Tory leader - place your bets

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mercalia
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Re: Tory leader - place your bets

Postby mercalia » 24 May 2019, 10:39am

just listening to her exit speech. well she had good crying lessons from her Hollywood friends?

PH
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Re: Tory leader - place your bets

Postby PH » 24 May 2019, 10:40am

Tangled Metal wrote:Not equivalent because the Labour lot were popular. Right now the tories are not. Being in disarray when the party of government has got in on a landslide and with Blairs approval ratings after a long run in power is kind of expected. It's the right time to readjust and reinvent which really needs a period of political oblivion to achieve. Look at Labour before kinnock and later on Blair perhaps.

Fair enough, but you used the word incompetent and I think history will tell that our incompetence in the Middle East far outweighs what's going on today. Also you haven't made any reference to the media, the incompetent Tory leaders didn't also have the press opposing them in the same way that the current Labour Party has. There is no discussion of policy, here being as bad as anywhere else, it's all about the personalities.
As for the need for opposition parties to reorganise, yes point taken, but it took the Tories one term after Attlee's landslide to completely reinvent themselves. They were pretty clueless when Blair was PM, which may in part be because he'd stolen their policies as well as their votes.

Oldjohnw
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Re: Tory leader - place your bets

Postby Oldjohnw » 24 May 2019, 10:44am

pwa wrote:
Tangled Metal wrote:Well I'm possibly the only one here who feels Corbyn's Labour is failing to compete against a shipwreck of a tory party right now in a way that's kind of new. 97 tories opposition isn't as bad because 97 Labour was strong. 2019 Labour is bad because 2019 tories are so very much bad and disintegrating.


I've been talking to someone who has been acting as a counter in the Euro elections and they told me that the Brexit Party looked like the big winner. And this is in South Wales, once regarded as Labour Heartland. People are looking for alternatives and they are not looking towards Labour at the moment.


Labour have been pathetic. An open goal which they miss time after time.

May saw her job as bringing about Brexit. But it was really to bring a country together after a divisive referendum which included a murdered MP. She failed hopelesdly, but I doubt Corbyn would have done better.
John

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Tangled Metal
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Re: Tory leader - place your bets

Postby Tangled Metal » 24 May 2019, 10:47am

Media switched to support labour on 96 iirc. Murdoch's empire and the others last pretty much switched to Labour and against the tories in 97. Back then when most people still hit influenced and got their political news from newspapers. Right now it's likely to be from Facebook.

Corbyn supporting organisations seem to be very adept at issuing social media to influence and gain support. Tories aren't as good at that.

It's different times now and part of that is media influence can come from parties use if social media through proxies more than by newspapers.

Tangled Metal
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Re: Tory leader - place your bets

Postby Tangled Metal » 24 May 2019, 10:55am

It was simply a impossible task. Divided nation can't come together whilst the process of acting on the referendum is in process IMHO. We need closure of the process before healing can happen.

I was on holiday and away from sources of news up in Scotland. Last day I checked Google news. I was surprised to see may as leader. First off I thought tory leadership process would drag on. Second May had a decent rep as a kind of supporting bureaucrat type of politician. Not the vain and arrogant leader you'd expect.

Thirdly it was always going to be a poisoned chalice using the role on at that time. I thought she'd let other politician take it on then step up as a safe pair of hands after we had officially left the EU.

Finally I hoped that Boris or another leave mp got the job and ended their political career on the shipwreck of actually getting out of the EU.

mercalia
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Re: Tory leader - place your bets

Postby mercalia » 24 May 2019, 11:25am

Spinners wrote:I think BJ and JRM will be more interested in becoming the next Tory Leader after the new one. What a desperate situation.

yes who wants to clean up after Cameron AND May inheriting a party that will lose the next election. I wouldnt .The Nasty and Inept party.
On the other hand will add another adjective - the NASTY, INEPT & SILLY party?
Atleast this melodrama is keeping the BBC commentators in a job I see running on about her as if she had just died :roll:

reohn2
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Re: Tory leader - place your bets

Postby reohn2 » 24 May 2019, 11:49am

Oldjohnw wrote:Labour have been pathetic. An open goal which they miss time after time......

Spot on!
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Morzedec
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CURRENT VACANCY

Postby Morzedec » 24 May 2019, 11:57am

It appears that there is now a position soon to fall vacant in the centre of London.

In the interest of all touring cyclists, I herby nominate Mick F for the job.

What?

Tangled Metal
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Re: Tory leader - place your bets

Postby Tangled Metal » 24 May 2019, 12:20pm

reohn2 wrote:
Oldjohnw wrote:Labour have been pathetic. An open goal which they miss time after time......

Spot on!

That's my view too.

These political times really are strange. I'm agreeing with R2 a lot this past year. I think my politics might have reacted to the tory lurch right with a lurch of my own towards the left. If this carries on could I ever end up voting for Corbyn?!!! I shudder at the thought.

BTW I'm as close as I've ever been to voting against the tories but I just can't vote Labour under Corbyn. I need a viable option but there isn't one that stands a chance. I'm in a constituency that's a direct labour / tory battle. There's never any point voting anything else at a GE.

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Mick F
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Re: Tory leader - place your bets

Postby Mick F » 24 May 2019, 1:09pm

Just hearing her speech.

Rubbish!
Shut up and GO.
Mick F. Cornwall

Oldjohnw
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Re: Tory leader - place your bets

Postby Oldjohnw » 24 May 2019, 1:40pm

Tangled Metal wrote:It was simply a impossible task. Divided nation can't come together whilst the process of acting on the referendum is in process IMHO. We need closure of the process before healing can happen.



I agree about the enormity of th task. But May made absolutely no attempt to get people on board. She refused to talk to Labour or indeed anyone until after we were supposed to have left.
John

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Lance Dopestrong
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Re: Tory leader - place your bets

Postby Lance Dopestrong » 24 May 2019, 1:42pm

I see BoJo has had a haircut in a vain attempt to not look as if he slept in a hedge. An attempt to improve his image in readiness for a power grab, or was it simply so long before that he kept standing on it?
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Tangled Metal
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Re: Tory leader - place your bets

Postby Tangled Metal » 24 May 2019, 3:13pm

Oldjohnw wrote:
Tangled Metal wrote:It was simply a impossible task. Divided nation can't come together whilst the process of acting on the referendum is in process IMHO. We need closure of the process before healing can happen.



I agree about the enormity of th task. But May made absolutely no attempt to get people on board. She refused to talk to Labour or indeed anyone until after we were supposed to have left.

How could she? Labour was after so much that tied UK into EU without any control or say. Completely against their manifesto and political outlook. For someone who never liked EU Corbyn's crew really came across as remainer at times. That's the whole strategy really to make it Impossible for tories to be able to cooperate with them.

thirdcrank
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Re: Tory leader - place your bets

Postby thirdcrank » 24 May 2019, 4:33pm

Lance Dopestrong wrote:I see BoJo has had a haircut in a vain attempt to not look as if he slept in a hedge. An attempt to improve his image in readiness for a power grab, or was it simply so long before that he kept standing on it?


... to see ourselves as others see us...

A few weeks agi I was reading a piece about Brexit in the French newspaper Le Monde where he was described as toujours fagoté comme l'as de pique which might be very loosely translated as always looking like a bag of muck tied round the middle
https://www.lemonde.fr/international/ar ... _3210.html

Ben@Forest
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Re: Tory leader - place your bets

Postby Ben@Forest » 24 May 2019, 6:18pm

thirdcrank wrote:A few weeks agi I was reading a piece about Brexit in the French newspaper Le Monde where he was described as toujours fagoté comme l'as de pique which might be very loosely translated as always looking like a bag of muck tied round the middle


Reminds me of a German lecturer l had (as in both German and teaching German). His father had been in the Waffen SS in WW2 (combat engineer). In the late sixties his father admonished his hippy son for his scruffy appearance, to which he replied, 'That's right Dad, Heinrich Himmler always had shiny boots'.

His Dad never questioned his sartorial elegance again.