kg as a matter of routine.

It just seems incredible. A modern fridge lasts 3-4 years, a washing machine 2-3 years, a laptop several months, karrimor boots one walk.. If Ortlieb panniers were made by most modern suppliers, 3-4 weeks of use would be a "good life"

How on earth do Ortlieb do it?

You obviously look after your panniers in a damn sight better way than you do your domestic appliances and laptop computers.

[Psamathe]

(Backroller Classic QL1) I find the bolts holding the main rail to the pannier (ones with the plastic captive nuts on the inside) can work lose over time and if you don't spot it you can lose them. Happened once to me mid tour (an end one) but local French village garage managed to find a screw that fitted OK.

Ian

[Sweep]

Agreed! My bikepacker plus carried the family shopping yesterday. Been used most days for commuting and tours since 2005. Ready for a clean.

I have a pair of those I bought last century. Ditto used for lots of shopping - look almost new. The original hooks were a pain - inserts kept dropping out - but at least I could buy and retrofit the new 2.1 ones - inserts go in from the side. They are brilliant - will be using on a wild camp later this week - I really like the fact that you can no trouble leave them outside a tent in pouring rain if you have to.

[gbnz]

You obviously look after your panniers in a damn sight better way than you do your domestic appliances and laptop computers.

No. In fact, with the regular cleaning of filters on the washing machine and ensuring it's precisely levelled, defrosting of the fridge, anti viral programs and defragmenting on the laptop, they have far more maintenance than the Ortliebs.

Though it is my intention to wash the Ortliebs one day - has been for several years, but it will happen at some stage

[pete75]

You obviously look after your panniers in a damn sight better way than you do your domestic appliances and laptop computers.

No. In fact, with the regular cleaning of filters on the washing machine and ensuring it's precisely levelled, defrosting of the fridge, anti viral programs and defragmenting on the laptop, they have far more maintenance than the Ortliebs.

Though it is my intention to wash the Ortliebs one day - has been for several years, but it will happen at some stage

What brands of appliances do you buy? Get Miele next time you buy and they'll last 20 years or more.
Carradice saddlebags and panniers made before Ortlieb was founded in 1982 are still in use, so Carradice is proven to be longer lasting. Most of their products are made from sustainable, natural materials too.

[Oldjohnw]

Do the boots and computer you buy not carry warrantees? 12 months is a legal requirement . If we were still in the EU you could claim up to 6 years for electrical items.

[Bmblbzzz]

You obviously look after your panniers in a damn sight better way than you do your domestic appliances and laptop computers.

No. In fact, with the regular cleaning of filters on the washing machine and ensuring it's precisely levelled, defrosting of the fridge, anti viral programs and defragmenting on the laptop, they have far more maintenance than the Ortliebs.

Though it is my intention to wash the Ortliebs one day - has been for several years, but it will happen at some stage

What brands of appliances do you buy? Get Miele next time you buy and they'll last 20 years or more.
Carradice saddlebags and panniers made before Ortlieb was founded in 1982 are still in use, so Carradice is proven to be longer lasting. Most of their products are made from sustainable, natural materials too.

I like Carradice products and that's largely because of the waxed cotton material, but they do contain a lot of plastic as well: the hooks, backing plates and bottom stiffeners on the panniers, the lining that's on the lid of the saddlebags, the inner flaps and their drawstrings, the reflectors... It's a lot less than Ortlieb or most other manufacturers, who use plastics for every part, but it has to be pointed out that even Carradice are not really sustainable or natural. Perhaps they still were as late as 1982, I don't know (ignoring the thorny question of whether leather and metals are sustainable... !)

[pete75]

No. In fact, with the regular cleaning of filters on the washing machine and ensuring it's precisely levelled, defrosting of the fridge, anti viral programs and defragmenting on the laptop, they have far more maintenance than the Ortliebs.

Though it is my intention to wash the Ortliebs one day - has been for several years, but it will happen at some stage

What brands of appliances do you buy? Get Miele next time you buy and they'll last 20 years or more.
Carradice saddlebags and panniers made before Ortlieb was founded in 1982 are still in use, so Carradice is proven to be longer lasting. Most of their products are made from sustainable, natural materials too.

I like Carradice products and that's largely because of the waxed cotton material, but they do contain a lot of plastic as well: the hooks, backing plates and bottom stiffeners on the panniers, the lining that's on the lid of the saddlebags, the inner flaps and their drawstrings, the reflectors... It's a lot less than Ortlieb or most other manufacturers, who use plastics for every part, but it has to be pointed out that even Carradice are not really sustainable or natural. Perhaps they still were as late as 1982, I don't know (ignoring the thorny question of whether leather and metals are sustainable... !)

They contain some plastic but I wouldn't call it a lot. The bulk of most panniers and saddlebags is cotton. The saddlebag lid lining appears to be cotton.

[Bmblbzzz]

The underside of the saddlebag lids is non-canvas cotton but I think there is a thin plastic layer there too. Possibly I'm mistaken about that. I expect Carradice would let us know if we contacted them. But details aside, my point is that although Carradice (the classic products at least) use a lot less plastic than other luggage manufacturers, they can't truly be described as "sustainable".

[SupermanVsSnowman]

Anyone know why Ortlieb panniers last indefinitely?

Suppose mine are now 14 years old. And yet as I stuffed approx. 12-15kg of food shopping into one (I.e. 12 pints of milk), I can't quite believe they're still not showing the slightest sign of fabric wear, the straps are still in place, the draw cords haven't needed replaced. Quite incredibly, the tiny plastic "snap on" fittings the panniers are attached to the rack with, still haven't shown the slightest issue, despite the fact that they've done thousands of fully packed journeys over 14 years carrying 10-15kg as a matter of routine.

It just seems incredible. A modern fridge lasts 3-4 years, a washing machine 2-3 years, a laptop several months, karrimor boots one walk.. If Ortlieb panniers were made by most modern suppliers, 3-4 weeks of use would be a "good life"

How on earth do Ortlieb do it?

Good to hear this. I got one small pair of ortliebs and one large pair. The small pair I use for general commuting, and I use both pairs for weekly shopping. I relish reliability. I don't intend to change them any time soon.

[pete75]

The underside of the saddlebag lids is non-canvas cotton but I think there is a thin plastic layer there too. Possibly I'm mistaken about that. I expect Carradice would let us know if we contacted them. But details aside, my point is that although Carradice (the classic products at least) use a lot less plastic than other luggage manufacturers, they can't truly be described as "sustainable".

Why on earth would they want to put a plastic layer underneath a waterproof outer? What is your definition of sustainable?

[Stevek76]

I can confirm they are not invulnerable to fairly speedy lowside 'offs'. One of mine has had a couple of holes abraded into the fabric as a result, do need to patch those up now summer is over.

[Bmblbzzz]

Does sustainable need defining? It means capable of being sustained indefinitely. The production of Carradice luggage in its current form involves fossil products – plastics and metals – and is therefore by definition unsustainable. At some point we will reach the last drop of petroleum and lump of iron ore. It's certainly "more sustainable" than most luggage and definitely more easily adaptable to a sustainable design (for instance the plastic parts are fewer and could be replaced first by metal, which is recyclable, and ultimately perhaps even by wood; but people probably won't be cycling when we reach that stage!)

[rogerzilla]

Carradice design has been improved in some respects over the years but there has been some cheapening, with riveted buckles (used to be stitched in) and straps that crack at first use, unless you diligently rub Proofide into them a few days in advance. The nylon drawstring "mouth" of current bags is also going to be unrepairable compared to the old flaps and ties.

There's not much money in making a slightly more expensive product that lasts for ever, in a mature market!