M-Check etc.

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RickH
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Re: M-Check etc.

Postby RickH » 31 Dec 2019, 11:05am

mjr wrote:JCC?

Junior Cycling Club I presume.

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Si
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Re: M-Check etc.

Postby Si » 31 Dec 2019, 11:08am

Normally they’re sortable with nothing more than a multi tool,


Tsk, tsk, I hope that you, as a BC leader, are not spannering other people's bikes!!!!! That, as we all know, would bring on the apocalypse :wink:

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Si
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Re: When will P Tuohy Leave?

Postby Si » 31 Dec 2019, 11:12am

Cyril Haearn wrote:96ls?



started as the 'three Ls', then became '4 Ls' then 5, and people seem to be adding new Ls just for the fun of it. And no one can remember what they all are and in what order to do them....'leg', 'levers', 'look', 'launch', etc etc (YMWCV) Some acronyms can be useful when the acronym is based upon the desired actions, but others, where they just try to fit vaguely related actions to an acronym are pretty pointless.

Marcus Aurelius
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Re: M-Check etc.

Postby Marcus Aurelius » 31 Dec 2019, 11:30am

Si wrote:
Normally they’re sortable with nothing more than a multi tool,


Tsk, tsk, I hope that you, as a BC leader, are not spannering other people's bikes!!!!! That, as we all know, would bring on the apocalypse :wink:


:shock: :shock: :shock: That’s really not allowed. I can point to stuff, demo it on my own bike, but we’re not allowed to touch the other rider’s bikes ( officially ). That extends to sorting out mechanicals whilst on the ride as well.

pedals2slowly
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Re: M-Check etc.

Postby pedals2slowly » 1 Jan 2020, 6:01pm

M check is a very good explanation to year 4, 5 and 6 children AND pretty good for everyone else.
Can't really see how it can be different fro different people as it is all encompassing, simple and efficient.

I'm happy to take risks and sort out most problems on other people's bikes, been doing it for too many years to worry about it.

ABC check is pretty useless
Air and brakes is enough really.

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Si
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Re: M-Check etc.

Postby Si » 1 Jan 2020, 8:31pm

Can't really see how it can be different fro different people as it is all encompassing, simple and efficient


ah, but its not. Nobody checks everything on a bike, and people tend to prioritize different things thus there are a whole load of different versions of the m check. Most people get in the stuff most likely to go wrong but there are so many things that go wrong less often.

As for the C in abc.....helps in bikeability with kids given their tendency to change gear on their (or, often, someone else's) bike when not moving

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Re: M-Check etc.

Postby Marcus Aurelius » 2 Jan 2020, 8:13am

You only want to cover safety critical bits, and then only really in a ‘binary’ way (is whatever’s being checked actually functioning, or not) otherwise you’ll be there all day checking, and not riding

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NATURAL ANKLING
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Re: M-Check etc.

Postby NATURAL ANKLING » 2 Jan 2020, 10:26am

Hi,
On a practical basis I didn't find the video very good.
I suppose in theory it looks a bit like a bike MOT.
Being performed by someone who knows what they're doing be a bike MOT.
I would add a few things to it as well.
Some of the things in that video I know most people would struggle to do who have been riding bikes for years.

Your bike today is a bit like your car driver the one to never bother opening the bonnet, especially paying any attention whatsoever to the tires.
I can see what this video all the M check is trying to do but I think it needs some modification, probably chucked together Because someone thought it was a good idea which it is, but Like said some of it is unnecessary, and some of it could be better done.

If I had my way I would make sure every school leaver had Assembled a bike first and also mended Tyre flats And fit a chain in the field on their own.
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Si
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Re: M-Check etc.

Postby Si » 2 Jan 2020, 11:13am

Marcus Aurelius wrote:You only want to cover safety critical bits, and then only really in a ‘binary’ way (is whatever’s being checked actually functioning, or not) otherwise you’ll be there all day checking, and not riding


Not quite. If it's just you then fine, you can fix stuff as you ride. But if you've got a group of kids for a limited time period in which to teach them a lot of stuff, then you don't want to get them a distance from school only to find that a none safety critical thing has gone wrong on a bike, stopping them continuing with the session, meaning that you've got to take the whole group back to the school, quite possibly walking, to either dump the one kid or change bikes, then back out again to where ever you were doing the training. This is where what an instructor is doing the M-check/ABCDE for can differ to what a rider is doing it for.

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gaz
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Re: M-Check etc.

Postby gaz » 2 Jan 2020, 2:37pm

NATURAL ANKLING wrote:On a practical basis I didn't find the video very good.

Also available as a pdf handout, which you probably wouldn't like either :wink: .

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pjclinch
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Re: M-Check etc.

Postby pjclinch » 3 Jan 2020, 1:18pm

RickH wrote:
mjr wrote:JCC?

Junior Cycling Club I presume.


Yes. In my case, specifically Dundee's Discovery JCC, the club that got Mark Stewart and Alfie George started (with absolutely no credit due to me, I should clarify!)
Often seen riding a bike around Dundee...

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pjclinch
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Re: M-Check etc.

Postby pjclinch » 3 Jan 2020, 1:32pm

For fettling of bikes if a check turns up an issue, position in Scotland for the LAs I've worked for (Dundee, P&K and Angus) is that "minor adjustments" are okay. Next up, what's the definition a "minor adjustment"? Commendably free rein was given, with some caveats. First, If you're not 100% sure, don't do it and it is absolutely okay for you to say "I'm not touching it!". Second, our job was to teach people to ride, not to fix their bikes, so any work would need to be quick.

So, barrel adjuster to rein in a cable, straighten up a saddle or bars, reinstate a dropped chain and/or put it in a sensible gear etc., fine. Anything that wasn't covered, note home with a suggestion of what needed done and suggestions of whom/where to go to in order to get it done.

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pjclinch
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Re: M-Check etc.

Postby pjclinch » 3 Jan 2020, 1:35pm

NATURAL ANKLING wrote:If I had my way I would make sure every school leaver had Assembled a bike first and also mended Tyre flats And fit a chain in the field on their own.


You don't have any time for the idea that anything that can be perceived as a barrier to cycling is counter-productive, I take it?
Often seen riding a bike around Dundee...

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Re: M-Check etc.

Postby Vorpal » 3 Jan 2020, 1:38pm

Si wrote:
Marcus Aurelius wrote:You only want to cover safety critical bits, and then only really in a ‘binary’ way (is whatever’s being checked actually functioning, or not) otherwise you’ll be there all day checking, and not riding


Not quite. If it's just you then fine, you can fix stuff as you ride. But if you've got a group of kids for a limited time period in which to teach them a lot of stuff, then you don't want to get them a distance from school only to find that a none safety critical thing has gone wrong on a bike, stopping them continuing with the session, meaning that you've got to take the whole group back to the school, quite possibly walking, to either dump the one kid or change bikes, then back out again to where ever you were doing the training. This is where what an instructor is doing the M-check/ABCDE for can differ to what a rider is doing it for.

We used to take with a phone number for a teacher or assistant who was available to come and collect students, if necessary. We leaarned to do that after a couple of misbehaving kids ruined two sessions in a row for all the rest of the students. After that experience, we just made the miscreants stand on a corner, near one of the instructors & wait for someone to come and collect them.

We did have some trouble with that approach once, when one of the students threatened to go home on his own. We had to stop the session, so that one instructor could supervise all of the other kids, while the other instructor (me) settled the young man and herded him back to the rest. I'm not sure the outcome would have been any different with the 'take them all back' approach. But at least we were able to continue after he agreed to wait until the assistant got there to take him back to school.
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horizon
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Re: M-Check etc.

Postby horizon » 3 Jan 2020, 2:07pm

BITD, I did a few trips with my children plus a couple of their friends. The M check would have been ideal plus a quick learning opportunity for them.
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