Border Force volunteers?

[reohn2]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-42527750

[kwackers]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-42527750

Par for the course.

Any government paid occupation seems to have an understudy that does the same job but gets paid less (or ideally is free).
Classroom helpers, PCSO's etc.
Why not border guards?

[Bonefishblues]

They don't like it up 'em.

[Paulatic]

Give them a backhander I’m sure they aren’t worried about loosing their job or income.

[thirdcrank]

Sunday Mail link alert in this BBC link.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-42527750

This goes to the heart of some ideologies. Properly controlled borders must be central to any tough immigration control policy, but how are they to be achieved? Paying people to do it costs money by definition and the public sector has become one of the few strongholds of organised labour. That's not because public sector workers have traditionally been militant but the greater part of the union movement has been pretty much destroyed.

Volunteer law enforcers have always been a pet Tory policy, generally in the form of special constables but there's sometimes been a mismatch between the glamorous expectations of some volunteers and the reality of the training needed to enforce the criminal law, and also the tedious nature of a lot of routine policing.

It seems from the information about current policy that a lot of smaller entry points go unsupervised. Would zealous volunteers at points of entry be better?
======================================
edit to add
Sorry I didn't spot there was already a thread going.

[Stevek76]

There comes a point where people just have to stop being so cheap and realise that good pubic services are going to need a higher tax burden than the UK currently operates on. I.e. along the lines of Germany or something, not a huge increase.

Can't see volunteer border force working well, bribery potential anyone?

[mercalia]

I am sure lots of supporters of brexit will jump at the chance of keeping johhny forerigner out?

strange seems the word b-r-e-x-i-t-e-e-r-s is now a cuss word andis parsed by this forum as "supporters of Brexit"

[kwackers]

I am sure lots of supporters of brexit will jump at the chance of keeping johhny forerigner out?

strange seems the word b-r-e-x-i-t-e-e-r-s is now a cuss word andis parsed by this forum as "supporters of Brexit"

Same with r-e-m-o-a-n-e-r. Which is now remainer.

Re-moaner is very obviously an insult as it's associated with moaning, in theory brexit-eer can only be an insult if it's also associated with something bad.
Which brings into question the partiality of the forum admins...

[Psamathe]

I am sure lots of supporters of brexit will jump at the chance of keeping johhny forerigner out?
.....

For those'ish reasons I would worry about such a policy. PCSO's I assume are mostly motivated by helping the community, but policing our borders is just subsidising the Government. It would appeal to the more extreme anti-immigrant individuals (rather than Brexit supporters) and so would probably be attracting inappropriate people to undertake such work.

But I then appreciate that thinking thing through is not one of Westminsters skills.

Ian

[thirdcrank]

While PCSO's are not conscripts, they are not volunteers in the sense of being unpaid. They are public sector workers in the same way as the police, although with less historic baggage. Special constables are volunteers in both senses. The legal difference is that PCSO's have few powers although these are probably being increased. (Anybody with a special interest in pavement cycling probably knows that one of their first powers back in the days of their creator, Blunkett, was issuing fixed penalty notices for that offence.) Special constables have most of the powers of the police.

[al_yrpal]

If you came in to British Port from the Channel Islands you used to have to phone up wait 2 hours at the mooring and drop a form into a box as a customs declaration. The customs might or might not turn up, usually not.

There are dozens of small ports, moorings and marinas around the Solent alone that you can arrive at from France, Belgium or Holland. Its a nightmare for the Border Force trying to stop illegal immigrants who may be on board the thousands of boats doing the crossing. In more than 20 years I have been stopped only once and boarded twice by border force in a RIB sent from their cutter off the Needles and once outside Weymouth. The sea border is very porous. No one can track you among the thousands of boats out on a Sunday afternoon. Arrive from abroad, moor up and let your illegals sneak off after dark. Simple.

This is a plan to create uncertainty in the minds of people smugglers using small ports. They wont know if a port is being watched by a zealous volunteer. I think its a low cost deterrent to try to stop more illegals and drugs entering Britain.

Al

[thirdcrank]

... This is a plan to create uncertainty in the minds of people smugglers using small ports. They wont know if a port is being watched by a zealous volunteer. I think its a low cost deterrent to try to stop more illegals and drugs entering Britain. ...

My, rather more jaundiced view, is that it's a plan to fool the bourgeoisie into believing that that something is being done, in much the same way as having people sloping about the streets in hi-viz jackets and peaked caps. The baddies, OTOH, know how generally useless this window-dressing is. To me, that's "simple."

[al_yrpal]

... This is a plan to create uncertainty in the minds of people smugglers using small ports. They wont know if a port is being watched by a zealous volunteer. I think its a low cost deterrent to try to stop more illegals and drugs entering Britain. ...

My, rather more jaundiced view, is that it's a plan to fool the bourgeoisie into believing that that something is being done, in much the same way as having people sloping about the streets in hi-viz jackets and peaked caps. The baddies, OTOH, know how generally useless this window-dressing is. To me, that's "simple."

I partly agree with your cynicism, but how to you police a small port containing 10 yachts of which only two will cross to Europe in the course of a year? Is it better to do absolutely nothing, this crime is on the increase.

Al

[661-Pete]

I am sure lots of supporters of brexit will jump at the chance of keeping johhny forerigner out?

strange seems the word b-r-e-x-i-t-e-e-r-s is now a cuss word andis parsed by this forum as "supporters of Brexit"

Same with r-e-m-o-a-n-e-r. Which is now remainer.

Re-moaner is very obviously an insult as it's associated with moaning, in theory brexit-eer can only be an insult if it's also associated with something bad.
Which brings into question the partiality of the forum admins...

I'd rather not have a 'pop' at the Admins/Mods thanks - it's a hard enough task keeping order as it is, and I think the balance is about right, here.

Regarding that issue which has filled up that thread (way over 300 pages now), I think it's impossible to be 'impartial' in this topic. I can't be. The best one can manage, I suppose, is to not be too extreme.

As to 'cuss word' - well if I want to invoke one, I go and assume my alter ego over at the Grauniad, where I can use a word far more 'lavatorial' than either "Brexit" or "Brexit-eer", and get away with it. It summarises my feelings on the issue pretty exactly!

Anyway - I don't have a problem with the word which I just now hyphenated, being 'on the filter' now. Because it's a word which is never used in any other context anyway. We can live with this surely! My main gripe, way back in my astronomy-forum days, was their censorship of the word "tit" which made posts on bird-watching problematical...

[Bonefishblues]

News just in:

http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/war/ ... 1223141356