iOS13 & iPadOS13

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rfryer
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Re: iOS13 & iPadOS13

Postby rfryer » 29 Sep 2019, 10:22am

Psamathe wrote:BBC Radio iPlayer app/service has been closed by the BBC (or will be closed within a few days). Nothing to do with Apple. All apps on all platforms tend to only support a limited number of older operating systems - mainly because new Operating system introduce new features and apps need to use those features to stay competitive and maintaining old versions for long term represents a significant cost.

True. I put the blame entirely on Apple, rather than app producers, for orphaning old devices when they do OS upgrades. That's largely deliberate; app writers will (reasonably) use those features, and users of old products are forced to upgrade.

If Apple actually cared, they'd make their new OS offerings compatible with old hardware, just disabling features that require the latest hardware advances. For example, they could implement a flashy new UI feature in a very basic way on old hardware, such that an app using that feature would still work, albeit less impressively.

However, they don't care. They'd rather everyone had a no-compromise experience when using Apple, even if that means replacing your hardware every couple of years. For me, that regular fiscal offering to Apple (whilst also discarding perfectly good hardware) was too much of a compromise.

My worst experience was in, I think, ios8 where they rewrote the photo API in a way that was incompatible with their own iPhoto, a paid app. And the only warning you got was after upgrade, when the app would no longer start up. Fortunately, I had it on two iPads, one of which is still limping along on that old version of iOS.

Psamathe
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Re: iOS13 & iPadOS13

Postby Psamathe » 29 Sep 2019, 10:44am

rfryer wrote:
Psamathe wrote:BBC Radio iPlayer app/service has been closed by the BBC (or will be closed within a few days). Nothing to do with Apple. All apps on all platforms tend to only support a limited number of older operating systems - mainly because new Operating system introduce new features and apps need to use those features to stay competitive and maintaining old versions for long term represents a significant cost.

True. I put the blame entirely on Apple, rather than app producers, for orphaning old devices when they do OS upgrades. That's largely deliberate; app writers will (reasonably) use those features, and users of old products are forced to upgrade.

If Apple actually cared, they'd make their new OS offerings compatible with old hardware, just disabling features that require the latest hardware advances. For example, they could implement a flashy new UI feature in a very basic way on old hardware, such that an app using that feature would still work, albeit less impressively.

However, they don't care. They'd rather everyone had a no-compromise experience when using Apple, even if that means replacing your hardware every couple of years. For me, that regular fiscal offering to Apple (whilst also discarding perfectly good hardware) was too much of a compromise.

My worst experience was in, I think, ios8 where they rewrote the photo API in a way that was incompatible with their own iPhoto, a paid app. And the only warning you got was after upgrade, when the app would no longer start up. Fortunately, I had it on two iPads, one of which is still limping along on that old version of iOS.

Until a few days ago my Mum's iPhone was running the latest release OS from Apple and it is 6 years old. That is not too bad. My Apple laptop (I'm using now) is 7 years old and will be getting the next OS update i.e. it is still supported after 7+ years.

Most apps run on and support current and previous major releases so latest release apps on my Mum's phone will still be supported when the phone is 7 or 8 years old. I think that is pretty good. So to talk about "replacing your hardware every couple of years" is quite unfair and I believe Android based devices are just as bad (certainly the case from my limited android experience).

I would certainly not claim Apple are perfect (I started this critical thread) though I've had no issues with the photo API for any iOS updates. That said that API is a bit of a mess through its introduction of support for raw images. Of course it should support raw but I feel the way the Photos app handles raw is "inadequate" but them most people collecting raw images would not be using the stock photos app (other than as a short term storage).

Ian

rfryer
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Re: iOS13 & iPadOS13

Postby rfryer » 29 Sep 2019, 12:18pm

Maybe my perception is a little out of date; since escaping Apple's clutches I've not been following the compatibility story in any detail.

Are they making any efforts to maintain (or improve) performance on old devices as the OSs roll on? I was always cynical about how the responsiveness of a device "degraded" over time until the point where it almost seemed broken, where actually the hardware was no worse than the day I bought the shiny, state of the art device.

Psamathe
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Re: iOS13 & iPadOS13

Postby Psamathe » 29 Sep 2019, 12:36pm

rfryer wrote:Maybe my perception is a little out of date; since escaping Apple's clutches I've not been following the compatibility story in any detail.

Are they making any efforts to maintain (or improve) performance on old devices as the OSs roll on? I was always cynical about how the responsiveness of a device "degraded" over time until the point where it almost seemed broken, where actually the hardware was no worse than the day I bought the shiny, state of the art device.

Apple certainly have made major OS releases where the main focus has been performance and stability e.g. OS X Snow Leopard and iOS9(?).

That said I don't believe users can really tell the difference particularly as they'll only think about it immediately after an install when re-indexing is slowing everything down (iOS). Plus when a manufacturer has to release a new major OS (e.g. for a new range of iPhones), if they've not got many new exciting features all they can claim is "improved performance" - which may be true or may be marketing. And I don't bother to search out and study benchmarks butI've also not seen any reports along the lines of "Apple's performance improvement claims are rubbish".

I don't know if there is a "neutral stance" but certainly Apple have made major OS releases targeted at existing computers.

Ian

rfryer
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Re: iOS13 & iPadOS13

Postby rfryer » 29 Sep 2019, 2:03pm

That sounds like things have improved. I clearly remember my iPhone 3G and iPad 2 reaching the point where keyboard response was awful, apparently ignoring multiple taps, them all arriving at once.


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100%JR
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Re: iOS13 & iPadOS13

Postby 100%JR » 8 Oct 2019, 7:36pm


Probably :mrgreen:
I can change/upgrade at anytime so why not :wink:
I'll wait until all the glitches are sorted then yes.
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Syd
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Re: iOS13 & iPadOS13

Postby Syd » 8 Oct 2019, 7:55pm


Waiting delivery of mine. Would’ve normally picked it up from the store but still on crutches after recent ‘off’ so home delivery best.

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Mick F
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Re: iOS13 & iPadOS13

Postby Mick F » 13 Nov 2019, 10:44am

Read this thread of mine on the Toyota forum.
Mrs Mick F bought an iPhone 6s for £140 from eBay last week. Very pleased with it.
Trouble is, it wouldn't connect with the car.

Upgraded to the latest software 13.2.2 and all is well. :D

https://www.toyotaownersclub.com/forums ... ands-free/
Mick F. Cornwall

Oldjohnw
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Re: iOS13 & iPadOS13

Postby Oldjohnw » 13 Nov 2019, 12:26pm

My 4 year old iPad can't update.
John

Cycling and recycling

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Mick F
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Re: iOS13 & iPadOS13

Postby Mick F » 13 Nov 2019, 2:19pm

Oldjohnw wrote:My 4 year old iPad can't update.
Does it matter?
Our iPad Mini and my iPhone 5c are both at IOS 10.3.3 and both unsupported.

Our iMac is unsupported too, and stuck at Yosemite 10.10.5
Doesn't matter at all.
Mick F. Cornwall

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NATURAL ANKLING
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Re: iOS13 & iPadOS13

Postby NATURAL ANKLING » 13 Nov 2019, 2:28pm

Hi,
I bought a iphone SE, this will take the latest soft ware because its a current model ( the next "SE" second gen is based on a 6 model IIRC) and is 4" like old 5 model, so no need for big screen unless you like bike screens :)

I finally took the plunge on 13.2.2 after bad news on 13.1, some small hiccups on other apps, but that's usual.
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Oldjohnw
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Re: iOS13 & iPadOS13

Postby Oldjohnw » 13 Nov 2019, 6:11pm

Mick F wrote:
Oldjohnw wrote:My 4 year old iPad can't update.
Does it matter?
Our iPad Mini and my iPhone 5c are both at IOS 10.3.3 and both unsupported.

Our iMac is unsupported too, and stuck at Yosemite 10.10.5
Doesn't matter at all.


It does matter because I can't get BBC Sounds and many other things.

Fortunately I have a new android which can do sounds.
John

Cycling and recycling

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Mick F
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Re: iOS13 & iPadOS13

Postby Mick F » 14 Nov 2019, 9:11am

Oldjohnw wrote:It does matter because I can't get BBC Sounds and many other things.
We manage without it.
We listen to online radio, and you can listen to anything on the schedules from way back.
Mick F. Cornwall

Psamathe
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Re: iOS13 & iPadOS13

Postby Psamathe » 14 Nov 2019, 11:04am

Mick F wrote:
Oldjohnw wrote:My 4 year old iPad can't update.
Does it matter?
Our iPad Mini and my iPhone 5c are both at IOS 10.3.3 and both unsupported.

Our iMac is unsupported too, and stuck at Yosemite 10.10.5
Doesn't matter at all.

iOS and iPadOS as all software out there has security vulnerabilities and these are not fixed forever in every release ever created. If/when your device is attacked the attacker will probably nt know you don't use it for anything that might interest them. They attack it and manage to collect nothing useful but their attack has messed-up your device.

Updates do not only related to the latest app feature you don't want or need.

Ian