Recreational drugs

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Psamathe
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Joined: 10 Jan 2014, 8:56pm

Re: Recreational drugs

Postby Psamathe » 4 Aug 2019, 12:23pm

I wonder how much the debate/discussion is complicated due to it be about "drugs". "Drugs" are a very broad range of compounds with vast range of impacts, effects. e.g. earlier this year I was consuming a fair quantity of a Class A drug - easy to do when every hostel has a bowls of the stuff freely available, where every market has the stuff for sale and worst impact was "no effect" (I have no idea if it helped me or had no effect) yet the UK has objected to the drug and lists it Class A.

Ian

Mike Sales
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Joined: 7 Mar 2009, 3:31pm

Re: Recreational drugs

Postby Mike Sales » 4 Aug 2019, 12:30pm

Psamathe wrote:I wonder how much the debate/discussion is complicated due to it be about "drugs". "Drugs" are a very broad range of compounds with vast range of impacts, effects. e.g. earlier this year I was consuming a fair quantity of a Class A drug - easy to do when every hostel has a bowls of the stuff freely available, where every market has the stuff for sale and worst impact was "no effect" (I have no idea if it helped me or had no effect) yet the UK has objected to the drug and lists it Class A.

Ian


And as I said earlier, probably the worst drug problem in the USA (note the singular, that indicates a drug which is not illegal)
is addiction to synthetic opioid painkillers, prescribed by doctors and very lucrative to the manufacturers, who have indulged in some very dodgy marketing techniques.
Of course the addictive nature of oxycontin has also led to a thriving black market.

reohn2
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Joined: 26 Jun 2009, 8:21pm

Re: Recreational drugs

Postby reohn2 » 4 Aug 2019, 12:49pm

Ben@Forest wrote:...... The Association for a Drug-Free Portugal, say 'overall consumption of drugs in the country has actually risen by 4.2 percent since 2001.....

How does that percentage increase in the past 18 years compare with other countries where drugs are illegal?
Are there any figures on that.

Another point which springs to mind is drug related crime figures for countries where drugs legal compared to where they're not?

I have no idea of such figures perhaps someone may know.


The other issue (and this is acknowledged even in a couple of papers I have just read) is that they still require scientific analysis of different narcotic drugs and psychotropic substances before legalisation can be considered because of the health risks involved. Legalising something when you know it shortens people's lives is something governments would be ill-advised to do.


I think it only right that if legalisation of drugs,any drugs not just recreational drugs which touches on Horizon's point,should take place,the effect of those drugs should be take into consideration both on the individual and for the whole of that society.

Taking private motoring as a comparison,it's effects on the individual and society could be made considerably better in a lot different ways,not just KSI's but pollution effects,stress and anxiety related issues,noise levels,the need to build more roads and parking places to meet the demand for increased private car use due to alternative means of transport not being considered or promoted,etc,etc.
I strongly suspect that motoring has a far more immediate,long term and far reaching negative effects on society than illegal drug use does.
Illegal narcotics can ruin lives that's a given but so can private poorly regulated motoring currently witnessed in the UK,if motoring were regulated better than it is presently society would benefit considerably,similarly so currently illegal drugs IMHO.
Last edited by reohn2 on 4 Aug 2019, 1:54pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Mike Sales
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Joined: 7 Mar 2009, 3:31pm

Re: Recreational drugs

Postby Mike Sales » 4 Aug 2019, 12:57pm

Psamathe wrote:. e.g. earlier this year I was consuming a fair quantity of a Class A drug - easy to do when every hostel has a bowls of the stuff freely available, where every market has the stuff for sale and worst impact was "no effect" (I have no idea if it helped me or had no effect) yet the UK has objected to the drug and lists it Class A.

Ian


I am intrigued. I cannot work out what your Class A drug could be.

Class A
Crack cocaine, cocaine, ecstasy (MDMA), heroin, LSD, magic mushrooms, methadone, methamphetamine (crystal meth)
Possession
Up to 7 years in prison, an unlimited fine or both
Supply and production.
Up to life in prison, an unlimited fine or both

Psamathe
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Joined: 10 Jan 2014, 8:56pm

Re: Recreational drugs

Postby Psamathe » 4 Aug 2019, 1:29pm

Mike Sales wrote:
Psamathe wrote:. e.g. earlier this year I was consuming a fair quantity of a Class A drug - easy to do when every hostel has a bowls of the stuff freely available, where every market has the stuff for sale and worst impact was "no effect" (I have no idea if it helped me or had no effect) yet the UK has objected to the drug and lists it Class A.

Ian


I am intrigued. I cannot work out what your Class A drug could be.

Class A
Crack cocaine, cocaine, ecstasy (MDMA), heroin, LSD, magic mushrooms, methadone, methamphetamine (crystal meth)
Possession
Up to 7 years in prison, an unlimited fine or both
Supply and production.
Up to life in prison, an unlimited fine or both

Coca leaf Erythroxylum 1971 the plant from which cocaine is derived

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drugs_controlled_by_the_UK_Misuse_of_Drugs_Act#Class_A_drugs

Ian

brynpoeth
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Joined: 30 Nov 2013, 11:26am

Re: Recreational drugs

Postby brynpoeth » 4 Aug 2019, 1:35pm

I can imagine that the Association for a drug-free Portugal might have an interest, not a financial on€!?

Cannabi$ was legalised in Colorado, looks like a few people are making millions :?

The whole matter is so complicated, no-one knows whether people taking drugs now shall suffer decades later, there are so many different societies
I think comparisons between US states with different laws might help, there are similarities and differences

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Mike Sales
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Joined: 7 Mar 2009, 3:31pm

Re: Recreational drugs

Postby Mike Sales » 4 Aug 2019, 1:36pm

Psamathe wrote:Coca leaf Erythroxylum 1971 the plant from which cocaine is derived

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drugs_controlled_by_the_UK_Misuse_of_Drugs_Act#Class_A_drugs

Ian


Of course. I must be slow today.

Psamathe
Posts: 10414
Joined: 10 Jan 2014, 8:56pm

Re: Recreational drugs

Postby Psamathe » 4 Aug 2019, 8:21pm

Mike Sales wrote:
Psamathe wrote:Coca leaf Erythroxylum 1971 the plant from which cocaine is derived

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drugs_controlled_by_the_UK_Misuse_of_Drugs_Act#Class_A_drugs

Ian


Of course. I must be slow today.

Not slow. The Class A list is long. But are we discussing legalising Coca Leaves or heroin? OK, not much pressure to legalise Coca leaves in the UK (though the UK government is adamant they should be illegal worldwide). But the impact of different drugs is very different. So when some say "we should legalise" are they talking about legalising Coca leaves or legalising heroin or something between the two ?

Also, it is interesting how the Class A list (on Wikipedia) lists Coca leaves as "the plant from which cocaine is derived" rather than the primary use in Peru & Bolivia. Whilst it is true it is "the plant from which cocaine is derived", as a consumed drug the processing possibilities are not relevant, the Class A listing should be about justifications why consuming the drug is illegal.

I often wonder if the UK's drugs policies are driven more be dogma that real world practicalities.

Ian

Mike Sales
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Joined: 7 Mar 2009, 3:31pm

Re: Recreational drugs

Postby Mike Sales » 4 Aug 2019, 8:25pm

Psamathe wrote:I often wonder if the UK's drugs policies are driven more be dogma that real world practicalities.

Ian


You will not get an argument with me about that.

I did know that the Andeans chew coca leaves, and the mention of bowls in hostels ought to have given me a clue.

reohn2
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Joined: 26 Jun 2009, 8:21pm

Re: Recreational drugs

Postby reohn2 » 4 Aug 2019, 8:37pm

Mike Sales wrote:
Psamathe wrote:I often wonder if the UK's drugs policies are driven more be dogma that real world practicalities.

Ian


You will not get an argument with me about that.......

Nor me.
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reohn2
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Joined: 26 Jun 2009, 8:21pm

Re: Recreational drugs

Postby reohn2 » 15 Aug 2019, 9:23pm

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