Goodbye Old England - Jockxit. It's Time We Were Gone

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al_yrpal
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Re: Goodbye Old England - It's Time We Were Gone

Postby al_yrpal » 13 Dec 2019, 4:59pm

mercalia wrote:
heheh that type of thinking hasnt stopped the supporters of brexit wanting to leave the EU has it? and succeeding.


Fortunately no, but its a totally different situation. Just my humble opinion listening to folk I know and whose opinions I respect in Scotland. Polls are seldom reliable but there was one recently that said Independence was still rejected by the majority.
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Polisman
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Re: Goodbye Old England - It's Time We Were Gone

Postby Polisman » 13 Dec 2019, 5:19pm

al_yrpal wrote:
mercalia wrote:
heheh that type of thinking hasnt stopped the supporters of brexit wanting to leave the EU has it? and succeeding.


Fortunately no, but its a totally different situation. Just my humble opinion listening to folk I know and whose opinions I respect in Scotland. Polls are seldom reliable but there was one recently that said Independence was still rejected by the majority.


The last Yougov poll put leave at 50%, and remain at 48. Its these numbers that have bolstered the SNP resolve. I think it's almost unbelievable to think there won't be another referendum either before or just after Brexit deadline of December 31st 2020.

Will of the people? Remember that one?

Postboxer
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Re: Goodbye Old England - It's Time We Were Gone

Postby Postboxer » 13 Dec 2019, 7:05pm

Perhaps a lot of leavers were happy to vote for the conservative party, but not enough remainers were happy to ditch the conservative party for the remain parties.

Personally I'm getting fed up of voting now, I'm 39, voted in 6 general elections and my vote has never counted for anything as it hasn't elected anyone. I wonder why 1 in 3 voters didn't bother.

We need something more proportional, so that people don't have to vote tactically or only have the choice of voting for the incumbent or the most likely challenger. Or maybe have two boxes next to each name, so you can vote for your favoured candidate OR against your unfavoured candidate, but not both.

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Mick F
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Re: Goodbye Old England - It's Time We Were Gone

Postby Mick F » 13 Dec 2019, 8:00pm

^^^^
Sounds good to me.





I'm off down the pub. :D
Mick F. Cornwall

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Re: Goodbye Old England - It's Time We Were Gone

Postby wirral_cyclist » 13 Dec 2019, 11:45pm

Mick F wrote:^^^^
Sounds good to me.

I'm off down the pub. :D


I doff my hat sir, as ever you have the answer - not saying which bit though ;-0

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Re: Goodbye Old England - Jockxit. It's Time We Were Gone

Postby Polisman » 14 Dec 2019, 5:24pm

Sturgeons new manifesto for a second referendum includes the construction of a hard border between Scotland and England, probably a wall, of course this will be necessary once they are safely back the fold of the EU. Two different trading areas. I just hope they leave enough space for a big pipe for Scottish water, without which England would be bone dry in a fortnight. (the south already gets 30% of its water from the north).

There are plans afoot to build a massive canal between Scotland and the south West of England, presumably to water their crops and gardens. I think this would be a non starter, when Scotland leave the union.

https://www.scotsman.com/news/environme ... -1-3613430

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Re: Goodbye Old England - Jockxit. It's Time We Were Gone

Postby Oldjohnw » 14 Dec 2019, 6:29pm

Polisman wrote:Sturgeons new manifesto for a second referendum includes the construction of a hard border between Scotland and England, probably a wall, of course this will be necessary once they are safely back the fold of the EU. Two different trading areas. I just hope they leave enough space for a big pipe for Scottish water, without which England would be bone dry in a fortnight. (the south already gets 30% of its water from the north).

There are plans afoot to build a massive canal between Scotland and the south West of England, presumably to water their crops and gardens. I think this would be a non starter, when Scotland leave the union.

https://www.scotsman.com/news/environme ... -1-3613430


Just wondering how long Kielder has been in Scotland.
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irc
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Re: Goodbye Old England - Jockxit. It's Time We Were Gone

Postby irc » 14 Dec 2019, 6:54pm

Polisman wrote:Sturgeons new manifesto for a second referendum includes the construction of a hard border between Scotland and England, probably a wall, of course this will be necessary once they are safely back the fold of the EU. Two different trading areas. I just hope they leave enough space for a big pipe for Scottish water, without which England would be bone dry in a fortnight. 0


Fact check, No Scottish water is supplied to England.


https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/ ... g_to_engla

I believe the south of England needs to build a few new reservoirs. Due to increased demand from a bigger population. Not either indyref 2 or climate change.

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Re: Goodbye Old England - It's Time We Were Gone

Postby irc » 14 Dec 2019, 7:00pm

Polisman wrote:
al_yrpal wrote:
mercalia wrote:
heheh that type of thinking hasnt stopped the supporters of brexit wanting to leave the EU has it? and succeeding.


Fortunately no, but its a totally different situation. Just my humble opinion listening to folk I know and whose opinions I respect in Scotland. Polls are seldom reliable but there was one recently that said Independence was still rejected by the majority.


The last Yougov poll put leave at 50%, and remain at 48. Its these numbers that have bolstered the SNP resolve. I think it's almost unbelievable to think there won't be another referendum either before or just after Brexit deadline of December 31st 2020.

Will of the people? Remember that one?


The people voted in a once in a generation referendum in 2014. Even if there was a Brexit related rerun it will be after Brexit gas happened and bedded in. 2026 perhaps.

Nicola , start paying attention to the day job please

Her newspaper article days before the vote was all about stopping Boris not independence. Now she lost that one she claims it as a justification for a 2nd go. But most Scottish voters voted for unionist parties.

irc
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Re: Goodbye Old England - It's Time We Were Gone

Postby irc » 14 Dec 2019, 7:25pm

al_yrpal wrote:
mercalia wrote:
heheh that type of thinking hasnt stopped the supporters of brexit wanting to leave the EU has it? and succeeding.


Fortunately no, but its a totally different situation. Just my humble opinion listening to folk I know and whose opinions I respect in Scotland. Polls are seldom reliable but there was one recently that said Independence was still rejected by the majority.


1 out of approx the last 50 polls had a narrow yes.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion ... dependence

Polisman
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Re: Goodbye Old England - Jockxit. It's Time We Were Gone

Postby Polisman » 14 Dec 2019, 8:17pm

irc wrote:
Polisman wrote:Sturgeons new manifesto for a second referendum includes the construction of a hard border between Scotland and England, probably a wall, of course this will be necessary once they are safely back the fold of the EU. Two different trading areas. I just hope they leave enough space for a big pipe for Scottish water, without which England would be bone dry in a fortnight. 0


Fact check, No Scottish water is supplied to England.


https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/ ... g_to_engla

I believe the south of England needs to build a few new reservoirs. Due to increased demand from a bigger population. Not either indyref 2 or climate change.


Fact check :shock:

Your FOI request only states that Scottish Water does not pipe water to England, which is in direct contradiction to the Scottish governments statement that gas, oil and water are supplied south of the border, from Scotland.

roubaixtuesday
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Re: Goodbye Old England - Jockxit. It's Time We Were Gone

Postby roubaixtuesday » 14 Dec 2019, 8:21pm

Polisman wrote:
There are plans afoot to build a massive canal between Scotland and the south West of England, presumably to water their crops and gardens. I think this would be a non starter, when Scotland leave the union.


I've no idea why you think this would be a non starter.

Europe gets most of its gas through pipes from Russia.

Why water from Scotland would be more of a problem, I've no idea.

I do agree that, paradoxically, England leaving the EU makes it harder for Scotland to be independent.

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Re: Goodbye Old England - Jockxit. It's Time We Were Gone

Postby pwa » 14 Dec 2019, 8:25pm

I know the idea of piping Scottish water to the SE of England was proposed some years back but I don't remember anything coming of it. Wasn't it generally thought impractical? If there were major rivers running north to south it would be simpler. Put the water in at the top end, take it out lower down. But mostly the rivers run west-east or east-west.
Last edited by pwa on 14 Dec 2019, 8:28pm, edited 1 time in total.

Polisman
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Re: Goodbye Old England - It's Time We Were Gone

Postby Polisman » 14 Dec 2019, 8:27pm

irc wrote:
al_yrpal wrote:
mercalia wrote:
heheh that type of thinking hasnt stopped the supporters of brexit wanting to leave the EU has it? and succeeding.


Fortunately no, but its a totally different situation. Just my humble opinion listening to folk I know and whose opinions I respect in Scotland. Polls are seldom reliable but there was one recently that said Independence was still rejected by the majority.


1 out of approx the last 50 polls had a narrow yes.



52/48 to be independent, latest poll from August 2019. About the same as brexit. If one poll has legitimacy clearly its ridiculous to deny the other. I predict Jockxit by the end of 2020, and Irish reunification shortly after. This is an argument Boris can't hope to win. Brexit and Jockxit are parallel paths, both small countries determined to be rid of a larger whole whom they think no longer relevant to their respective democracy. Its impossible to argue otherwise.

And what's the end game? England the lone wolf in Europe, at the mercy of the hordes of Trump's jackals, already circling, salivating to eviscerate the carcass.

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Re: Goodbye Old England - Jockxit. It's Time We Were Gone

Postby Paulatic » 14 Dec 2019, 8:47pm

I reckon Jockxit is highly dependent on the outcome on fishing waters in the Brexit negations. Scottish fishermen have been sold the line they’ll get their 200 ml boundary back. If it doesn’t happen then that will be twice they’ve been shafted by Tories and that blue bit on the North East could easily turn yellow.
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