reohn2 wrote:It's the system,it's flawed.
Well you have to come up with a different one then. Fewer holidays and longer days so that there is more school time? Or less work done and less stuff learned?
reohn2 wrote:It's the system,it's flawed.
pwa wrote:reohn2 wrote:It's the system,it's flawed.
Well you have to come up with a different one then. Fewer holidays and longer days so that there is more school time? Or less work done and less stuff learned?
pwa wrote:reohn2 wrote:It's the system,it's flawed.
Well you have to come up with a different one then. Fewer holidays and longer days so that there is more school time? Or less work done and less stuff learned?
georgew wrote:pwa wrote:reohn2 wrote:It's the system,it's flawed.
Well you have to come up with a different one then. Fewer holidays and longer days so that there is more school time? Or less work done and less stuff learned?
Well.....it doesn't work that way.
We already know that reducing working time may result in increased production and that to suggest that more hours equals more learning is misleadingly simplistic.
georgew wrote:pwa wrote:reohn2 wrote:It's the system,it's flawed.
Well you have to come up with a different one then. Fewer holidays and longer days so that there is more school time? Or less work done and less stuff learned?
Well.....it doesn't work that way.
We already know that reducing working time may result in increased production and that to suggest that more hours equals more learning is misleadingly simplistic.
pwa wrote:But whatever the resources, the goal is still to create independent learners. And kids will not become independent learners if they only learn when they have a teacher in front of them.
reohn2 wrote:pwa wrote:But whatever the resources, the goal is still to create independent learners. And kids will not become independent learners if they only learn when they have a teacher in front of them.
Think outside the present box,all work and no play makes Jack/Jackie a dull boy/girl.
Put the right conditions in place and more kids will want to learn and learn faster if they're not bored and fed up,Georgew has it right.
If kids want to learn it won't be because they're doing homework,I believe it to be a contrick to prepare them for longer working hours.
A couple of examples:-
I used to share work with a chap who worked long hours and 7 days a week,to watch him work was pitiful as he was completely burned out ,slow and lethargic to watch.He simply couldn't see how to get off the treadmill hamster wheel he'd built for himself,his struture work,work,work.
Another freind of mine confeded in me that she and the three others working there could never get out of the office before 7pm anps there was so much work to do.I told her her office was workjng shorthanded and as long as they kept working over without pay their boss would keep piling them up with work.
I listen to a program on R4 some time ago where the owner of a UK firm had sold it to a Swiss firm,on the agreement he'd be taken on as manager,but he had spend a month in their Swiss office.He was completely amazed at the production of the Swiss and even more amazdd that they came in at 9am on the dot and left at 5pm,his office in the UK was a who could get in earliest and leave latest,tryign to look busy to please him.
It's symptomatic of the UK way,we work the longest hours in Europe(and IMO things will only worsen outside the EU),and it wouldn't surprise me in the least if our children spend more time in school and have more homework than European children too.
Freddie wrote: The averages say nothing of the few remaining grammar schools in Lincolnshire. I imagine if you compared solely the grammars in Lincs to the comprehensives in other counties then the results would come out rather differently and in favour of the grammars.
reohn2 wrote:pwa wrote:But whatever the resources, the goal is still to create independent learners. And kids will not become independent learners if they only learn when they have a teacher in front of them.
Think outside the present box,all work and no play makes Jack/Jackie a dull boy/girl.
Put the right conditions in place and more kids will want to learn and learn faster if they're not bored and fed up,Georgew has it right.
If kids want to learn it won't be because they're doing homework,I believe it to be a contrick to prepare them for longer working hours.
A couple of examples:-
I used to share work with a chap who worked long hours and 7 days a week,to watch him work was pitiful as he was completely burned out ,slow and lethargic to watch.He simply couldn't see how to get off the treadmill hamster wheel he'd built for himself,his struture work,work,work.
Another freind of mine confeded in me that she and the three others working there could never get out of the office before 7pm anps there was so much work to do.I told her her office was workjng shorthanded and as long as they kept working over without pay their boss would keep piling them up with work.
I listen to a program on R4 some time ago where the owner of a UK firm had sold it to a Swiss firm,on the agreement he'd be taken on as manager,but he had spend a month in their Swiss office.He was completely amazed at the production of the Swiss and even more amazdd that they came in at 9am on the dot and left at 5pm,his office in the UK was a who could get in earliest and leave latest,tryign to look busy to please him.
It's symptomatic of the UK way,we work the longest hours in Europe(and IMO things will only worsen outside the EU),and it wouldn't surprise me in the least if our children spend more time in school and have more homework than European children too.
pwa wrote:[
Just to give you some rough figures to work with, I checked what my own wife's school tells parents about how much homework their kids should be doing, and it rises as the kids go through school. For the first couple of years (Year 7 and they can expect to be doing 40 minutes a day. School ends at 3.30. By the sixth form they will be doing a couple of hours a day, though by that time they have free periods on some days. And when they go to Uni they will be on their own and expected to be able to get stuck in to hours of work with nobody looking over their shoulder. How do we prepare kids for independent working if we don't let them do it?
reohn2 wrote:pwa wrote:[
Just to give you some rough figures to work with, I checked what my own wife's school tells parents about how much homework their kids should be doing, and it rises as the kids go through school. For the first couple of years (Year 7 and they can expect to be doing 40 minutes a day. School ends at 3.30. By the sixth form they will be doing a couple of hours a day, though by that time they have free periods on some days. And when they go to Uni they will be on their own and expected to be able to get stuck in to hours of work with nobody looking over their shoulder. How do we prepare kids for independent working if we don't let them do it?
Univresity students are adults,and should be treated as such.
Children OTOH should be taught with close supervision by train and qualified teachers who know their job and aren't overworked with large class sizes in huge schools designed for their economics rather than quality education.
YVMV mine won't, we have a multi tiered system of education for the those that can afford it and those who can't,whether that be post code schooling,or those parents who can afford private tutors,or those parents who can afford to send their children to private schools.
The system is biased grossly to the those with money,and IMO we're failing children by not providing equal opportunities for our children.
No doubt some may claim all children aren't equal and I agree with that but all children aren't being treated equally,and twochours overtime every night isn't the answer to the problem.
pwa wrote:The system I outlined doesn't have young kids doing two hours a night. Forty minutes for kids at 13, for example, rising as they go through school. By the sixth form they have two hours work per school day to do on their own, but by that time they also have free periods during the working day in which they can get some of that done, so they don't have to take all of it home as homework. The idea is that they become increasingly self-reliant, preparing them for life after school.
reohn2 wrote:Univresity students are adults,and should be treated as such.
Children OTOH should be taught with close supervision by train and qualified teachers who know their job and aren't overworked with large class sizes in huge schools designed for their economics rather than quality education.