Oldjohnw wrote: I am (was) a strong remainer (and now rejoiner) but I am wondering who ruled the referendum as illegal?
It wasn't. The Leave campaign broke electoral law. Both Vote Leave and Leave.EU were fined.
If the referendum had not been advisory, it would probably have been invalidated by the illegal campaigning. But the referendum itself, was not, as far as I know, held to be illegal.
Exactly. The referendum was set up by Act of Parliament. It could not be illegal. A number of funding issues broke electoral law and many untruths were told. But the referendum was not only legal but holding it became a legal requirement.
The campaigning was illegal, and therefore the result holds no weight.... But since the result legally held no weight anyway it wasn't annulled - which it would have been it it carried any legal weight.
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way.No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse. There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.
Vorpal wrote:It wasn't. The Leave campaign broke electoral law. Both Vote Leave and Leave.EU were fined.
If the referendum had not been advisory, it would probably have been invalidated by the illegal campaigning. But the referendum itself, was not, as far as I know, held to be illegal.
Exactly. The referendum was set up by Act of Parliament. It could not be illegal. A number of funding issues broke electoral law and many untruths were told. But the referendum was not only legal but holding it became a legal requirement.
The campaigning was illegal, and therefore the result holds no weight.... But since the result legally held no weight anyway it wasn't annulled - which it would have been it it carried any legal weight.
So it can never be claimed the will of the people, but became merely the will of the Tory Government.
Oldjohnw wrote:The referendum was set up by Act of Parliament. It could not be illegal. A number of funding issues broke electoral law and many untruths were told. But the referendum was not only legal but holding it became a legal requirement.
The campaigning was illegal, and therefore the result holds no weight.... But since the result legally held no weight anyway it wasn't annulled - which it would have been it it carried any legal weight.
The last of the courageous Tory MPs with an ounce of decency such as; Anna Soubry, Sarah Wollaston, Heidi Allen, Antoinette Sandbach etc, put good scruples and the good of the country before personal ambition, and they very bravely challenged incoming Tory Party Political extremism, they quit the Conservative Party out of decent moral principles, and since the GE no longer remain as MPs. It's a despicable shame that electoral voter injustice replaced them with swivel-eyed salivaring jackals hungry to make a killing for personal selfish gain. The Tory Party has pushed so far to the right it's easy to see the attraction from crims' like Tommy Thug Rotter-Yaxley types.
I fully agree with that sentiment.
Last edited by reohn2 on 17 Dec 2019, 1:46pm, edited 1 time in total.
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"All we are not stares back at what we are"
W H Auden
Oldjohnw wrote:The referendum was set up by Act of Parliament. It could not be illegal. A number of funding issues broke electoral law and many untruths were told. But the referendum was not only legal but holding it became a legal requirement.
The campaigning was illegal, and therefore the result holds no weight.... But since the result legally held no weight anyway it wasn't annulled - which it would have been it it carried any legal weight.
The last of the courageous Tory MPs with an ounce of decency such as; Anna Soubry, Sarah Wollaston, Heidi Allen, Antoinette Sandbach etc, put good scruples and the good of the country before personal ambition, and they very bravely challenged incoming Tory Party Political extremism, they quit the Conservative Party out of decent moral principles, and since the GE no longer remain as MPs. It's a despicable shame that electoral voter injustice replaced them with swivel-eyed salivaring jackals hungry to make a killing for personal selfish gain. The Tory Party has pushed so far to the right it's easy to see the attraction from crims' like Tommy Thug Rotter-Yaxley types.
The Tory Party is an interesting club. There is no room for. Ken Clarke or a Michael Heseltine, or David Gauke or Phil Hammond or Rory Stuart, bit there is room for Yaxley Hopkins and a number of similar new MPs.
Enough of the conspiracy theories.
Hopkins and Yaxley Lennon are not in the conservative party.
The people who are in the Conservative party are more than bad enough without inventing bogeymen.
Oldjohnw wrote: I am (was) a strong remainer (and now rejoiner) but I am wondering who ruled the referendum as illegal?
It wasn't. The Leave campaign broke electoral law. Both Vote Leave and Leave.EU were fined.
If the referendum had not been advisory, it would probably have been invalidated by the illegal campaigning. But the referendum itself, was not, as far as I know, held to be illegal.
Exactly. The referendum was set up by Act of Parliament. It could not be illegal. A number of funding issues broke electoral law and many untruths were told. But the referendum was not only legal but holding it became a legal requirement.
And yet we now have a governemt in power who will try to politicise the judiciary,and threaten the state broadcaster of withdrawal of funds if it doesnt dance their tune.
Last edited by reohn2 on 17 Dec 2019, 1:51pm, edited 1 time in total.
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"All we are not stares back at what we are"
W H Auden
The last of the courageous Tory MPs with an ounce of decency such as; Anna Soubry, Sarah Wollaston, Heidi Allen, Antoinette Sandbach etc, put good scruples and the good of the country before personal ambition, and they very bravely challenged incoming Tory Party Political extremism, they quit the Conservative Party out of decent moral principles, and since the GE no longer remain as MPs. It's a despicable shame that electoral voter injustice replaced them with swivel-eyed salivaring jackals hungry to make a killing for personal selfish gain. The Tory Party has pushed so far to the right it's easy to see the attraction from crims' like Tommy Thug Rotter-Yaxley types.
The Tory Party is an interesting club. There is no room for. Ken Clarke or a Michael Heseltine, or David Gauke or Phil Hammond or Rory Stuart, bit there is room for Yaxley Hopkins and a number of similar new MPs.
And yet people on this and other threads seek to defend them,whilst at the same time attempting to claim anyone voting otherwise are politically blinkered .
Last edited by reohn2 on 17 Dec 2019, 1:52pm, edited 2 times in total.
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"All we are not stares back at what we are"
W H Auden
Vorpal wrote:It wasn't. The Leave campaign broke electoral law. Both Vote Leave and Leave.EU were fined.
If the referendum had not been advisory, it would probably have been invalidated by the illegal campaigning. But the referendum itself, was not, as far as I know, held to be illegal.
Exactly. The referendum was set up by Act of Parliament. It could not be illegal. A number of funding issues broke electoral law and many untruths were told. But the referendum was not only legal but holding it became a legal requirement.
The campaigning was illegal, and therefore the result holds no weight.... But since the result legally held no weight anyway it wasn't annulled - which it would have been it it carried any legal weight.
I think the saying is "done up like a kipper" We will reap the whirlwind of even farther rightwing policies as we have for the past ten years.........
Last edited by reohn2 on 17 Dec 2019, 1:52pm, edited 1 time in total.
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"All we are not stares back at what we are"
W H Auden
Debs wrote: The last of the courageous Tory MPs with an ounce of decency such as; Anna Soubry, Sarah Wollaston, Heidi Allen, Antoinette Sandbach etc, put good scruples and the good of the country before personal ambition, and they very bravely challenged incoming Tory Party Political extremism, they quit the Conservative Party out of decent moral principles, and since the GE no longer remain as MPs. It's a despicable shame that electoral voter injustice replaced them with swivel-eyed salivaring jackals hungry to make a killing for personal selfish gain. The Tory Party has pushed so far to the right it's easy to see the attraction from crims' like Tommy Thug Rotter-Yaxley types.
The Tory Party is an interesting club. There is no room for. Ken Clarke or a Michael Heseltine, or David Gauke or Phil Hammond or Rory Stuart, bit there is room for Yaxley Hopkins and a number of similar new MPs.
Enough of the conspiracy theories.
Hopkins and Yaxley Lennon are not in the conservative party.
The people who are in the Conservative party are more than bad enough without inventing bogeymen.
Show me where in black and white the Tory Party itself has denied them membership,or expelled them and I may be swayed into believing that,though I feel I must warn you this is the Tory Untruthful Racist,Islamaphobic Party we're dealing with.
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"All we are not stares back at what we are"
W H Auden
I'm glad to hear that Hopkins and Yaxley whatever have not joined the Tory party, although they have tweeted their support.
You are right that there are plenty of dreadful people in he party, some of whom are now in Westminster and have been outed as expressing their support for the w EDL
Oldjohnw wrote:I'm glad to hear that Hopkins and Yaxley whatever have not joined the Tory party, although they have tweeted their support.
You are right that there are plenty of dreadful people in he party, some of whom are now in Westminster and have been outed as expressing their support for the w EDL
Is that official,have I missed something?
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"All we are not stares back at what we are"
W H Auden
Oldjohnw wrote: The Tory Party is an interesting club. There is no room for. Ken Clarke or a Michael Heseltine, or David Gauke or Phil Hammond or Rory Stuart, bit there is room for Yaxley Hopkins and a number of similar new MPs.
Enough of the conspiracy theories.
Hopkins and Yaxley Lennon are not in the conservative party.
The people who are in the Conservative party are more than bad enough without inventing bogeymen.
Show me where in black and white the Tory Party itself has denied them membership,or expelled them and I may be swayed into believing that,though I feel I must warn you this is the Tory Untruthful Racist,Islamaphobic Party we're dealing with.
Show me in black and white where they have denied being shape shifting lizard men.
roubaixtuesday wrote: Enough of the conspiracy theories.
Hopkins and Yaxley Lennon are not in the conservative party.
The people who are in the Conservative party are more than bad enough without inventing bogeymen.
Show me where in black and white the Tory Party itself has denied them membership,or expelled them and I may be swayed into believing that,though I feel I must warn you this is the Tory Untruthful Racist,Islamaphobic Party we're dealing with.
Show me in black and white where they have denied being shape shifting lizard men.
By that I take it the Tory party haven't denied their membership
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"All we are not stares back at what we are"
W H Auden
.