Speed Awareness Course

[mjr]

Except that the blasé claim they did not work was not evidence based , the "blasé" claim that they are of benefit was evidenced...personal conjecture falls far short of evidence that they don't work.

If you mean my claim that they do not work, then that is evidence based: 21% caught reoffending means it does "not work" IMO. YMMV.

Where's the benefit? Are those courses at least cheaper for the public purse than points and fines? Claiming benefit seems not evidence-based to me.

[pwa]

Mjr, wasn't it you who thought cycling on the road with your hearing impaired by earphones is okay But you fret about a satnav potentially obstructing my view!
I put my satnav where it does not get in the way. You would have to sit in my seat with your eyes exactly where mine are to see what I mean. It is a lot less of a problem in that regard than the pillars or the wing mirrors. More like an old tax disc. And although it is stuck to the glass it is a small unit and very low down, touching the dash. I could fiddle with it while driving, but I don't. I'd like one that I can see though, displayed on the screen, but I don't have one like that. I wonder if that would work in bright sunshine.

[Flinders]

Mjr, wasn't it you who thought cycling on the road with your hearing impaired by earphones is okay But you fret about a satnav potentially obstructing my view!
I put my satnav where it does not get in the way. You would have to sit in my seat with your eyes exactly where mine are to see what I mean. It is a lot less of a problem in that regard than the pillars or the wing mirrors. More like an old tax disc. And although it is stuck to the glass it is a small unit and very low down, touching the dash. I could fiddle with it while driving, but I don't. I'd like one that I can see though, displayed on the screen, but I don't have one like that. I wonder if that would work in bright sunshine.

I keep mine in a similar place. The only view it interferes with is the view of the bonnet of my car. I place it where I can't reach it when driving- this was on the advice of a friend, who said, do that, and you will never be tempted to/by instinct try to touch it when driving.
As for looking at it, I only look at it when either stopped, or a very quick glance to get a picture of the road layout coming up at junctions, and only then when it is safe to do so. My eyes spend less time on it that they would spend reading the signage to get me round the junction. Overall, I think I have my eyes on the road a higher proportion of the time when using it, as the audio directions are often enough on their own, and make a very fast glance at the satnav a lot faster than reading and trying to sort out what can be complex (and not always helpful) signs on the approach to a junction. But then, I'm very fast at taking in a visual image, and good at holding a picture in my mind.

[Cunobelin]

..
..
Skoda's are a much derided "joke" vehicle at the bottom of teh automotive food chain. If they have this feature then it's a good bet most "superior" makes will have it. A Skoda Superb(I love their irony in choosing that name) is fairly cheap as cars go. The one we have is a 2016 model and cost under £15,000 when bought in May.

I thought skodas were just cheap volkswagens or audis, decades ago they were poor quality maybe
15000 seems a lot to me, one can get a decent vehicle for a couple of thousand
There is or was a skoda "Favorit" too, a lovely name

Anyone in the trade share my opinion of skodas?

Essentially, there are a few chassis that have different bodywork and trim... for example "City Cars"

Ford KA and the Fiat 500 are the same vehicle
Skoda City and Volkswagen "UP" are the same vehicle
The Kia Picanto and the Hyundai i10 are the same vehicle
The Toyota Aygo and Peugeot 107 Citroen C1 are the same vehicle

[pete75]

Satnavs should be attached to the dash like other instruments IMO, not obstructing any part of the windscreen. Is anyone making a head-up display sat nav yet? That sort of see-through image should be the only legal way to display it on the windscreen.

Satnavs are part of the dash - at least on all teh cars I've had with them. Certainly it's the case with Skoda, Mercedes and Peugeot. Can't see why any manufacturer would want to put them where they obstruct the windscreen.

[sjs]

Satnavs should be attached to the dash like other instruments IMO, not obstructing any part of the windscreen. Is anyone making a head-up display sat nav yet? That sort of see-through image should be the only legal way to display it on the windscreen.

Satnavs are part of the dash - at least on all teh cars I've had with them. Certainly it's the case with Skoda, Mercedes and Peugeot. Can't see why any manufacturer would want to put them where they obstruct the windscreen.

You do know it's possible to buy separate devices called satnavs and stick them wherever one wants?

[Cunobelin]

Satnavs should be attached to the dash like other instruments IMO, not obstructing any part of the windscreen. Is anyone making a head-up display sat nav yet? That sort of see-through image should be the only legal way to display it on the windscreen.

Satnavs are part of the dash - at least on all teh cars I've had with them. Certainly it's the case with Skoda, Mercedes and Peugeot. Can't see why any manufacturer would want to put them where they obstruct the windscreen.

You do know it's possible to buy separate devices called satnavs and stick them wherever one wants?

.... and that installed SatNavs are only available in higher end models for most cars

..... or that when fitted, these are now usually hand operated "Infotainment" systems that the SatNav is only part of the system, including operation of your phone and texting?



The advice is to switch off your phone and place it in the glove compartment - whilst the manufacturer's have essentially chosen to make the phone part of your normal driving


Note this is just page 1 of the menu of options to detract from your driving



However it would explain the TRL findings about increased overall stopping distances, as they are exactly the type of source distracting drivers and increasing reaction times

[pwa]

Satnavs should be attached to the dash like other instruments IMO, not obstructing any part of the windscreen. Is anyone making a head-up display sat nav yet? That sort of see-through image should be the only legal way to display it on the windscreen.

Satnavs are part of the dash - at least on all teh cars I've had with them. Certainly it's the case with Skoda, Mercedes and Peugeot. Can't see why any manufacturer would want to put them where they obstruct the windscreen.

In the raised position you don't take your eyes off the road completely to glance at the satnav. Your peripheral vision is still able to take in road info at that moment. Looking down at the dash takes your eyes away from the road. So there is a price to pay for that lower position.

[landsurfer]

My Pioneer sat nav allows me to turn off the visuals while the lady tells me which direction to go .... minimal distraction.

[pete75]

Satnavs should be attached to the dash like other instruments IMO, not obstructing any part of the windscreen. Is anyone making a head-up display sat nav yet? That sort of see-through image should be the only legal way to display it on the windscreen.

Satnavs are part of the dash - at least on all teh cars I've had with them. Certainly it's the case with Skoda, Mercedes and Peugeot. Can't see why any manufacturer would want to put them where they obstruct the windscreen.

You do know it's possible to buy separate devices called satnavs and stick them wherever one wants?

Why bother when the manufacturer chooses to supply you with one.

[pete75]

.... and that installed SatNavs are only available in higher end models for most cars

Not true. We had a little Peugeot 2008 - a cheap car well towards the bottom of the manufacturers range. It had built in Satnav.

..... or that when fitted, these are now usually hand operated "Infotainment" systems that the SatNav is only part of the system, including operation of your phone and texting?

Yes I'm fully aware of these things , have cars with so equipped and am not a keyboard warrior who needs to go surfing the net to find pictures of them and details which may or may not be accurate. We have two cars with them and both can be voice controlled. They can also be operated from steering wheel mounted controls.

[sjs]

Satnavs are part of the dash - at least on all teh cars I've had with them. Certainly it's the case with Skoda, Mercedes and Peugeot. Can't see why any manufacturer would want to put them where they obstruct the windscreen.

You do know it's possible to buy separate devices called satnavs and stick them wherever one wants?

Why bother when the manufacturer chooses to supply you with one.

You might bother if
a) The manufacturer chooses not to supply one (still a very common event) or
b) If the manufacturer's one is really not very good, as for instance in my 2017 Merc.

[tatanab]

I have never owned a car with a satnav built in. My most recent car is 10 years old, so possibly too old.
On one occasion I had a rental car with one that the previous user had set up. Consequently it kept telling me to turn around. It took something like 10 minutes going through the handbook and wading deep into the menus to find out how to turn the damned thing off. It should really have had an easily accessibly button.

[pete75]

You do know it's possible to buy separate devices called satnavs and stick them wherever one wants?

Why bother when the manufacturer chooses to supply you with one.

You might bother if
a) The manufacturer chooses not to supply one (still a very common event) or
b) If the manufacturer's one is really not very good, as for instance in my 2017 Merc.

What version? Ours works well.

[sjs]

What version? Ours works well.

c350e, basic satnav version. It's a Garmin, and not as good as the standalone Garmins we've had. Wildly inaccurate arrival time estimates (and not because of traffic conditions), eccentric route choices, failure to recalculate properly if for instance the mode is changed from shortest time to shortest distance, no account taken of road closures it knows about (for instance, on the M4, "road closure, 1 mile. Go straight on for 70 miles"). Nowhere near as good as Google on a mobile phone.