Mtb groupset on "road" bike.

General cycling advice ( NOT technical ! )
djnotts
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Re: Mtb groupset on "road" bike.

Post by djnotts »

slowster wrote: 1 Nov 2021, 2:37pm When you changed the pads, did you clean the discs?
Yes. Would it were such an oversight!
Nigel
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Re: Mtb groupset on "road" bike.

Post by Nigel »

andrew_s wrote: 1 Nov 2021, 11:51am Up to 9-speed, road and MTB rear cable pulls are the same, so you can keep the rear mech.
Front cable pulls have always been different, so you'd need an MTB front mech to go with MTB shifters.
....
Or thumb shifters. I recently fitted some decent thumb shifters (indexed rear, friction (micro-index) front) to my MTB to replace the trigger shifters. I find the new much nicer to use.
djnotts
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Re: Mtb groupset on "road" bike.

Post by djnotts »

Nigel wrote: 1 Nov 2021, 5:29pm
andrew_s wrote: 1 Nov 2021, 11:51am Up to 9-speed, road and MTB rear cable pulls are the same, so you can keep the rear mech.
Front cable pulls have always been different, so you'd need an MTB front mech to go with MTB shifters.
....
Or thumb shifters. I recently fitted some decent thumb shifters (indexed rear, friction (micro-index) front) to my MTB to replace the trigger shifters. I find the new much nicer to use.
Old 7 speed thumbies are my favourite shifters. Are yours modern - if so, what speed/brand?
Nigel
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Re: Mtb groupset on "road" bike.

Post by Nigel »

djnotts wrote: 1 Nov 2021, 9:23pm
Nigel wrote: 1 Nov 2021, 5:29pm Or thumb shifters. I recently fitted some decent thumb shifters (indexed rear, friction (micro-index) front) to my MTB to replace the trigger shifters. I find the new much nicer to use.
Old 7 speed thumbies are my favourite shifters. Are yours modern - if so, what speed/brand?
MicroShift, I needed 8 speed ones for my near-antique Orange MTB. Available in 8/9/10/11 speed.
At about £70-80 for a pair, they are a bit more than some other thumb shifters, but the movement on them is really smooth, light and precise.
djnotts
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Re: Mtb groupset on "road" bike.

Post by djnotts »

Thanks. After quick searches I had thought so - they sound worth the extra quids over the alternatives.
gregoryoftours
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Re: Mtb groupset on "road" bike.

Post by gregoryoftours »

mattsccm wrote: 31 Oct 2021, 12:50pm Try the Aliexpress versions of the TRP things. 23 quid for both ends. Mine are brilliant.

Alternatively just sling a MTB groupset on.
Ah I was wondering about these - are you talking about the purple and red things?

As far as the OP's bike I'd try road flat bar shifters before mucking about with mtb chainline and gearing. For what it's worth I've had mixed experiences with trp mechanical calipers. Some have been made badly such that the pistons aren't parallel. But you could try them with flat levers, you might get enough power out of them, especially if your levers have tuneable mechanical advantage.
djnotts
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Re: Mtb groupset on "road" bike.

Post by djnotts »

gregoryoftours wrote: 3 Nov 2021, 7:02pm
mattsccm wrote: 31 Oct 2021, 12:50pm Try the Aliexpress versions of the TRP things. 23 quid for both ends. Mine are brilliant.

Alternatively just sling a MTB groupset on.
Ah I was wondering about these - are you talking about the purple and red things?

As far as the OP's bike I'd try road flat bar shifters before mucking about with mtb chainline and gearing. For what it's worth I've had mixed experiences with trp mechanical calipers. Some have been made badly such that the pistons aren't parallel. But you could try them with flat levers, you might get enough power out of them, especially if your levers have tuneable mechanical advantage.
I have sourced flat bar shifters and adjustable brake levers, so will test the cheapest option first! I built up an mtb a few months ago with dirt cheap Clarkes mechanical discs - with decent levers so much better than the Spyres (and better than the Avid bb5 with drop levers). Omitting the "curve" leaving the levers should itself improve matters I think.

Closely observing the movement of the rear pads compared with the front has made me wonder about the accuracy/alignment of the calipers.
slowster
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Re: Mtb groupset on "road" bike.

Post by slowster »

djnotts wrote: 3 Nov 2021, 7:44pm Closely observing the movement of the rear pads compared with the front has made me wonder about the accuracy/alignment of the calipers.
If you have not done so already, I would suggest you check the previous threads which discuss settting up and adjusting Spyre brakes, e.g. see these two particular posts in one thread:

viewtopic.php?p=1603437#p1603437

viewtopic.php?p=1603699#p1603699
djnotts
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Re: Mtb groupset on "road" bike.

Post by djnotts »

I have perused many, many, instructions and videos on setting them up, though only skimmed the above references.
I am not going down the dismantling route. I shall try with flat bars, maybe with different rear caliper. If that doesn't provide adequate braking then time to either mtb it or fit a hydraulic drop bar road hydraulic groupset or sell it (with full disclosure).
I'm prepared to throw half a grand it, no more.
mattsccm
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Re: Mtb groupset on "road" bike.

Post by mattsccm »

Purple, red, blue, black or even irridescent!
rareposter
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Re: Mtb groupset on "road" bike.

Post by rareposter »

I've got a Hope V-Twin set up (under-stem junction box and front / rear calipers) for sale if you're interested?

They'll work with any cable brake lever, the cable goes to the junction box under the stem where the pull is converted to hydro and runs down hoses to the calipers. Message me on here if you want it.

The short answer is that cable brakes or cable/hydro combinations like TRP will never be as good as a full hydro job. The V-Twin is better than most as it's a much shorter cable run.

Old review of it here:
https://www.cyclingweekly.com/reviews/b ... -converter

(Hope now longer make it, it was a stop-gap system in the early days of disc brakes on CX bikes but now with full hydro groupsets being so common, it's not really needed now).

Giant do a similar system called the Conduct - it's basically the same form as the V-Twin but integrates the whole thing into the stem. Video and demo of it here:
https://www.giant-bicycles.com/global/showcase/conduct
PH
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Re: Mtb groupset on "road" bike.

Post by PH »

Something is wrong somewhere, I was riding today with two people with this set up and asked if they were happy with the braking performance, they were. Both experienced cyclists used to the peak District where good brakes are a must.
djnotts
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Re: Mtb groupset on "road" bike.

Post by djnotts »

rareposter wrote: 4 Nov 2021, 5:40pm I've got a Hope V-Twin set up (under-stem junction box and front / rear calipers) for sale if you're interested?

They'll work with any cable brake lever, the cable goes to the junction box under the stem where the pull is converted to hydro and runs down hoses to the calipers. Message me on here if you want .........

.......
Giant do a similar system called the Conduct - it's basically the same form as the V-Twin but integrates the whole thing into the stem. Video and demo of it here:
https://www.giant-bicycles.com/global/showcase/conduct
Thanks but the last thing I want is more complexity! I've been looking for frame builders who might fit rear brake bosses for Vs.

Given the disparity of user-reviews spread across th'internet I do wonder if manufacturing quality is on the inconsistent side.

Step 1 will be flat bar controls - cheapest!
rareposter
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Re: Mtb groupset on "road" bike.

Post by rareposter »

djnotts wrote: 4 Nov 2021, 9:31pm
Thanks but the last thing I want is more complexity! I've been looking for frame builders who might fit rear brake bosses for Vs.

Given the disparity of user-reviews spread across th'internet I do wonder if manufacturing quality is on the inconsistent side.

Step 1 will be flat bar controls - cheapest!
You want LESS complexity and you're wondering about sending the frame off to have V-brake bosses welded on?!
Cable discs are never perfect - IME you end up with all the problems of cable systems like stretch, water ingress and so on without the power and modulation benefits of hydro discs but they're still better than rim brakes!

In terms of complexity, I'll admit the V-Twin wasn't the easiest thing in the world to set up but it ran problem free for years with nothing more than a bleed and a change of pads every once in a while. That included the Three Peaks CX race and there's no tougher testing ground for brakes than there!
djnotts
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Re: Mtb groupset on "road" bike.

Post by djnotts »

"You want LESS complexity and you're wondering about sending the frame off to have V-brake bosses welded on?!
Cable discs are never perfect - IME you end up with all the problems of cable systems like stretch, water ingress and so on without the power and modulation benefits of hydro discs but they're still better than rim brakes!"

I won't be doing the welding, so no complexity there! And neither the Spyres nor BB5 are better than Vs in my long experience of the latter. And Vs are so much simpler. MTB Hydro discs are the best (only marginly so against Avid Arch Rivals) but that's not where I am starting from.
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