** The Brexit Thread ** - 'Brexit Means Brexit'

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Cunobelin
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Re: ** The Brexit Thread ** - 'Brexit Means Brexit'

Postby Cunobelin » 16 Feb 2019, 8:47am

mjr wrote:
NickWi wrote:On a similar note, why doesn't the UK Government simply ask Ireland to re-join the Union that is the United Kingdom? After all it worked well with the reunification of Germany and we could claim we were simply following a successful example of an EU partnership and Britain wasn’t the bad boy of Europe after all.

I see at least two major problems with that:

1. Ireland's 88% support for the EU makes Scotland's 62% look divided and indecisive.

2. It really didn't end well the last time the UK tried to keep Ireland in the Union.


Why should we ask other countries to compromise themselves to clear up a mess that is entirely our doing?

brynpoeth
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Re: ** The Brexit Thread ** - 'Brexit Means Brexit'

Postby brynpoeth » 16 Feb 2019, 8:48am

Plus One for unicorns and other queer beasts
The story of unicorns describes narwhales who have a long tusk in the middle of their forehead, or it could have been a deer with asymmetrical antlers
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Cunobelin
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Re: ** The Brexit Thread ** - 'Brexit Means Brexit'

Postby Cunobelin » 16 Feb 2019, 9:44am

Someone mention Unicorns......







mercalia
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Re: ** The Brexit Thread ** - 'Brexit Means Brexit'

Postby mercalia » 16 Feb 2019, 10:19am

an interesting article why some parts of the country voted for Brexit and were JUSTIFIED in doing so: they are not crazies who dont have 2 brain cells to rub together

"Some Bostonians will remember a time when farmers employed locally born people as seasonal workers and say, “We did it then, and when this lot go we can do it again.” But that misunderstands the nature of modern agriculture and the transformation of farms into the domestic equivalent of the colonial plantation, demanding a constantly available supply of labour prepared to work long, physically taxing shifts in bad weather, and therefore usually recruited via gangmasters and their scouts from poorer and more vulnerable populations elsewhere.......

Migration accounts for Boston’s swollen population, its high rents and house prices relative to other parts of Lincolnshire, and, for a time, it led to overcrowded doctors’ surgeries and schools. Post-referendum, it seems surprising that governments cared so little about these effects. "


https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/feb/16/trip-london-lincolnshire-brexit-divide?utm_term=RWRpdG9yaWFsX0d1YXJkaWFuVG9kYXlVS19XZWVrZW5kLTE5MDIxNg%3D%3D&utm_source=esp&utm_medium=Email&utm_campaign=GuardianTodayUK&CMP=GTUK_email

PDQ Mobile
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Re: ** The Brexit Thread ** - 'Brexit Means Brexit'

Postby PDQ Mobile » 16 Feb 2019, 11:56am

^^^
I am not surprised at all that this Govt. took little notice and put in in little or no extra funding for cultural problems resulting from high percentages of EU workers and their families in such an area as Boston.

Such a measure requires a degree of competence and perspicuity that this ( and other) UK Govts. find completely beyond their capability or understanding.
Indeed as long as cheap food lies on the shelves what lies behind it in terms of poor conditions (and other stuff) for workers is but a trifle.

The quoted article does state that the last Labour Govt. had earmarked some £50 million to "ease the impact of migration on public services" but the Tory Govt. ( coalition) scrapped it when they came to power.
No surprises there then.

This Govt. Gives not a jot about workers rights.
Indeed it will use Brexit as an excuse to erode them as financial constraints become "imperatives".

It will exploit Brexit, in whatever form it takes, to line the pockets of Foxy, ReesMogg and a host of other selfish and immoral characters at it's rotten heart.
They will sit, Gollum like, on the sidelines plotting and studying the movements of currencies and commodities and speculate huge sums of greedily acquired wealth on those movements.
They will use post Brexit deregulation of arms sales to sell to rich and dodgy sheiks and think nothing of the suffering caused thereby.
And they will give little or nothing back to the UK's population at large.

NickWi
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Re: ** The Brexit Thread ** - 'Brexit Means Brexit'

Postby NickWi » 16 Feb 2019, 1:24pm

Cunobelin wrote:
mjr wrote:
NickWi wrote:On a similar note, why doesn't the UK Government simply ask Ireland to re-join the Union that is the United Kingdom? After all it worked well with the reunification of Germany and we could claim we were simply following a successful example of an EU partnership and Britain wasn’t the bad boy of Europe after all.

I see at least two major problems with that:

1. Ireland's 88% support for the EU makes Scotland's 62% look divided and indecisive.

2. It really didn't end well the last time the UK tried to keep Ireland in the Union.


Why should we ask other countries to compromise themselves to clear up a mess that is entirely our doing?


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarcasm But if you have to explain it, it's normally lost on those who never got it in the first place.

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Cugel
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Re: ** The Brexit Thread ** - 'Brexit Means Brexit'

Postby Cugel » 16 Feb 2019, 2:52pm

PDQ Mobile wrote:^^^
I am not surprised at all that this Govt. took little notice and put in in little or no extra funding for cultural problems resulting from high percentages of EU workers and their families in such an area as Boston.

Such a measure requires a degree of competence and perspicuity that this ( and other) UK Govts. find completely beyond their capability or understanding.
Indeed as long as cheap food lies on the shelves what lies behind it in terms of poor conditions (and other stuff) for workers is but a trifle.

The quoted article does state that the last Labour Govt. had earmarked some £50 million to "ease the impact of migration on public services" but the Tory Govt. ( coalition) scrapped it when they came to power.
No surprises there then.

This Govt. Gives not a jot about workers rights.
Indeed it will use Brexit as an excuse to erode them as financial constraints become "imperatives".

It will exploit Brexit, in whatever form it takes, to line the pockets of Foxy, ReesMogg and a host of other selfish and immoral characters at it's rotten heart.
They will sit, Gollum like, on the sidelines plotting and studying the movements of currencies and commodities and speculate huge sums of greedily acquired wealth on those movements.
They will use post Brexit deregulation of arms sales to sell to rich and dodgy sheiks and think nothing of the suffering caused thereby.
And they will give little or nothing back to the UK's population at large.


The Bostonian-Lambeth meetings, representing the largest % leaver voting area and the largest & remainer voting area respectively, have managed to garner a bit of common understanding. Well - the Remainers at least understand the Leaver motives a bit better (not sure of vice-versa).

But the Bostonian reasons for wanting to leave the EU are not very well though through. The culprit that is causing locally high amounts of problematic immigration of the type described is not due to the EU per se but to the economic practices of those growers employing the immigrants as very cheap labour. The immigrants are, like the Bostonian locals, simply trying to make a living.

Surely it's obvious that the culprit is essentially the regime that allows rich growers to exploit the labour force (locals or immigrant) in these ways? And the regime that allows landlords and other parasites to worsen the situation as they too jump on the exploit-'em gravy train.

But the Bostonians can see only the immediate element in their economic problem - the immigrants "taking our jobs". In practice the Bostonians can't afford to take those jobs - not at the very poor rate they pay and conditions they offer. They would not be able to live. The government would withhold their benefits, such as they are. The Bostonians too would soon all be living in rented hovels or gang-master huts.

The problem is neo-liberal economics along with the support for that exploitative and damaging system by UK (and other EU national) governments over the past three decades. The answer is not to make the EU a scapegoat but to deal with the syndicates who have suborned both commerce and government in favour of the modern-day laissez-faire exploitations that belong in the dark days of Victorian satanic mills and workhouses, not in this supposedly modern and enlightened society of free citizens.

Expunging neo-liberalism would be a far more likely outcome of an EU-wide effort than it would be of a Tory Little Britain. In fact, Tory Little Britain will make it 10X worse, as you suggest.

Cugel

mercalia
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Re: ** The Brexit Thread ** - 'Brexit Means Brexit'

Postby mercalia » 17 Feb 2019, 1:02pm

I thought the silly season was the summer?
Sunday Express
silly season.JPG


and not so silly

Sunday Times
rich.JPG

He only recently got his Knighthood :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:
What makes me laugh he got his title for "services to business" :shock:
Last edited by mercalia on 17 Feb 2019, 5:42pm, edited 1 time in total.

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mjr
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Re: ** The Brexit Thread ** - 'Brexit Means Brexit'

Postby mjr » 17 Feb 2019, 4:14pm

How many supporters of brexit have to move their money out of the country before the 99% of the 52% realise they've been conned by the reactionary elite?
MJR, mostly pedalling 3-speed roadsters. KL+West Norfolk BUG incl social easy rides http://www.klwnbug.co.uk
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mercalia
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Re: ** The Brexit Thread ** - 'Brexit Means Brexit'

Postby mercalia » 17 Feb 2019, 5:38pm

My heart bleeds for Porsche buyers, not

"Porsche is warning UK customers they might have to pay 10% extra for cars delivered after Britain leaves the EU."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47270616

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Cunobelin
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Re: ** The Brexit Thread ** - 'Brexit Means Brexit'

Postby Cunobelin » 17 Feb 2019, 6:12pm

Apparently (according to Rees Mogg) delaying Brexit guarantees Tommeh Robinson a parliamentary seat!

reohn2
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Re: ** The Brexit Thread ** - 'Brexit Means Brexit'

Postby reohn2 » 17 Feb 2019, 6:21pm

Cunobelin wrote:Apparently (according to Rees Mogg) delaying Brexit guarantees Tommeh Robinson a parliamentary seat!

Weasels tend to make things up as they go along,Moggie is no different he's the worst kind of capitalist :evil:
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Cugel
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Re: ** The Brexit Thread ** - 'Brexit Means Brexit'

Postby Cugel » 17 Feb 2019, 9:56pm

reohn2 wrote:
Cunobelin wrote:Apparently (according to Rees Mogg) delaying Brexit guarantees Tommeh Robinson a parliamentary seat!

Weasels tend to make things up as they go along,Moggie is no different he's the worst kind of capitalist :evil:


Weasels are nicer than Moggs! I would rescue a weasel from impending harm but would be tempted to leave that Mogg to it's fate, should a particularly savage gilet jaune hove into view bearing a guillotine and a wicker head basket.

On the other hand, a wave of sympathy might overcome me, along with a surely forlorn hope that I could reform the nasty thing or even help it find the missing parts of it's human nature, should I be kind enough to Pimpernel it to safety.

But it would just turn on me, eh? I'd be lucky to get away with just a savage bite at my savings. I might find myself in the garret of Mogg House, reduced to a Mogg-servant on 2s 6d a day with two crusts and some rainwater out of the gutters I had to clean.

Cugel

PS DO you recall the nicer kind of capitalist? I do remember a few from my youth - they made "small businesses" which provided goods and services of quality for fair prices. Now one may only buy landfill dross and the service of having your money stolen by a financial advisor. ..... Or so I used to think.

In West Wales there are still proper business fellows who make things rather than just money. I wondered where they'd all gone.

Cugel


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RickH
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Re: ** The Brexit Thread ** - 'Brexit Means Brexit'

Postby RickH » 18 Feb 2019, 2:23pm


The standout bit for me was
They wonder if it really would be “treacherous”, “anti-democratic” or a violation of the “will of the people” to pause at this political Beachy Head and – at the very least – reflect upon our next steps before we head over the precipice. That’s the great thing about cliffs. You can pull back from oblivion as often as you like. You can jump off only once. (my bold)