Who agrees with Boris?

[Thornyone]

I am generally no fan of Boris Johnson but I must say that I do agree with his comments on Muslim women wearing the veil and hope that he stands by them. Wearing of the veil is not, as far as I can make out, a requirement of the Koran. The issue of the veil is always presented in our media as if the only question that matters is whether a woman chooses to wear it, or whether she is coerced into it. If she chooses to wear it, then all is fine, it would seem. But this ignores some other pretty fundamental points, like security, good community relations and human interactions. And being able to identify people: twice in the last couple of days I have been subject, whilst cycling, to inconsiderate driving by women wearing the veil, who I could not possibly have identified even had they got out of their vehicles.

I find it rather ironic that one of Boris’s most vocal critics is Baroness Warsi, a Muslim woman who seems to have no problem with leaving her head entirely uncovered.

[Cunobelin]

The issue is that the point was masked by the way it was presented, and the person who presented it

The Boris haters are rubbing their hands in glee and promoting an opportunity to have a go, and there are other pressure groups are equally happy to divert attention to teh controversy


All of which means a serious discussion that has to happen at some time is being shouted down.

[Thornyone]

The issue is that the point was masked by the way it was presented, and the person who presented it

The Boris haters are rubbing their hands in glee and promoting an opportunity to have a go, and there are other pressure groups are equally happy to divert attention to teh controversy


All of which means a serious discussion that has to happen at some time is being shouted down.

Yes, I certainly agree with yout points here. The problem is that I don’t think that the serious discussion is ever going to happen. Some years ago Jack Straw raised the issue of asking a veil-wearer to remove her covering in his constituency surgery, to make communication easier for him. I seem to recall that at the first whiff of criticism he then backtracked. Now we simply hear the absurd cry of “Islamaphobia” when any controversial issue touching on Islam is raised. (Absurd because using the term “Islamaphobia” to mean anti-Muslim prejudice, as some Muslims (and frequently, non-Muslim liberals) now do, is a way of denying the existence of any problems created by (some) adherents of Islam themselves.

[pete75]

As far as I concerned people can dress how they like and certainly shouldn't be mocked for it by senior if slightly stupid politicians. The OP's point about not being able to recognise drivers who he claims drive poorly near him equally applies to motorcyclists who wear full face crash helmets.There are a lot more of them on the road. Would he want to ban those helmets.
The reference to Baroness Warsi is a red herring - the wearing of the veil or the headscarf is not compulsory for all though some interpretations says it is.
Years ago , in 1974 I think, compulsory crash helmets for motorcyclists were introduced. Sikhs were granted an exemption to this law on the grounds that many wore Turbans for religious regions. Not all Sikhs wear turbans so this is also a matter of choice. Shows how Britain has changed. Back then laws were amended so that people could wear what they thought their religion demanded whereas know some are calling for laws to be enacted to prevent similar for Muslim women.

Another poster claims "All of which means a serious discussion that has to happen at some time is being shouted down." because of attacks on what Johnson said. He actually said "look like letter boxes" which is hardly teh stuff of serious discussion.

[Thornyone]

As far as I concerned people can dress how they like and certainly shouldn't be mocked for it by senior if slightly stupid politicians. The OP's point about not being able to recognise drivers who he claims drive poorly near him equally applies to motorcyclists who wear full face crash helmets.There are a lot more of them on the road. Would he want to ban those helmets.
The reference to Baroness Warsi is a red herring - the wearing of the veil or the headscarf is not compulsory for all though some interpretations says it is.
Years ago , in 1974 I think, compulsory crash helmets for motorcyclists were introduced. Sikhs were granted an exemption to this law on the grounds that many wore Turbans for religious regions. Not all Sikhs wear turbans so this is also a matter of choice. Shows how Britain has changed. Back then laws were amended so that people could wear what they thought their religion demanded whereas know some are calling for laws to be enacted to prevent similar for Muslim women.

Another poster claims "All of which means a serious discussion that has to happen at some time is being shouted down." because of attacks on what Johnson said. He actually said "look like letter boxes" which is hardly teh stuff of serious discussion.

I think that Yasmin Alibhai-Brown made quite a few good points here:
https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/co ... 61444.html
Not sure whether describing someone as a “raven” is more or less “insulting” than saying they look like letter boxes. Re motorcyclists, a motorcyclist with distinctive helmet and leathers might well be easier to describe than a woman in a burka. As for how many drivers in veils one sees, it clearly depends where one lives. They are not uncommon in my neck of the woods.

[Ben@Forest]

I am generally no fan of Boris Johnson but I must say that I do agree with his comments on Muslim women wearing the veil and hope that he stands by them...

His article though said that that women should be allowed to wear the burqa, his comment was (paraphrased) it may look silly, but if they want to wear it they should be allowed to.

The question that arises with this is that if he's not allowed to write this then there should be no comments on women wearing stripper shoes, or short skirts, or even Lady Gaga's meat dress. Or men wearing three-quarter length trousers, or sarongs or even (shock horror) middle-aged men in lycra. As has been said the burqa is not a religious requirement, it is a cultural legacy - as is all fashion.

[pete75]

The question that arises with this is that if he's not allowed to write this then there should be no comments ........ Or men wearing three-quarter length trousers

I agree with much of what you said there are limits

[roubaixtuesday]

It would be perfectly possible for Boris to write a thoughtful article about the balance between defending women from the imposition of dress codes and defending their right to dress as they please. He chose not to.

The context is that women have been assaulted in the street for wearing these garments and Muslims generally are subject to significant prejudice. Boris is deliberately stirring this up this racism and Islamophobia to his personal advantage. He transparently cares naught for these women, but everything for his own ambitions.

Imagine if someone in the Labour party had written similar about Jewish traditional dress?

Boris is a disgrace. He should be subject to disciplinary action from the conservative party.

[bovlomov]

It is impossible to answer the question 'Who agrees with Boris?' because Boris has no beliefs, and what he says changes from moment to moment.

Johnson is an unprincipled liar. Everything he does is calculated - albeit often badly - to be best for himself, and nothing he says should be taken at face value. He doesn't give a toss about Muslims, face covering, liberty, religion, British values or community cohesion. He doesn't give a toss about you or me.

You'd think that people would stop listening to someone who has told so many lies and squandered so much public money. There are plenty of people with interesting things to say about Islam, religious dress and liberty. Johnson isn't one of them.

[thirdcrank]

I looked at this and decided I couldn't be bothered to reply, but I'd now like to thank bovlomov for taking the time to post what I would have said.

[NATURAL ANKLING]

Hi,
Like most religion's, its two faced.
In public they cover up but at home.............................its western talk and western clothes and western.............sins...............

Boris says what a lot of people think but could not put it across without being accused of being racist!

I think if boris was PM we would not be in limbo with EU and their ducking and diving and abuse.

May will be remembered for fudging the affair.

[bovlomov]

Boris says what a lot of people think...

But he's not thinking what they think.

Whoever these people are, their thoughts are tainted when filtered through Johnson's ego. If they need someone to speak for them, they should find someone honest and credible.

[661-Pete]

Boris would be welcomed with open arms by the EDL, for what he's done. If he's not already a card-carrying member that is.

All I can say is, he disgusts me.

[kwackers]

bovlomov sums it up pretty well.

Boris is a understudy of Trump, he looks at Trumps success in the US of playing to the lowest common denominator and thinks "me too"!

FWIW, his comment of saying they look like pillar boxes appealed my childish side and made me snigger, but then I also think it completely inappropriate for a member of government to make such a comment - but then these aren't normal times.

Personally I lump them with every other daft form of clothing people wear and I think trying to make out that anyone that thinks calling them stupid looking is Islamophobic is both wrong and plays to the far right.

[landsurfer]

Boris would be welcomed with open arms by the EDL, for what he's done. If he's not already a card-carrying member that is.

All I can say is, he disgusts me.

Because of what he said or because he is a Tory ?
If it is because of what he said i assume you are in favour of banning the Burqa.