Beaujo For PM

[merseymouth]

Hello again, "Tories are as tribal as Labour, only more so"? I'm supposed to be the thick one, but that oxymoron beats even my best effort!
Up there with - "I gave my 110%"!
As my teachers often said about me - "Must concentrate, could do better". MM

[Tangled Metal]

There's a lot of people on here with a hope that a new leader will make everything ok again. It is a fantasy view. This is what Brexit is. We voted for it and it is what we were always going to get. Sure a few of the details could be different but the heart and soul of it would always appeal to nobody. There is no good outcome in the short term. No leader or government could change that fact.

There's no change in leader happening this side of Brexit. Get over that idea and move on to something that could work.

There's no renegotiation, rewriting of the withdrawal agreement. Get over that idea and move on to something that could work.

There's going to be no change in direction such as change to Norway + because leavers would not accept it. There's no majority for that in Westminster. Get over that idea and move on to something that could work.

Remain? Majority for that in Westminster I believe. That would need a lot of labour MPs voting with their conscience against their constituents I believe. Party would haemorrhage support doing that. Labour is nothing if not opportunist so they won't do that.

As I said, anyone got any ideas that might work?

[Tangled Metal]

Hello again, "Tories are as tribal as Labour, only more so"? I'm supposed to be the thick one, but that oxymoron beats even my best effort!
Up there with - "I gave my 110%"!
As my teachers often said about me - "Must concentrate, could do better". MM

You're right technically but used as illustrative it gets the meaning across.

It might be my political leanings but I have always seen labour as a party of different tribes. Much more so than tories. Tories tend to be mainstream centre right with a more vocal minority to the right. Their awkward squad if you like. Two groupings. Labour seem to be more divided than that on terms of ideology.

The best I did at school was get 150% of 2/3rds in a test. I even got A for attainment but C for effort in that subject in that year which I never understood. Was that saying that a bit more effort I could get 200% in my test?

[Canuk]

The above is all pretty much wishful thinking territory.
I'm not suggesting she is removed. What I am saying is that you have to remember that no matter how much you love the leader, she's only human.

And most human beings, when faced with the choice of continued horrible humiliations, on an international stage, and the prospect of being made a complete fool of, professionally and privately will choose the path of least resistance. Cracks were definitely evident in her performance on Monday, and most telling was the fact she never mentioned March 29th, not even once, in passing.

Only a lunatic would carry on in her utterly precarious and embarrassing situation. I can't believe that she doesn't have some vestige of pride or self respect left that she wouldnt resign after another huge defeat on Tuesday. I might be wrong on this one, but I just got 4/1 on her resignation by next weekend. I think my moneys safe.

She's only human. How she has managed to stumble on this far is incredible. The woman needs a holiday. Permanently.

[Bonefishblues]

The above is all pretty much wishful thinking territory.
I'm not suggesting she is removed. What I am saying is that you have to remember that no matter how much you love the leader, she's only human.

And most human beings, when faced with the choice of continued horrible humiliations, on an international stage, and the prospect of being made a complete fool of, professionally and privately will choose the path of least resistance. Cracks were definitely evident in her performance on Monday, and most telling was the fact she never mentioned March 29th, not even once, in passing.

Only a lunatic would carry on in her utterly precarious and embarrassing situation. I can't believe that she doesn't have some vestige of pride or self respect left that she wouldnt resign after another huge defeat on Tuesday. I might be wrong on this one, but I just got 4/1 on her resignation by next weekend. I think my moneys safe.

She's only human. How she has managed to stumble on this far is incredible. The woman needs a holiday. Permanently.

May I point out that this is no ordinary politician. This dead woman walks.

[Tangled Metal]

People are only human but I really don't know how TM has managed to last this long. I'm not talking about politically I'm talking about emotionally (phone autocorrect changed that to erotically, I don't want to ever think of her thinking that way). I mean she's under the most intense scrutiny and stress. How has she coped?

Whatever your political or Brexit views you have to admit that she is mentally tough lady! Stress is a big problem in the modern world with work related stress a major problem. How can some cope like she has?

Then there's the emotional aspect. She's had work colleagues talking about heating the knives up and stabbing her in the front so she can see it coming. Or something like that. She's had really terrible press, op-Ed and twitter threads against her. How has she not broken?

[Canuk]

People are only human but I really don't know how TM has managed to last this long. I'm not talking about politically I'm talking about emotionally (phone autocorrect changed that to erotically, I don't want to ever think of her thinking that way). I mean she's under the most intense scrutiny and stress. How has she coped?

Whatever your political or Brexit views you have to admit that she is mentally tough lady! Stress is a big problem in the modern world with work related stress a major problem. How can some cope like she has?

Then there's the emotional aspect. She's had work colleagues talking about heating the knives up and stabbing her in the front so she can see it coming. Or something like that. She's had really terrible press, op-Ed and twitter threads against her. How has she not broken?

My point is that it's finally crunch time, and all her work mad planning and suffering has been in vain. Humiliation her only reward, and next week only more humiliation. She has come to the end of her rope.

She's probably survived this far because she genuinely believed her deal would pull through. Faced with the evidence that is been fundamentally rejected, and by the largest majority in parliamentary history, she'll crumble.

I ask you this: what incentive does she have to keep going. Even that arch fool Cameron pulled the plug when he knew the only way forward was humiliation.

The ego is a powerful thing.

[Bonefishblues]

Because Party Loyalty and duty, as I said previously. The Tories are so riven that she's there purely to stop someone else from being there.

[Canuk]

Because Party Loyalty and duty, as I said previously. The Tories are so riven that she's there purely to stop someone else from being there.

The ego vs loyalty to a political party? Its no contest, the ego wins every time.

[Debs]

Would be a lot wiser to select brother JoJo for PM

But wot has wisdom got to do with it ?

A counter argument to actually having a Primal Ministerial Blond Buffoon is to let him make such humungous horlicks of it the Tory party loose their deposit at the next GE and never get considered for government for a millennium *

*Covenant: As long as he don't inadvertently cause the 3rd world war.

[Bonefishblues]

Because Party Loyalty and duty, as I said previously. The Tories are so riven that she's there purely to stop someone else from being there.

The ego vs loyalty to a political party? Its no contest, the ego wins every time.

Whatever the driver, she was given a vote of confidence by her party only days ago. That was a conscious act by both parties to the deal.

This Week last week (Miranda, IIRC?) made the point that the one thing she doesn't want to do is to go down in history as the Leader under whom the Tory Party split - and nor does the Tory Party want that either. Where one end and the other begins, who knows?

[Tangled Metal]

Why? Because someone has to.

Look she's been at the end of her rope for a long time. She's not jumped ship. If she had done the same sort of outcome would come to get successor. If she does so now nothing changes. The new person is in her situation.

I ask you this, could she be preventing a mentally weaker person having this level of stress? If she stood aside for another person and they lasted no time before running away a gibbering wreck would that help the situation?

BTW I don't think there's anyone in the tory party strong enough to last long enough to see Brexit through. I have this feeling BoJo would quit in her position rather too quickly. I also suspect Corbyn wouldn't cope with it neither. Mcdonnell could. In terms of mental strength I think he's a much a robot as May is.

[Tangled Metal]

Tories have been in power for 8 years. Labour before 13 years. Tories before 18 years. Time served seems to be getting worse or votors memories are getting shorter is another way of looking at it.

To explain, 1997 labour got in with a landslide because the nation was sick of the tories who had run out of steam / ideas. 2010 tories got in with LibDems because the nation were sick of labour. The LDs could have propped up Labour who politically they were closer to but didn't.

Now it's 2019 and because of Brexit people are sick of tories and want a change. But polls still put labour behind or some equal to tories who are universally decried for being divided and unable to deliver on the biggest change this country has been through for decades. IMHO Labour should be so much higher in the polls.

So IMHO the trend to me suggests it's time for labour to take over with it being 8 years. I just can't see the nation going with that if given the choice right now.

[Bonefishblues]

Tories have been in power for 8 years. Labour before 13 years. Tories before 18 years. Time served seems to be getting worse or votors memories are getting shorter is another way of looking at it.

To explain, 1997 labour got in with a landslide because the nation was sick of the tories who had run out of steam / ideas. 2010 tories got in with LibDems because the nation were sick of labour. The LDs could have propped up Labour who politically they were closer to but didn't.

Now it's 2019 and because of Brexit people are sick of tories and want a change. But polls still put labour behind or some equal to tories who are universally decried for being divided and unable to deliver on the biggest change this country has been through for decades. IMHO Labour should be so much higher in the polls.

So IMHO the trend to me suggests it's time for labour to take over with it being 8 years. I just can't see the nation going with that if given the choice right now.

Are you Fiona Bruce?

[bovlomov]

Which way is the liberal elite going to vote in an election? Today there's a quote from a "senior Government minister" about the collapse of the Tory vote in remain areas:

“If you knock on a door and they have books on their shelves, you can be pretty sure these days they’re not voting Tory”.

I don't think these people will be persuaded by a party led by Johnson.