** The Brexit Thread ** - 'Brexit Means Brexit'

[kwackers]

A glaring example is the Liberal so called Democrat opportunists trying to boost their electoral credentials in the most anti democratic way possible.

I'm mystified. How can this be? The LibDems have put this pledge in their manifesto, that they intend to revoke Article 50 if they get elected. And if they get elected, that will be because the voters support their manifesto.

Or are political parties no longer allowed to publish manifestos? Is publishing a manifesto, "anti-democratic"?

Yeah, but Al is sickened!

Obviously sickening depends on your leaning.

For liberal types it's sickening when the old, poor, weak, needy get shafted so your average rich person can have some more cash.
For your right wing brexit party supporter sickening is what happens when someone does something you don't like the sound of.

The second form of "sickening" is so bad that you're allowed to misuse words like "democracy" by claiming that folk who will have voted for it and know exactly what they're going to get are being undemocratic in their choice.

Obviously this contrasts with stuff they like the sound of, like voting for something and then being told something completely different is you're going to get.
In that case it's actually fine and not sickening at all because they like the sound of that particular option.

It's easy once you understand it.

[pwa]

Talking of democracy it seems Brexit supporters can't even accept views that differ from their own in a civilised manner. You may think that's democratic I don't.

https://www.devonlive.com/news/devon-ne ... at-3320860

Why would I think that democratic, or defend it? I don't need to defend anyone. I am responsible only for my own views and actions. Why didn't you put the word "some" before "Brexit supporters"?

The point is brexiters seem to cloak it with the virtue of their view of democracy.
What sort of democracy is it that allows no opposing point of view calling those who oppose it traitors, one that is once and for all and shouldn't be revisited though it may well not be the majority views three years later and one that disregards the view of a very large minority that voted differently etc etc.
It's a fine example of one's been called the tyranny of the majority and certainly fits with what Alexis de Tocqueville describes as a decision "which bases its claim to rule upon numbers, not upon rightness or excellence".

I actually concur with your desire for tolerance of opposing views and I would prefer a close relationship with the EU (customs union etc) because a very large minority did not want to leave. Which in a way leaves me wanting some of what you want.

[al_yrpal]

But I'm aware of you claiming remainers hate the UK,which is clearly an outright lie posted only to inflame an already hotly contested discussion.

Some who live abroad self evidently from their statements here do, and even some who actually live here which I cannot understand? I never claimed all.

Alan

[roubaixtuesday]

Democracy is just a word... I believe most people are aware of exactly what it means and they have been saying so whether they voted leave or in many cases remain. This isnt about semantics its about what the majority of those who could be bothered to vote wanted.

Al

Your post amply demonstrates there are people who haven't given what democracy means even a cursory thought.

[roubaixtuesday]

But I'm aware of you claiming remainers hate the UK,which is clearly an outright lie posted only to inflame an already hotly contested discussion.

Some who live abroad self evidently from their statements here do, and even some who actually live here which I cannot understand? I never claimed all.

Alan

Alan,

I suggest rather than insinuate, if you have a claim to make about a particular poster, you simply name the poster, and the claim you're making.

It makes life so much simpler.

[reohn2]

But I'm aware of you claiming remainers hate the UK,which is clearly an outright lie posted only to inflame an already hotly contested discussion.

Some who live abroad self evidently from their statements here do, and even some who actually live here which I cannot understand? I never claimed all.

Alan

I cannot understand your assumption why because someone who lives abroad or here in the UK and voted to remain would automatically hate the UK.
Your statements become everymore bizarre and incredible

[reohn2]

And Remainers have dished it out too. Nothing to see here, surely?

Personally I've 'dished it out' only when brexit supporters have posted abject lies or utterly ridiculous statements and reasons for voting to leave the EU.

[Bonefishblues]

I wasn't referencing the thread, I was talking more generally, but emotions run high everywhere.

[Vorpal]

But I'm aware of you claiming remainers hate the UK,which is clearly an outright lie posted only to inflame an already hotly contested discussion.

Some who live abroad self evidently from their statements here do, and even some who actually live here which I cannot understand? I never claimed all.

Alan

I don't think anyone on this thread has said anything that could even be interpretted to suggest that they hate the UK. Many folks on this thread have commented on ways in which the UK could be inmroved, or ways in which they think the EU improves things for the UK, or things that are done better in other places, but none of those mean that anyone hates the UK.

p.s. democracy is only a word, but it is a word that implies active participation. Maybe it should be a verb.

[bovlomov]

It's obvious that Brexiters are more patriotic, and respect British values more than Remainers. Every day they demonstrate their deep love for our institutions - such as Parliament, the judiciary and the universities. More than that, they honour the Union and the Crown (e.g. they wouldn't dream of fibbing to the monarch).

Actually, it really isn't important whether this Brexiter or that Remainer is patriotic. Some are, some aren't. Who cares! But it's odd that patriotism is such a strong weapon for Brexit promoters, when Brexit itself seems to be a largely foreign conspiracy.

[al_yrpal]

Well you obviously haven't read the posts I have

Al

[mjr]

Well you obviously haven't read the posts I have

Al

Is Putin rewriting your view of the internet again? xx(

[Cunobelin]

A glaring example is the Liberal so called Democrat opportunists trying to boost their electoral credentials in the most anti democratic way possible.

I'm mystified. How can this be? The LibDems have put this pledge in their manifesto, that they intend to revoke Article 50 if they get elected. And if they get elected, that will be because the voters support their manifesto.

Or are political parties no longer allowed to publish manifestos? Is publishing a manifesto, "anti-democratic"?

The Brexit Party, just refuse to publish a manifesto. Surely no-one would vote for a party when they have no idea where they stand on the NHS taxation, living wage, education, social care, and a hundred other vital questions

Yet people have in their droves.

Then look what we got, a bunch of freeloaders claiming £9,000 for doing nothing apart from spout Right Wing or rhetoric

[roubaixtuesday]

Well you obviously haven't read the posts I have

Al

In which case, name names and link to posts. They're all there.

Otherwise, your unsubstantiated insinuations merely reflect poorly on yourself.

[661-Pete]

Well you obviously haven't read the posts I have

In a thread which has just passed 19,000 posts, and is more tedious than Finnegan's Wake, it's surely beyond all reason to suppose that any two forummers will have read exactly the same subset of posts. So your point goes without saying.

Certainly I have no idea which posts Al has read. Probably not all of mine, anyway!