TDF and carbon fibre

General cycling advice ( NOT technical ! )
Drake
Posts: 1014
Joined: 19 Apr 2012, 9:01am

TDF and carbon fibre

Postby Drake » 20 Sep 2014, 10:40am

I don't usually watch a lot of cycle racing, but this year i watched both the French and Spanish tours.
Couple of questions sprang to mind.

1. Were there any machines used not equipped with C/F frames.

2. Were there any new innovations that the eagle eyed amongst you noticed, other than electronic gear shifting.

tatanab
Posts: 3711
Joined: 8 Feb 2007, 12:37pm

Re: TDF and carbon fibre

Postby tatanab » 20 Sep 2014, 11:27am

I do not know about the TDF and Vuelta, but there was point in the commentary for the Tour of Britain where they said only one team was not on carbon fibre but on aluminium.

tim-b
Posts: 973
Joined: 10 Oct 2009, 8:20am

Re: TDF and carbon fibre

Postby tim-b » 21 Sep 2014, 7:36am

Hi

The Genesis-Madison Volare Team frame is 953 steel since 2013, although I think that the riders have the choice of the full CF Zero for 2014
http://roadcyclinguk.com/gear/genesis-enter-carbon-fibre-market-launch-zero.html

It wouldn't surprise me if CF forks are a universal fit regardless of the frame material

Regards
tim-b
~~~~¯\(ツ)/¯~~~~

Pandaz
Posts: 116
Joined: 22 Aug 2014, 10:06am

Re: TDF and carbon fibre

Postby Pandaz » 21 Sep 2014, 8:28am

The 2014 TDF was 100% carbon!

Brucey
Posts: 34305
Joined: 4 Jan 2012, 6:25pm

Re: TDF and carbon fibre

Postby Brucey » 21 Sep 2014, 8:30am

innovations? Well, it is said that racing improves the breed; every year the manufacturers make all kinds of changes which are intended to improve their products. Many of these are subtle, or just alter manufacturing costs or something. After all between the constraints of the UCI and the laws of physics they have scope for relatively small changes. So everything is a bit more aero, bearings get a fraction less draggy, parts become more lightweight (mostly) and the lay-up in CF frames is tweaked to give the frames specific properties that the designers think are a good idea this year. Performance monitoring systems are increasingly integrated into the bike's structure.

None of which is likely to improve the lot of tourists or commuters greatly IMHO.

In the meantime some fundamental problems remain unsolved because they don't affect racing that much. Except when they do... But anyway, many of the unsolved problems are arguably relevant to more ordinary cyclists too. So bikes that don't break when they are crashed, tyres that grip better on wet roads whilst still rolling easily, puncture resistance that doesn't slow you down, brakes that work well on carbon rims, brakes that work well in the wet without making a mess, better chain lubricants, transmissions that last longer in real-word conditions, bikes that are more comfortable to ride without other penalty, a means of assessing the integrity of suspect parts, better surface finishes that are more durable... saddles that fit a wider variety of rear ends, gears that can have a greater capacity without lots of adjustments, shifters that work with any gear system, brakes that work well with fatter tyres... all these are more relevant to everyday riders, and in many cases would happily be 'paid for' with a tiny weight increase or something. But because they are unlikely to impact on any one race outcome, they are of little interest to racing, so if they come with any kind of weight penalty, they will not be developed for racing; they are too busy chasing marginal gains that do not really affect the lot of everyday folk in a beneficial fashion.

cheers
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Brucey~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

pete75
Posts: 11196
Joined: 24 Jul 2007, 2:37pm

Re: TDF and carbon fibre

Postby pete75 » 21 Sep 2014, 12:12pm

Brucey wrote:innovations? better surface finishes that are more durable... saddles that fit a wider variety of rear ends, gears that can have a greater capacity without lots of adjustments, shifters that work with any gear system, brakes that work well with fatter tyres...


cheers


The durable surface finish has been around for years - stove enamel, the shifters were invented years ago - friction and the brakes exist - discs. I've never come across gears that require lots of adjustments - you adjust them to work when fitting and occasionally need to adjust the cables.
Never had anything to do with them but presumably Di2 type electronic gears need no adjustment once set up.

User avatar
foxyrider
Posts: 4457
Joined: 29 Aug 2011, 10:25am
Location: Sheffield, South Yorkshire

Re: TDF and carbon fibre

Postby foxyrider » 21 Sep 2014, 6:12pm

pete75 wrote:Never had anything to do with them but presumably Di2 type electronic gears need no adjustment once set up.


Only to your wallet!
Convention? what's that then?
Airnimal Chameleon touring, Orbit Pro hack, Orbit Photon audax, Focus Mares AX tour, Peugeot Carbon sportive, Owen Blower vintage race - all running Tulio's finest!

User avatar
horizon
Posts: 9215
Joined: 9 Jan 2007, 11:24am
Location: Cornwall

Re: TDF and carbon fibre

Postby horizon » 21 Sep 2014, 6:50pm

One of the concerns often expressed on this forum is, far from the lack of innovation, is the need to keep things as they are, especially regarding compatibility, robustness and availability. You can either argue that this is due to undue conservatism on the part of older touring cyclists or you can say that market (and racing) driven innovation restricts the supply and compatibility of what are actually very good parts and systems. From the queries posted on the fourm I would say that most of us are still getting used to lots of aspects of bike use and further change just leaves me, for one, numb. As we've discussed ad nauseam on other threads, carbon is irrelevant when you're looking for a campsite in the middle of Spain and being chased by a dangerous looking dog. Do the TdF riders actully know how to put up a tent?
I have two doctors, my left leg and my right leg. (G. M. Trevelyan)
PS I always wondered why the YHA HQ was called Trevelyan House. :)

Brucey
Posts: 34305
Joined: 4 Jan 2012, 6:25pm

Re: TDF and carbon fibre

Postby Brucey » 21 Sep 2014, 7:07pm

horizon wrote:..... carbon is irrelevant when you're looking for a campsite in the middle of Spain and being chased by a dangerous looking dog...


-whereas a steel frame keeps rabid canines at bay...? :wink:

cheers
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Brucey~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Dave W
Posts: 1483
Joined: 18 Jul 2012, 4:17pm

Re: TDF and carbon fibre

Postby Dave W » 21 Sep 2014, 8:02pm

Tour of Britain came through my town - bunch of poofs wearing Lycra for Gods sake! Whatever next? Some of them were less than twenty five years old too!

User avatar
kylecycler
Posts: 617
Joined: 12 Aug 2013, 4:09pm
Location: Kyle, Ayrshire

Re: TDF and carbon fibre

Postby kylecycler » 21 Sep 2014, 8:20pm

What kind of depresses me is that the vast majority of roadies would think it absolutely absurd that the TdF could still be won by a steel-framed bike. I truly believe it could (or by an aluminium or titanium-framed bike) - at least as long as there is a 6.8kg weight limit. (Discuss...:wink:)

Grrr.... Why does the spell-checker keep telling us aluminium is a typo?! Aluminum was a typo, {FFE - family-friendly edit }! Americans... :roll: :evil: :)

User avatar
easyroller
Posts: 523
Joined: 27 Feb 2012, 8:05am
Location: Berkshire

Re: TDF and carbon fibre

Postby easyroller » 22 Sep 2014, 8:09am

Dave W wrote:Tour of Britain came through my town - bunch of poofs wearing Lycra for Gods sake! Whatever next? Some of them were less than twenty five years old too!



Bah! Bet they didn't even have beards either...

User avatar
[XAP]Bob
Posts: 16871
Joined: 26 Sep 2008, 4:12pm

Re: TDF and carbon fibre

Postby [XAP]Bob » 22 Sep 2014, 11:31am

easyroller wrote:
Dave W wrote:Tour of Britain came through my town - bunch of poofs wearing Lycra for Gods sake! Whatever next? Some of them were less than twenty five years old too!



Bah! Bet they didn't even have beards either...

Nor sandals...
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.

nirakaro
Posts: 970
Joined: 22 Dec 2007, 2:01am

Re: TDF and carbon fibre

Postby nirakaro » 22 Sep 2014, 3:35pm

"Grrr.... Why does the spell-checker keep telling us aluminium is a typo?! Aluminum was a typo, {FFE - family-friendly edit }! Americans... :roll: :evil: :)"

That's because you haven't reset your word processor from the default U.S. English setting to British English. Mine accepts aluminium and rejects aluminum.

WrightsW5
Posts: 751
Joined: 1 Jun 2010, 10:37pm
Location: Saddle City

Re: TDF and carbon fibre

Postby WrightsW5 » 24 Sep 2014, 10:58pm

Even Genesis has surrendered to c*rbon :(