** The Brexit Thread ** - 'Brexit Means Brexit'

[Mick F]

If USA left NATO, it would cease to exist.

North Atlantic Treaty Organisation.
The "North Atlantic" bit of it refers to the pond between Europe and America.

It would have to be called ETO perhaps? - European Treaty Organisation.

[pete75]

They are all ifs. But prior to the end of the Cold War the only NATO countries which didn't practice conscription were the USA, Canada, the UK and Iceland - and Iceland has no military - but it is strategically positioned.

Really? Ever heard of a boxer called Muhammad Ali who lost some of the best years of his career because he refused to be conscripted into the US Army to fight in Vietnam. The UK had National Service,another name for conscription, during a lot of the cold war. Anyhow don't the right think bringing back national service would be a good thing? Teach 'em discipline and all that.

[Ben@Forest]

As for the USA, they did and do practice conscription. They just don't normally require active service of registered men (only men). In order to receive student aid, such as loans, grants, or scholarships, men must register for 'the draft' when they turn 18. Most vocational schools, colleges, universities, etc. require men to submit evidence of draft registration to attend. It's not impossible to get around, and some men don't register as a protest. My brother didn't register because he thought it was unreasonable to make men, and not women register.

I didn't know that about the Selective Service System (just looked it up) but to be fair it isn't a draft, nobody on the list serves a day in uniform or even has to report to a barracks. It seems more to be a way for a national government organisation to have 'all the names' in a country which is run through federal states (I'm sure you'll disagree with that sweeping characterisation!).

[Ben@Forest]

They are all ifs. But prior to the end of the Cold War the only NATO countries which didn't practice conscription were the USA, Canada, the UK and Iceland - and Iceland has no military - but it is strategically positioned.

Really? Ever heard of a boxer called Muhammad Ali who lost some of the best years of his career because he refused to be conscripted into the US Army to fight in Vietnam. The UK had National Service,another name for conscription, during a lot of the cold war. Anyhow don't the right think bringing back national service would be a good thing? Teach 'em discipline and all that.

And from after 1973 (US) and after 1963 (UK) there was no requirement to be conscripted. Your next post which refers to me as being on the 'farish right' will be reported to the mods.

[bovlomov]

The Times (paywall) is reporting that the Tory Chief Whip Julian Smith asked his MPs to break the pairing agreement for the close votes the other night. Then he and Brandon [and perhaps May?] lied by saying it was an oversight.

If all else goes belly up, at least we'll have that Parliamentary sovereignty.

[roubaixtuesday]

If all else goes belly up, at least we'll have that Parliamentary sovereignty.

The iron law of Brexit appears to be that whatever think you were going to get, you're actually going to end up with the exact opposite.

Vote remain = get leave
Vote leave = get it in name only
Vote for more control = choice of being controlled by EU or US
Vote for parliamentary sovereignty = get Henry VIII laws and rule by executive
Vote for more cash for NHS = get less due to reduced revenues
Unite the country = break up the UK
Unite the Tory party = ...well, at least there's one group getting their just desserts from all of this

[Cyril Haearn]

Quite a lot of US guys avoided the draft, even some politrickians
I slightly regret not being conscripted, could have been a good way to learn discipline cos I am a bit lazy

Mind, one does read of cadets having to do really senseless things and sometimes there is not as much respect as one might wish

[bovlomov]

If all else goes belly up, at least we'll have that Parliamentary sovereignty.

The iron law of Brexit appears to be that whatever think you were going to get, you're actually going to end up with the exact opposite.

Vote remain = get leave
Vote leave = get it in name only
Vote for more control = choice of being controlled by EU or US
Vote for parliamentary sovereignty = get Henry VIII laws and rule by executive
Vote for more cash for NHS = get less due to reduced revenues
Unite the country = break up the UK
Unite the Tory party = ...well, at least there's one group getting their just desserts from all of this

Talking of desserts - you forgot to mention the bananas. I can't remember now; was the EU stopping us from having straight bananas, or was it forcing the same upon us? Either way, after Brexit we'll have nothing but UK bananas (whatever shape they are).

[PDQ Mobile]

You can't be serious moderating that.
What is the objection?
Please?
It needs to be put to the forum members.

[Vorpal]

A series of posts were removed or modified because of personal remarks.

Others may not have seen all of the related posts prior to removal.

[bovlomov]

A series of posts were removed or modified because of personal remarks.

Seeking clarification. Personal remarks about fellow forum users are forbidden, but can I still make personal remarks about Michael Gove?

[661-Pete]

A series of posts were removed or modified because of personal remarks.

Others may not have seen all of the related posts prior to removal.

Might I suggest a stronger course of action? That this monstrous thread be taken to the vet's and put out of its misery, once and for all?

I don't know who insulted whom, nor who has been moderated, but it's all the same and of little consequence. There can't possibly be another topic on which opinions are so highly polarised. If this thread continues to run there's bound to be more work to come, for our beleaguered and over-stretched Mods. And more and more and more and more and more and more and more .........

[PDQ Mobile]

Just to be clear, I was not moderated.
But I thought it over zealous. Again.
And I said as much.

[Cyril Haearn]

A series of posts were removed or modified because of personal remarks.

Seeking clarification. Personal remarks about fellow forum users are forbidden, but can I still make personal remarks about Michael Gove?

One hopes positive comments are allowed

[Vorpal]

The thread was not moderated because a single individual complained. The thread was moderated because increasingly insulting personal remarks were being made.

Please do not discuss whether someone is overly sensitive, or insult others on this thread. And remember that 'tone' may not come across on the forum the way it sounds in your head.