Trump Wins!

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Psamathe
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Re: Trump Wins!

Postby Psamathe » 20 Nov 2016, 6:18pm

blackbike wrote:
Psamathe wrote:From the governments Statistics authority own web site, in particular "As we have made clear, the UK’s contribution to the EU is paid after the application of the rebate."
https://www.statisticsauthority.gov.uk/news/uk-statistics-authority-statement-on-the-use-of-official-statistics-on-contributions-to-the-european-union/ wrote:Sir Andrew Dilnot, Chair of the UK Statistics Authority has said today:

Given the high level of public interest in the European Union referendum debate, it is vital that official statistics are used accurately, with important caveats and limitations explained.
The UK Statistics Authority is disappointed to note that there continue to be suggestions that the UK contributes £350 million to the EU each week, and that this full amount could be spent elsewhere (see Annex A).
As we have made clear, the UK’s contribution to the EU is paid after the application of the rebate. We have also pointed out that there are payments received by the UK public and private sectors that are relevant here. The continued use of a gross figure in contexts that imply it is a net figure is misleading and undermines trust in official statistics.


So EU does not take money from the UK, UK gives money to the EU. and the amount paid is the net amount (after the rebate - "UK’s contribution to the EU is paid after the application of the rebate").

Ian


I can't see anything misleading at all. The figure mentioned in the slogan is factually correct for our gross, pre-rebate contribution to Brussels and nobody ever suggested it was the net amount....

The statement is totally untrue. We do not send £350 million a week to the EU. they EU don't take £350 million a week from the UK. The amount we send is the net amount. So the cheque each week (or direct debit or bank transfer) is not for £350 million. It is for a significantly lower amount. So it is a lie (no two ways about it - as stated by the Statistics authority).

The slogan makes no reference to gross or net. It states that we send (or they take) £350 million a week - which is rubbish because it's £350 million minus the rebate.

In fact saying my cucumber at Tesco cost me £10 is more accurate (even though they gave me £9-50 change) because I did actually hand over £10. But in the case of the EU we don't even hand over £350 million a week (as clearly stated by the Statistics Authority).

blackbike wrote:...The fact remains we are obliged to pay £361 million per week and then the EU kindly gives us some of our own money back to fund things we could have funded ourselves using the same cash, but with the condition that the EU gets to put its own symbol on them telling us the outright lie that they are 'EU funded'....

No. You are confusing the rebate with projects in the Uk funded by the EU. We give them/they take £350,000,000 minus rebate. And then on top of that we get even more back through projects fund through the EU,

Your argument is like saying if I hadn't purchased my cucumber in Tesco I would have had £10 to spend on other things - whicg is totally wrong because I'd have only had 50p to spend on other things.

Hence the statement is a total lie. And you have demonstrated how misleading it is through your own misunderstanding (confusing funded projects with the rebate).

Ian

PH
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Re: Trump Wins!

Postby PH » 20 Nov 2016, 6:40pm

blackbike wrote: It promised absolutely nothing and was factually correct.

That sums up the leave case nicely, it promised nothing and it's factually correct, that's what we'll get, nothing.

PDQ Mobile
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Re: Trump Wins!

Postby PDQ Mobile » 20 Nov 2016, 7:21pm

blackbike wrote: It promised absolutely nothing and was factually correct.


It was designed to deceive and it worked.

SpannerGeek
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Re: Trump Wins!

Postby SpannerGeek » 21 Nov 2016, 7:04am

'£350 million' is clearly a sham statistic which only the Redtop skimming idiots would believe. It's what is known in popular journalism circles as a 'BFL'.. A Bare Faced Lie. A bit like 'control of immigration AND access to the single market'. More a political belief system, than factual content. :lol:

Edwards
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Re: Trump Wins!

Postby Edwards » 21 Nov 2016, 8:13am

I am now left wondering who does Blackbikes tax return? :D :roll: :wink:
Keith Edwards
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mjr
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Re: Trump Wins!

Postby mjr » 21 Nov 2016, 8:22am

Edwards wrote:I am now left wondering who does Blackbikes tax return? :D :roll: :wink:

I don't know, but I assume Blackbike gives him/her the gross tax due and then they send the net amount to the Revenue and pocket the difference, hence this confusion!
MJR, mostly pedalling 3-speed roadsters. KL+West Norfolk BUG incl social easy rides http://www.klwnbug.co.uk
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SpannerGeek
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Re: Trump Wins!

Postby SpannerGeek » 21 Nov 2016, 1:55pm

'Mitt Romney most likely to become Trumps Secretary of state.'

Why is this good news? Because it just might mean Trump is more savvy about foreign policy than some/many people might think.

Psamathe
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Re: Trump Wins!

Postby Psamathe » 21 Nov 2016, 5:24pm

Oh dear. Not a good sign
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/people/donald-trump-meets-with-creationist-jerry-falwell-jr-about-possibly-becoming-next-secretary-of-a7430261.html wrote:Donald Trump meets with creationist Jerry Falwell Jr about possibly becoming next Secretary of Education


Ian

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661-Pete
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Re: Trump Wins!

Postby 661-Pete » 21 Nov 2016, 5:54pm

There is nothing, repeat nothing, savvy about DT's policies. He is demonstrating, more and more forcibly every day, that he is what he is. A demagogue and populist. And worse.

There'll probably be a decree, next, that pi = 3 :shock: .
Suppose that this room is a lift. The support breaks and down we go with ever-increasing velocity.
Let us pass the time by performing physical experiments...
--- Arthur Eddington (creator of the Eddington Number).

Psamathe
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Re: Trump Wins!

Postby Psamathe » 21 Nov 2016, 6:05pm

661-Pete wrote:...There'll probably be a decree, next, that pi = 3 :shock: .

Or more likely that π does not exist and is a plot by the Chinese to weaken the US and so it will be banned ...

Ian

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661-Pete
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Re: Trump Wins!

Postby 661-Pete » 21 Nov 2016, 6:07pm

Well I just hope the fleet of presidential limos all get fitted with square wheels...

[edit] Well, would you believe it!
Suppose that this room is a lift. The support breaks and down we go with ever-increasing velocity.
Let us pass the time by performing physical experiments...
--- Arthur Eddington (creator of the Eddington Number).

SpannerGeek
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Re: Trump Wins!

Postby SpannerGeek » 21 Nov 2016, 7:41pm

661-Pete wrote:There is nothing, repeat nothing, savvy about DT's policies. He is demonstrating, more and more forcibly every day, that he is what he is. A demagogue and populist. And worse.

There'll probably be a decree, next, that pi = 3 :shock: .


Romney is Trumps front runner and preferential candidate for the job. It's an extremely shrewd move, and will please the country, as much as it will the stock markets. Something we, in this country don't appreciate about the US situation. Judge the man by what he does, not what the UK press say he does ...

Psamathe
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Re: Trump Wins!

Postby Psamathe » 22 Nov 2016, 9:46am

I see that Trump has now asked for Farage to be appointed UK's ambassador to the US! https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/nov/22/nigel-farage-uk-ambassador-us-donald-trump. Do we get to chose who he appoints as the US's ambassador to the UK ?

It really is becoming a dynasty with appointments as a reward to friends and family.

Ian

SpannerGeek
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Re: Trump Wins!

Postby SpannerGeek » 22 Nov 2016, 12:25pm

Psamathe wrote:I see that Trump has now asked for Farage to be appointed UK's ambassador to the US! https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/nov/22/nigel-farage-uk-ambassador-us-donald-trump. Do we get to chose who he appoints as the US's ambassador to the UK ?

It really is becoming a dynasty with appointments as a reward to friends and family.

Ian


Isn't that exactly how our own House of Lords operates?

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Re: Trump Wins!

Postby PH » 22 Nov 2016, 12:34pm

SpannerGeek wrote:'Mitt Romney most likely to become Trumps Secretary of state.'

Why is this good news? Because it just might mean Trump is more savvy about foreign policy than some/many people might think.

Or it's a simple case of keeping your enemies close, savvy indeed but nothing to do with foreign policy.