Forum changes my wording

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Thornyone
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Forum changes my wording

Postby Thornyone » 12 Jun 2018, 9:00am

I’m pretty fed up that every time I use the term “supporter of brexit” on the forum the word is automatically changed to “supporter of brexit”. It took me a while, when previewing my posts, to discover that it was not me going mad and that what I was typing was not what I was getting. I’m annoyed that instead of being able to type “supporter of brexit politicians” (my wording has been changed again here) I have to type “Brexit supporting” otherwise I find my wording automatically changed to “supporter of brexit politicians” :roll
OMG I ONLY TYPED “SUPPORTER OF BREXIT” ONCE IN THIS POST!!! The phrase I DID type twice was Brexit with two “e”s and an “r” added to the end, i.e “Brexit*** politicians”!!!

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Re: Forum changes my wording

Postby PDQ Mobile » 12 Jun 2018, 9:10am

It's not right.
It's an abuse of editing power.
Thin end of the wedge.
Who decided this? Shall we name names?

You should be able to write anything you like and have it appear unchanged or have certain words simply not allowed, a synonym for "micturate" springs to mind.

For there is often subtle meaning conveyed by small differences, (for those that understand subtle!).
I understand some swear or otherwise offensive words are not allowed, fair enough, but reasons must be given even for those.
Gratuitous swearing is poor conveyance of meaning anyway, however in the right place "strong" language can help clarity!

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mjr
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Re: Forum changes my wording

Postby mjr » 12 Jun 2018, 9:52am

In a misguided attempt at fairness, the B term was banned at the same time as the pejorative for someone who works to keep their EU citizenship. Of course, they should have banned Wrexiteer instead of a popular neutral term, but you can't tell.'em.
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Re: Forum changes my wording

Postby PDQ Mobile » 12 Jun 2018, 11:20am

mjr wrote:In a misguided attempt at fairness, the B term was banned at the same time as the pejorative for someone who works to keep their EU citizenship. Of course, they should have banned Wrexiteer instead of a popular neutral term, but you can't tell.'em.


Who is "they"?
Who decides?

"Re-moaner" is edited out too it would seem.
Though not "remainer" or "remaineer"!

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fossala
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Re: Forum changes my wording

Postby fossala » 12 Jun 2018, 11:29am

It's interesting that this forum let's you discus politics but censors the biggest political decision in my lifetime (granted I'm not even 30 yet).

Psamathe
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Re: Forum changes my wording

Postby Psamathe » 12 Jun 2018, 11:38am

mjr wrote:In a misguided attempt at fairness, the B term was banned at the same time as the pejorative for someone who works to keep their EU citizenship......

I agree, it's a false balance because "R e m o a n e r" is a bit derogatory (due to the merge with "moan" suggesting those supporting Remiain are "moaners"). But "B r e x i t e e r s" has no such derogatory component.

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Re: Forum changes my wording

Postby admin » 12 Jun 2018, 12:05pm

"They", the people who decide what is unacceptable for this Forum, are the volunteer moderators.

Brexit is, as we all know, a highly emotive subject. As such we prefer that discussions about it focus on the actual practicalities and not on the "tribes" of people commonly imagined that in fact do not exist in any useful form. That way it's less likely that people will take offence.

Mythical tribes:

"Br*x*t**rs are keen to get out of the Single Market" - focuses on the mythical and non-existent tribe called "br*x*t**rs".
"R*m**n*rs can't accept the democratic result of the referendum" - focuses on the mythical and non-existent tribe called "r*m**n*rs".
"Cyclists are annoying, because they think jumping red lights is OK." - focuses on the mythical and non-existent tribe called "cyclists".

Better:

"Some people who voted to leave the EU are keen to get out of the Single Market"
"Some people who voted to stay in the EU can't accept the democratic result of the referendum"
"Some people seem to think it's OK to ride their bicycles past red traffic lights"

Psamathe
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Re: Forum changes my wording

Postby Psamathe » 12 Jun 2018, 12:12pm

admin wrote:.....
Mythical tribes:

"Br*x*t**rs are keen to get out of the Single Market" - focuses on the mythical and non-existent tribe called "br*x*t**rs".
"R*m**n*rs can't accept the democratic result of the referendum" - focuses on the mythical and non-existent tribe called "r*m**n*rs".
"Cyclists are annoying, because they think jumping red lights is OK." - focuses on the mythical and non-existent tribe called "cyclists".

Better:

"Some people who voted to leave the EU are keen to get out of the Single Market"
"Some people who voted to stay in the EU can't accept the democratic result of the referendum"
"Some people seem to think it's OK to ride their bicycles past red traffic lights"

I don't quite understand why you consider the groups as "mythical" or "non-existent". I consider that there is a group of people included in the group "cyclists", etc.

Being brief can be useful and help people read. So "Br*x*t**rs" is easier and more concise than "people who voted to leave the EU". And they are not the same.

The important distinction is that "Br*x*t**rs" concisely describes a group holding a view without being derogatory whilst "R*m**n*rs" describes a group together with an insult (the merging on "moan" suggesting those supporting Remain are moaners). Hence the imbalance in the automated language filter.

Ian

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Re: Forum changes my wording

Postby Vorpal » 12 Jun 2018, 12:27pm

Psamathe wrote:
mjr wrote:In a misguided attempt at fairness, the B term was banned at the same time as the pejorative for someone who works to keep their EU citizenship......

I agree, it's a false balance because "R e m o a n e r" is a bit derogatory (due to the merge with "moan" suggesting those supporting Remiain are "moaners"). But "B r e x i t e e r s" has no such derogatory component.


Except that in a few instances B r e x i t e e r s as used on this forum was clearly intended in a derogatory manner, e.g. rabid B r e x i t e e r s

We don't have a filter on any number of similar or related words.
“In some ways, it is easier to be a dissident, for then one is without responsibility.”
― Nelson Mandela, Long Walk to Freedom

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Re: Forum changes my wording

Postby Vorpal » 12 Jun 2018, 12:33pm

Psamathe wrote:The important distinction is that "Br*x*t**rs" concisely describes a group holding a view without being derogatory whilst "R*m**n*rs" describes a group together with an insult (the merging on "moan" suggesting those supporting Remain are moaners). Hence the imbalance in the automated language filter.

Ian

The point is that they aren't a group holding a view. They are a group holding many views. And some correlate B r e x i t e e r with privateer or profiteer in the same way that the other terms suggests supporters of remain are moaners.

It didn't help that people using one term complained about t'other.
“In some ways, it is easier to be a dissident, for then one is without responsibility.”
― Nelson Mandela, Long Walk to Freedom

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Re: Forum changes my wording

Postby Vorpal » 12 Jun 2018, 12:40pm

fossala wrote:It's interesting that this forum let's you discus politics but censors the biggest political decision in my lifetime (granted I'm not even 30 yet).

We are not sensoring any decisions. We are not preventing people discussing it. We are merely attempting to encourage civil discourse.

When someone begins a sentences with, "You B r e x i t e e r s..." it doesn't get better from there.
“In some ways, it is easier to be a dissident, for then one is without responsibility.”
― Nelson Mandela, Long Walk to Freedom

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fossala
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Re: Forum changes my wording

Postby fossala » 12 Jun 2018, 12:45pm

I voted to leave the EU because along with the IMF is a tool to impose and expand neo-liberalism, this was shown with the imposed austerity on Greece and Ireland (who cares about their will of the people?). I also tend to find it's rather racist group that is very protectionist.

I am not what most people would think of when they say supporter of brexit (I'm a Communist), but you can't disagree that I am. What is not surprising is that that the neo-liberal capitalist Labour Party didn't represent the views of the socialist left yet again. This created only one path for our departure.

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Audax67
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Re: Forum changes my wording

Postby Audax67 » 12 Jun 2018, 12:46pm

As far as I'm concerned it's Quitters and Stayers.
Have we got time for another cuppa?

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Re: Forum changes my wording

Postby admin » 12 Jun 2018, 12:49pm

Psamathe wrote:The important distinction is that "Br*x*t**rs" concisely describes a group holding a view


I would say the opposite, and that is where the problem lies.

The term tries to describe a well-defined group of people, yet it cannot: there is a whole spectrum of views on Brexit. In fact trying to nail down what this mythical group of "Br*x*t**rs" actually want is very difficult, as Teresa May is finding out.

Just as you can't talk about what "cyclists" think: there is a whole spectrum of different people who might be called a "cyclist". Try stating that "cyclists prefer to ride on the carriageway" for example, and see what happens.

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Re: Forum changes my wording

Postby thirdcrank » 12 Jun 2018, 1:05pm

Vorpal wrote:
fossala wrote:It's interesting that this forum let's you discus politics but censors the biggest political decision in my lifetime (granted I'm not even 30 yet).

We are not sensoring any decisions. We are not preventing people discussing it. We are merely attempting to encourage civil discourse.

When someone begins a sentences with, "You B r e x i t e e r s..." it doesn't get better from there.


Since this is nominally a discussion about the workings of the automatic bowdlerisation technology and by extension the application of the rules about acceptable language, IIRC circumventing these by deft use of the keyboard is a sin.