Trains...why?

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reohn2
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Re: Trains...why?

Postby reohn2 » 24 May 2019, 5:06pm

100%JR
I'll leave it at that,I can't be bothered arguing the toss,other than to say I disagree.
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brynpoeth
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Re: Trains...why?

Postby brynpoeth » 30 May 2019, 10:32am

Planning a train trip soon, visiting three places near stations, the trip would be very difficult by car
Plusminus, new trains have been ordered, the 'old' ones could run for many years yet mind (it's the economy, stupid :?), the politrickians do not know the difference between 'more train travel' and 'upgrade from car to train'
Plusplus, the new trains have 1% more seats, not sure how many more places for standees :?
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brynpoeth
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Re: TSOs Train-shaped-objects

Postby brynpoeth » 1 Jun 2019, 7:47am

The North of England Corris-pondent reports in the Grauniad about pacers, (TSOs, Train-shaped-objects), they are still giving faithful service but the wheels squeal on curves cos they have rigid chassis, no bogies, the toilets discharge onto the track etc
The NRM in York wanted one to display but UlsterTrains could not spare one, they are still needed until modern trains arrive :?
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mjr
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Re: TSOs Train-shaped-objects

Postby mjr » 1 Jun 2019, 8:26am

brynpoeth wrote:The North of England Corris-pondent reports in the Grauniad about pacers, (TSOs, Train-shaped-objects), they are still giving faithful service but the wheels squeal on curves cos they have rigid chassis, no bogies, the toilets discharge onto the track etc
The NRM in York wanted one to display but UlsterTrains could not spare one, they are still needed until modern trains arrive :?

Reports of passengers stuck on a pacer railbus outside the evacuated and closed Leeds station this week don't make for good reading, with the bus-based train slowly filling with diesel fumes.

Some groups speculate that the locals don't realise that the Mark-3-based Sprinters (aka dogboxes and kennels) aren't pacers and some of them are staying (with toilet waste tanks and access adaptations), so there will be more unhappiness next year.

There is hope, though, with new trains like the IET, Civity and Mark 5 starting service with Northern and TPE. Just needs some more to get rid of the Mark 3s, maybe allowing more to be converted to motor luggage vans containing many bike spaces like the delayed Scotrail ones?
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brynpoeth
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Re: Trains...why?

Postby brynpoeth » 8 Jun 2019, 7:29am

Little-known factoid
Iarnrod Eirann and Ulsterrail trains run on track with a broader gauge than trains in the 'mainland' UK :wink:
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Re: Trains...why?

Postby mjr » 10 Jun 2019, 12:31pm

brynpoeth wrote:Little-known factoid
Iarnrod Eirann and Ulsterrail trains run on track with a broader gauge than trains in the 'mainland' UK :wink:

1600mm (5ft 3in) Irish Broad Gauge instead of 1435 mm (4ft 8½in) standard gauge (or the former 2100mm Brunel Broad Gauge). 1600mm gauge is also used on about 10% of Australia's network and 15% of Brazil's.
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661-Pete
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Re: Trains...why?

Postby 661-Pete » 11 Jun 2019, 12:50pm

Even weirder is the system in Spain: most of their network (and that of Portugal) is built to Iberian Gauge, 1668mm (nearly 5'6"); but their newer high-speed network is built to standard gauge (1435mm - as in Britain and most of Europe). I believe that a train journey from, say, Paris to Madrid, used to involve two gauge changes: a switch to broad-gauge from the Spanish border to Barcelona, then a switch back to standard gauge for the HST. Is this still the case?
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mattheus
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Re: Trains...why?

Postby mattheus » 11 Jun 2019, 2:09pm

I'm picturing Senor Wallace throwing a big lever, and
El Gromitto pushing the wheels of the train apart as they enter Espana.

(hopefully the penguin will help out with some stoking.)

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Re: Trains...why?

Postby mjr » 11 Jun 2019, 4:08pm

661-Pete wrote:I believe that a train journey from, say, Paris to Madrid, used to involve two gauge changes: a switch to broad-gauge from the Spanish border to Barcelona, then a switch back to standard gauge for the HST. Is this still the case?

Not necessarily: there is now a standard gauge high-speed line between Barcelona and Perpignan, connecting AVE to TGV (which are both examples of what some now call VHST to make it clear it's faster than the UK's 1970s HST tech).

mattheus wrote:I'm picturing Senor Wallace throwing a big lever, and
El Gromitto pushing the wheels of the train apart as they enter Espana.

That's pretty much how the Talgo-RD system works, with the wheels independent of the axle. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Variable_gauge
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RickH
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Re: Trains...why?

Postby RickH » 11 Jun 2019, 4:55pm

661-Pete wrote:Even weirder is the system in Spain: most of their network (and that of Portugal) is built to Iberian Gauge, 1668mm (nearly 5'6"); but their newer high-speed network is built to standard gauge (1435mm - as in Britain and most of Europe). I believe that a train journey from, say, Paris to Madrid, used to involve two gauge changes: a switch to broad-gauge from the Spanish border to Barcelona, then a switch back to standard gauge for the HST. Is this still the case?

The thing that fascinates me is the trains they have that can switch guage on the fly, one bogie set at a time, as they pass over a section of special variable width track.

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661-Pete
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Re: Trains...why?

Postby 661-Pete » 11 Jun 2019, 5:55pm

mjr wrote:That's pretty much how the Talgo-RD system works, with the wheels independent of the axle. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Variable_gauge

RickH wrote:The thing that fascinates me is the trains they have that can switch guage on the fly, one bogie set at a time, as they pass over a section of special variable width track.
News to me, never come across this sort of thing. Sounds a bit scary but I suppose the system is well enough tested...
Suppose that this room is a lift. The support breaks and down we go with ever-increasing velocity.
Let us pass the time by performing physical experiments...
--- Arthur Eddington (creator of the Eddington Number).

brynpoeth
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Re: Trains...why?

Postby brynpoeth » 11 Jun 2019, 6:31pm

The gauge is changed at walking speed, doubtless the wheels are locked in place before proceeding at high speed :?
Trains from Western Europe to Moscow change gauge too

Electric locos are clever too, some can run under four different catenary systems
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661-Pete
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Re: Trains...why?

Postby 661-Pete » 11 Jun 2019, 6:45pm

If I'd known this when I was a kid, I could have figured out how to integrate my 'O' gauge clockwork train set with the Hornby Dublo at my friend's*, down the road... :oops: :(

*(His dad was richer than mine...)
Suppose that this room is a lift. The support breaks and down we go with ever-increasing velocity.
Let us pass the time by performing physical experiments...
--- Arthur Eddington (creator of the Eddington Number).

Mike Sales
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Re: Trains...why?

Postby Mike Sales » 11 Jun 2019, 6:47pm

A couple of years ago I wanted to travel to Stornaway.
I used my bus pass to get to Boston. From there the train got me to Inverness by evening of the same day. Two changes, and a restful ride with good views. Without knowledge of the arcane cheap ticket procurement fiddles I was lucky enough pay only £30.
I don't have a car, but this seems cheaper, and I did not want to return the same way in any case.
A bus to Ullapool was about £15 and the ferry trip about the same.
Why trains?

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Mick F
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Re: Trains...why?

Postby Mick F » 12 Jun 2019, 10:07am

We can get to Plymouth from just up the road for a fiver quid return on the train. First train 0600, and last one gets back here 2200. 40min journey each way.

To drive there, would be a 20mile journey each way, including crossing the suspension bridge.
Parking the car would be at least a fiver, crossing the bridge another £1.50, and then there's the petrol and wear and tear.

Getting the bus would entail a trip into Callington - one bus an hour, last one either way at tea-time - 5miles each way.
Then a bus into Plymouth - one every hour or so - last one gets back after the last one home.
I think it would take two or three hours from leaving home to getting to Plymouth, and similar length of time getting back.

Give me the train every time.
Mick F. Cornwall