Hong Kong

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NATURAL ANKLING
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Hong Kong

Postby NATURAL ANKLING » 4 Oct 2019, 9:59am

Hi,
Hong Kong, I'm just wondering where this is leading.
We've seen Tiananmen Square, What's your thoughts on how this will end?

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reohn2
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Re: Hong Kong

Postby reohn2 » 4 Oct 2019, 10:25am

TBH IMHO it will ultimately be crushed by the rigid totalitarian state that China is.China doesn't like to be seen to be losing face.
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pwa
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Re: Hong Kong

Postby pwa » 4 Oct 2019, 10:46am

reohn2 wrote:TBH IMHO it will ultimately be crushed by the rigid totalitarian state that China is.China doesn't like to be seen to be losing face.

Inevitable, sadly.

francovendee
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Re: Hong Kong

Postby francovendee » 4 Oct 2019, 2:58pm

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reohn2 wrote:TBH IMHO it will ultimately be crushed by the rigid totalitarian state that China is.China doesn't like to be seen to be losing face.

Almost certain to happen. What could the West do to change it? In my view absolutely nothing.

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Mick F
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Re: Hong Kong

Postby Mick F » 4 Oct 2019, 3:22pm

reohn2 wrote:TBH IMHO it will ultimately be crushed by the rigid totalitarian state that China is.China doesn't like to be seen to be losing face.
Just chatting about this "fact" earlier.

There is no happy ending.

However, if China took a step back from this and brought it on slowly, all this unrest might die down. After all is said and done, the One County Two Systems will run out in a couple of decades. Only the old people will remember how it used to be.

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Pastychomper
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Re: Hong Kong

Postby Pastychomper » 4 Oct 2019, 4:13pm

Mick F wrote:
reohn2 wrote:TBH IMHO it will ultimately be crushed by the rigid totalitarian state that China is.China doesn't like to be seen to be losing face.
Just chatting about this "fact" earlier.

There is no happy ending.

However, if China took a step back from this and brought it on slowly, all this unrest might die down. After all is said and done, the One County Two Systems will run out in a couple of decades. Only the old people will remember how it used to be.

Softly Softly Catchee Monkey.


The Chinese government probably thought they were bringing it on slowly - some propaganda here, an extradition treaty there - with the aim of having the place properly Sinicised by the time the treaty runs out. Officially taking over would then be a rubber-stamping exercise, with a happy Hong Kong leadership enthusing about the region's bright future as part of a unified China.

Those old people who remember how it used to be will have been teaching the younger generation what was so good about the old/current system, so the pro-democracy feelings are unlikely to die out without help.
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Cyril Haearn
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Re: Hong Kong

Postby Cyril Haearn » 25 Nov 2019, 7:06pm

The reform/democratic candidates did very well in the local elections, they have control in nearly all boroughs, who knows what happens next?

Shame we dinnae have a HK expert on these fora
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Cyril Haearn
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Re: Hong Kong

Postby Cyril Haearn » 25 Nov 2019, 7:09pm

Pastychomper wrote:..
Those old people who remember how it used to be will have been teaching the younger generation what was so good about the old/current system, so the pro-democracy feelings are unlikely to die out without help.

Right again, the stories are passed on by word of mouth, media
Just as many of us are aware and influenced by memories of WW1 + WW2 although we were not even born then
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fossala
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Re: Hong Kong

Postby fossala » 25 Nov 2019, 8:13pm

The extradition treaty was brought forward due to a rapist fleeing and no extradition treaty between Taiwan, Hong Kong and China. HK's independence wasn't watered down as extradition agreement would only apply if the law the person broke was in force in both areas.

People are calling China authoritarian, but how would the UK react to violent rioting for months on end? The last set of riots the UK had we put people in prison for years for stealing a pair of shoes. Do you remember the troubles? How about cable street?

Obviously people will jump to argue with me. Please just point out why you think I'm wrong and we can have a discussion.

mikeonabike
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Re: Hong Kong

Postby mikeonabike » 26 Nov 2019, 10:09am

Yeah but the extradition treaty was so unnecessary - China can simply kidnap people from HK and lock them up in China. Could have simply carried on with that and avoided all this aggro. And anyone who complained too much could be sent for re-education a la Uighur.

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Pastychomper
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Re: Hong Kong

Postby Pastychomper » 26 Nov 2019, 4:33pm

fossala wrote:The extradition treaty was brought forward due to a rapist fleeing and no extradition treaty between Taiwan, Hong Kong and China. HK's independence wasn't watered down as extradition agreement would only apply if the law the person broke was in force in both areas.

People are calling China authoritarian, but how would the UK react to violent rioting for months on end? The last set of riots the UK had we put people in prison for years for stealing a pair of shoes. Do you remember the troubles? How about cable street?

Obviously people will jump to argue with me. Please just point out why you think I'm wrong and we can have a discussion.



If the treaty (a) is only to cover such cases as you describe and (b) will only be used for such in the future, then the rioters probably are over-reacting. On the other hand, if it would allow China an easier way to get at any dissident in Hong Kong by simply accusing them of some handy crime then they are probably right.
Everyone's ghast should get a good flabbering now and then.
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