Pavement Parking - a device to combat it...

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thirdcrank
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Re: Pavement Parking - a device to combat it...

Postby thirdcrank » 13 Mar 2018, 5:39pm

We've covered this in great detail before with plenty of links.

Footways - originally called "footpaths alongside a road" - were protected from being converted to rights of way for all users, by the creation of the criminal offence which is still used to prosecute pavement cyclists. (You cannot acquire a right through usage to commit a criminal offence.) This is why driving across a footway eg to get to premises is OK because there is a right of way to get in.

Stopping in a vehicle anywhere on a highway including the footway obstructs - in legal jargon - the bit of highway it's standing on. Cauing an unnecessary obstruction is an offence under the Con and Use regs which used to be used routinely to prosecute pavement parking. A series of appeal judgments curtailed the extent of this legislation making it virtually useless. This was also one of the things which the Charity for Pauper Solicitors felt was infra dig.

At one point a local primary school had a flyer produced by the local community police team, saying that anybody parking on the footway should leave space for pedestrians to pass, and almost begging people to comply or they would have to take action.

I can't remember now if I've posted about this but recently I was on y way to the papershop when I met my eldest grandson walking to high school with a couple of his pals. A driver coming up behind them gave a toot on the horn and I thought it was somebody they knew offering them a lift, but it was a couple of local authority care workers warning them they were about to drive onto the pavement and they were in the way. It's hard to imagine it getting much worse. But it will.

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Cunobelin
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Re: Pavement Parking - a device to combat it...

Postby Cunobelin » 13 Mar 2018, 5:52pm

I remember one School reported back in the late 70's (it is not a new problem)

The school decided to educate the children as to how dangerous it was to park on the pavements, block the zebra crossing, and then sent the children into te fray.

There were multiple complaints about the children telling their parents off and refusing to leave the car until it was parked legally and safely

Eventually it was dropped because of the unpopularity with the parents who felt they were being undermined

Novel idea though

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Cunobelin
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Re: Pavement Parking - a device to combat it...

Postby Cunobelin » 13 Mar 2018, 6:12pm

pete75 wrote:We already have a device to combat pavement parking - all that's needed is the will.


Image



I have posted this before...

Image

This used to be a regular issue clearly multiple offences so easy to deal with..... but apparently not

Police can't deal with as parking is decriminalised and it has to be dealt with by the City Council
City Council cannot deal with it because he is parked on a pavement therefore it is obstruction and a Police matter
Police still cannot deal with it because although it is on a pavement and causing an obstruction, the yellow lines legally cover the pavement area, this means that it is a simple parking issue and they cannot deal with it.
City Council deny that responsibility as the obstruction makes it criminal and outside their jurisdiction.


Take a new angle and report to the Police for parking within the zig-zag lines........
Police cannot deal with this as the yellow lines are the key factor and trump the zig-zag lines, therefore they are powerless to intervene and Council must deal with it

Similar refusals to deal with the fact they were obstruction a dropped kerb and also the access to businesses

So after 6 months basically no-one in authority could be bothered to deal with the issue

Eventually solved in a devious way.

Apparently the "Cab License" has some interesting small print.

Report the Taxi for breaching their "Duty of Care" and failing to observe the conditions of their license. All it took was a few weeks of the drivers being issued penalty points and the problem was resolved

pete75
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Re: Pavement Parking - a device to combat it...

Postby pete75 » 13 Mar 2018, 6:16pm

Those yellow lines are not legal anyway - too narrow.

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Cunobelin
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Re: Pavement Parking - a device to combat it...

Postby Cunobelin » 13 Mar 2018, 6:20pm

My favourite solution was an Artist who exhibited at the University of Southampton's Hansard Gallery

Now I am not a great fan of modern art or "installations, but this as a solution to parking near the gallery is pure genius:

Park your car on the grass:


Image

Image

Then claim it is in fact a part time sculpture

Image



... and he got away with it!!!!!

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cyclemad
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Re: Pavement Parking - a device to combat it...

Postby cyclemad » 13 Mar 2018, 7:23pm

just seen the original post...what a stupid ''invention''

Supposed a person is running along at night in lightweight thin soled training shoes....steps on device.....OUCH !!!!!!

Emergency vehicles won't like it either


waste of time and effort.

AlaninWales
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Re: Pavement Parking - a device to combat it...

Postby AlaninWales » 14 Mar 2018, 9:19am

cyclemad wrote:just seen the original post...what a stupid ''invention''

Supposed a person is running along at night in lightweight thin soled training shoes....steps on device.....OUCH !!!!!!

Emergency vehicles won't like it either


waste of time and effort.

It would probably help if you actually read the description. Pedestrians, prams and buggies are too light to activate the device. someone in thin-soled shoes could stamp on one all day and be unaffected.

Emergency vehicles should be in the road. Cars causing an obstruction to emergency vehicles on the road simply need removing.

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Mick F
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Re: Pavement Parking - a device to combat it...

Postby Mick F » 14 Mar 2018, 10:37am

pete75 wrote:Those yellow lines are not legal anyway - too narrow.
Do you have facts on this?

The road up to Gunnislake from the bridge over the river has been resurfaced recently, and they've put the double yellow lines as narrow ones. The road is narrow, so the lines are narrow?

This is a pre-resuface picture.
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@50.52811 ... 312!8i6656
Mick F. Cornwall

thirdcrank
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Re: Pavement Parking - a device to combat it...

Postby thirdcrank » 14 Mar 2018, 10:43am

The days of firemen leaping out of fire engines to bounce cars out of their road, or getting their choppers out to break car side-windows may be history. I'm sure I linked somewhere to a news item about some brigades getting narrower fire engines. We've also had publicity about several instances of angry residents leaving angry notes for ambulance crews about "inconsiderate" parking.

FWIW, the HC advises against mounting the pavement to let the drivers of emergency vehicles overtake.

pwa
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Re: Pavement Parking - a device to combat it...

Postby pwa » 14 Mar 2018, 12:39pm

thirdcrank wrote:The days of firemen leaping out of fire engines to bounce cars out of their road, or getting their choppers out to break car side-windows may be history. I'm sure I linked somewhere to a news item about some brigades getting narrower fire engines. We've also had publicity about several instances of angry residents leaving angry notes for ambulance crews about "inconsiderate" parking.

FWIW, the HC advises against mounting the pavement to let the drivers of emergency vehicles overtake.


The HC doesn't imagine all the circumstances we find on the road. If the pavement is clear and putting a couple of wheels on it will allow an ambulance on blue lights to pass easier, that's what I would do. Carefully.

iandriver
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Re: Pavement Parking - a device to combat it...

Postby iandriver » 14 Mar 2018, 1:46pm

I can think of places where these would be useful. We have problems here outside the city where 2.5 meter wide paths have been built next to main roads. Some lorries park in the lay-bys overnight. To get away from the road as far as they can will commonly block the whole path off, forcing you into 60mph oncoming traffic.
Supporter of the A10 corridor cycling campaign serving Royston to Cambridge http://a10corridorcycle.com. Never knew gardening secateurs were an essential part of the on bike tool kit until I took up campaigning.....

thirdcrank
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Re: Pavement Parking - a device to combat it...

Postby thirdcrank » 14 Mar 2018, 3:58pm

The HC is only advice, of course, but it does seem clear to me. So, get snapped by a traffic light camera and expect no quarter. The evidence is likely to be much less clear-cut with driving onto the footway, but if something were to go wrong, there'd be plenty of quoting from the HC.

Rule 219
Emergency and Incident Support vehicles.


You should look and listen for ambulances, fire engines, police, doctors or other emergency vehicles using flashing blue, red or green lights and sirens or flashing headlights, or traffic officer and incident support vehicles using flashing amber lights. When one approaches do not panic. Consider the route of such a vehicle and take appropriate action to let it pass, while complying with all traffic signs. If necessary, pull to the side of the road and stop, but try to avoid stopping before the brow of a hill, a bend or narrow section of road. Do not endanger yourself, other road users or pedestrians and avoid mounting the kerb. Do not brake harshly on approach to a junction or roundabout, as a following vehicle may not have the same view as you. (My emphasis.)

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Pastychomper
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Re: Pavement Parking - a device to combat it...

Postby Pastychomper » 14 Mar 2018, 4:04pm

I loved the idea of the "Catclaw" until I started thinking about weights. Maybe the designer has thought about something I haven't (which is likely), but I can't see how to make it both safe for pedestrians and effective against cars.

I'm assuming the dome is held up by something like a spring, which will be pushed down if enough force lands on it. Where is the cut-off?

Suppose it was at 300kg sitting weight. I weigh about 106kg, so I'd be safe even standing on one foot, but what about running? A quick web search tells me that in a runner who heel-strikes, the force on the heel with each step equates to 1.5 - 3 times the person's bodyweight. If I happen to be at the upper end of that range, that could hurt.

Another quick search and the first "small car" name I find is Ford Fiesta, and the first figures for a Fiesta are: kerb weight 1011kg, weight distribution 59/41, making 298kg per front tyre on level ground. It won't get punctured even if all the weight on the tyre is balanced on the "claw".

Tbf, the driver's weight would probably push it over the threshold in my example, but it's too narrow a window. I can see a "lorry" version would be good, but generally I'd prefer good old-fashioned bollards.
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Cyril Haearn
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Re: Pavement Parking - a device to combat it...

Postby Cyril Haearn » 14 Mar 2018, 4:43pm

Bollards, high kerbs, walls to keep the terrorists away
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cyclemad
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Re: Pavement Parking - a device to combat it...

Postby cyclemad » 15 Mar 2018, 12:07am

AlaninWales wrote:
cyclemad wrote:just seen the original post...what a stupid ''invention''

Supposed a person is running along at night in lightweight thin soled training shoes....steps on device.....OUCH !!!!!!

Emergency vehicles won't like it either


waste of time and effort.

It would probably help if you actually read the description. Pedestrians, prams and buggies are too light to activate the device. someone in thin-soled shoes could stamp on one all day and be unaffected.

Emergency vehicles should be in the road. Cars causing an obstruction to emergency vehicles on the road simply need removing.


my sincere and humble apology...... I am in our debt for evermore for pointing out the error of my ways :roll: