Coronavirus (aka COVID-19) - just how serious?

Use this board for general non-cycling-related chat, or to introduce yourself to the forum.
kwackers
Posts: 14304
Joined: 4 Jun 2008, 9:29pm
Location: Warrington

Re: Coronavirus (aka COVID-19) - just how serious?

Postby kwackers » 26 Mar 2020, 2:55pm

Psamathe wrote:Initially I thought "something lighthearted" except it isn't light hearted atall but for me just highlights what western/human society has become. I despair
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/coronavirus-trump-pastor-homophobic-ralph-drollinger-a9426801.html wrote:Coronavirus: Trump cabinet’s pastor blames gay people for ‘wrath of God’
...
A evangelical pastor who runs a Bible Study attended by several members of the Trump administration‘s cabinet has implied that homosexuality could be one of the causes of the coronavirus epidemic in the US.

In a blog post “Is God Judging America Today?”, Ralph Drollinger wrote that “America is experiencing the consequential wrath of God” — that is, the inevitable punishment for violating Biblical precepts on godly behaviour.

A detailed theological argument distinguishing between different types of wrath, the post concludes that “those individuals who are rebuked by God’s forsaking wrath are largely responsible for God’s consequential wrath on our nation”.

The forsaken include gays and lesbians, “given over” as they are by God to “degrading passions”, as well as environmentalists, since “clearly indicative of God’s forsaking wrath is when the abandoned serve the creature rather than the creator”.

Ian

Nobody ever questions the evils of a 'Super-being' who wreaks vengeance on all for the "mistakes" of a few.

What a ***** he must be (if he were real).

Psamathe
Posts: 11123
Joined: 10 Jan 2014, 8:56pm

Re: Coronavirus (aka COVID-19) - just how serious?

Postby Psamathe » 26 Mar 2020, 3:01pm

kwackers wrote:
Psamathe wrote:Initially I thought "something lighthearted" except it isn't light hearted atall but for me just highlights what western/human society has become. I despair
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/coronavirus-trump-pastor-homophobic-ralph-drollinger-a9426801.html wrote:Coronavirus: Trump cabinet’s pastor blames gay people for ‘wrath of God’
...
A evangelical pastor who runs a Bible Study attended by several members of the Trump administration‘s cabinet has implied that homosexuality could be one of the causes of the coronavirus epidemic in the US.

In a blog post “Is God Judging America Today?”, Ralph Drollinger wrote that “America is experiencing the consequential wrath of God” — that is, the inevitable punishment for violating Biblical precepts on godly behaviour.

A detailed theological argument distinguishing between different types of wrath, the post concludes that “those individuals who are rebuked by God’s forsaking wrath are largely responsible for God’s consequential wrath on our nation”.

The forsaken include gays and lesbians, “given over” as they are by God to “degrading passions”, as well as environmentalists, since “clearly indicative of God’s forsaking wrath is when the abandoned serve the creature rather than the creator”.

Ian

Nobody ever questions the evils of a 'Super-being' who wreaks vengeance on all for the "mistakes" of a few.

What a **** he must be (if he were real).

Pastor Ralph Drollinger is real. A real pastor who really does run a Bible Study, etc.

Ian

carpetcleaner
Posts: 387
Joined: 14 Nov 2019, 1:25pm

Re: Coronavirus (aka COVID-19) - just how serious?

Postby carpetcleaner » 26 Mar 2020, 3:02pm

Psamathe wrote:Initially I thought "something lighthearted" except it isn't light hearted atall but for me just highlights what western/human society has become. I despair
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/coronavirus-trump-pastor-homophobic-ralph-drollinger-a9426801.html wrote:Coronavirus: Trump cabinet’s pastor blames gay people for ‘wrath of God’
...
A evangelical pastor who runs a Bible Study attended by several members of the Trump administration‘s cabinet has implied that homosexuality could be one of the causes of the coronavirus epidemic in the US.

In a blog post “Is God Judging America Today?”, Ralph Drollinger wrote that “America is experiencing the consequential wrath of God” — that is, the inevitable punishment for violating Biblical precepts on godly behaviour.

A detailed theological argument distinguishing between different types of wrath, the post concludes that “those individuals who are rebuked by God’s forsaking wrath are largely responsible for God’s consequential wrath on our nation”.

The forsaken include gays and lesbians, “given over” as they are by God to “degrading passions”, as well as environmentalists, since “clearly indicative of God’s forsaking wrath is when the abandoned serve the creature rather than the creator”.

Ian


I think you'll find similar views are held in many parts of the world, not just the west, and much more widely too. I won't be more specific as that would be racist, phobic or some other such description.

This pastor is entitled to his opinions. [moderated]

kwackers
Posts: 14304
Joined: 4 Jun 2008, 9:29pm
Location: Warrington

Re: Coronavirus (aka COVID-19) - just how serious?

Postby kwackers » 26 Mar 2020, 3:02pm

Psamathe wrote:Pastor Ralph Drollinger is real. A real pastor who really does run a Bible Study, etc.

Ian

Not him, I have no doubt of his status.
His so called God is who I meant.

Mike Sales
Posts: 4404
Joined: 7 Mar 2009, 3:31pm

Re: Coronavirus (aka COVID-19) - just how serious?

Postby Mike Sales » 26 Mar 2020, 3:02pm

kwackers wrote:Nobody ever questions the evils of a 'Super-being' who wreaks vengeance on all for the "mistakes" of a few.

What a **** he must be (if he were real).


To be fair, and without checking back, I feel sure that Dawkins in his The God Delusion questioned it vigourously. Many others have too.
What you must mean is that the believers fail to see the contradiction in their belief in a good God.

reohn2
Posts: 37771
Joined: 26 Jun 2009, 8:21pm

Re: Coronavirus (aka COVID-19) - just how serious?

Postby reohn2 » 26 Mar 2020, 3:02pm

Psamathe wrote:Initially I thought "something lighthearted" except it isn't light hearted atall but for me just highlights what western/human society has become. I despair
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/coronavirus-trump-pastor-homophobic-ralph-drollinger-a9426801.html wrote:Coronavirus: Trump cabinet’s pastor blames gay people for ‘wrath of God’
...
A evangelical pastor who runs a Bible Study attended by several members of the Trump administration‘s cabinet has implied that homosexuality could be one of the causes of the coronavirus epidemic in the US.

In a blog post “Is God Judging America Today?”, Ralph Drollinger wrote that “America is experiencing the consequential wrath of God” — that is, the inevitable punishment for violating Biblical precepts on godly behaviour.

A detailed theological argument distinguishing between different types of wrath, the post concludes that “those individuals who are rebuked by God’s forsaking wrath are largely responsible for God’s consequential wrath on our nation”.

The forsaken include gays and lesbians, “given over” as they are by God to “degrading passions”, as well as environmentalists, since “clearly indicative of God’s forsaking wrath is when the abandoned serve the creature rather than the creator”.

Ian

Been waiting for it,along with those who'll not doubt believe those who get C19 won't have enough faith to have resisted it.
Evangelical Chistianity like any more extreme form of religion attracts weirdos who believe everything their particular sacred text tells them however crazy it may be.
-----------------------------------------------------------
I cycle therefore I am.

Mike Sales
Posts: 4404
Joined: 7 Mar 2009, 3:31pm

Re: Coronavirus (aka COVID-19) - just how serious?

Postby Mike Sales » 26 Mar 2020, 3:05pm

carpetcleaner wrote:
I think you'll find similar views are held in many parts of the world, not just the west, and much more widely too. I won't be more specific as that would be racist, phobic or some other such description.

This pastor is entitled to his opinions. [moderated]


The description that all these people have in common is that of "religious" or "believer". You could try using that to see whether anybody objects.

Psamathe
Posts: 11123
Joined: 10 Jan 2014, 8:56pm

Re: Coronavirus (aka COVID-19) - just how serious?

Postby Psamathe » 26 Mar 2020, 3:09pm

carpetcleaner wrote:
Psamathe wrote:Initially I thought "something lighthearted" except it isn't light hearted atall but for me just highlights what western/human society has become. I despair
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/coronavirus-trump-pastor-homophobic-ralph-drollinger-a9426801.html wrote:Coronavirus: Trump cabinet’s pastor blames gay people for ‘wrath of God’
...
A evangelical pastor who runs a Bible Study attended by several members of the Trump administration‘s cabinet has implied that homosexuality could be one of the causes of the coronavirus epidemic in the US.

In a blog post “Is God Judging America Today?”, Ralph Drollinger wrote that “America is experiencing the consequential wrath of God” — that is, the inevitable punishment for violating Biblical precepts on godly behaviour.

A detailed theological argument distinguishing between different types of wrath, the post concludes that “those individuals who are rebuked by God’s forsaking wrath are largely responsible for God’s consequential wrath on our nation”.

The forsaken include gays and lesbians, “given over” as they are by God to “degrading passions”, as well as environmentalists, since “clearly indicative of God’s forsaking wrath is when the abandoned serve the creature rather than the creator”.

Ian


I think you'll find similar views are held in many parts of the world, not just the west, and much more widely too. I won't be more specific as that would be racist, phobic or some other such description.

This pastor is entitled to his opinions. [moderated]

He is entitled to his opinions but his status (as a pastor, religious leader, etc.) feeds prejudice across sectors of the population. So without throwing people off buildings he is making people who have done nothing wrong suffer additional discrimination. He is effectively feeding and validating discriminators views and encouraging actions. We've seen similar in the UK, how it does not take much for some high profile individual to express blame on a sector and they are suddenly suffering violent attacks because they feel their views validated ... In the UK people have been murdered/man-slaughtered because of this (I don't know enough about the US but I'm certain they suffer similarly).

Ian

reohn2
Posts: 37771
Joined: 26 Jun 2009, 8:21pm

Re: Coronavirus (aka COVID-19) - just how serious?

Postby reohn2 » 26 Mar 2020, 3:09pm

Mike Sales wrote: ........What you must mean is that the believers fail to see the contradiction in their belief in a good God.

They blindly see it as a test of their faith and not as any wrong doing of the God they perceive to serve.

It was such lunacy that turned me away from a belief in any supreme being,and particularly one who favours one group over another.
-----------------------------------------------------------
I cycle therefore I am.

reohn2
Posts: 37771
Joined: 26 Jun 2009, 8:21pm

Re: Coronavirus (aka COVID-19) - just how serious?

Postby reohn2 » 26 Mar 2020, 3:13pm

Psamathe wrote:He is entitled to his opinions but his status (as a pastor, religious leader, etc.) feeds prejudice across sectors of the population. So without throwing people off buildings he is making people who have done nothing wrong suffer additional discrimination. He is effectively feeding and validating discriminators views and encouraging actions. We've seen similar in the UK, how it does not take much for some high profile individual to express blame on a sector and they are suddenly suffering violent attacks because they feel their views validated ... In the UK people have been murdered/man-slaughtered because of this (I don't know enough about the US but I'm certain they suffer similarly).

Ian

Spot on!
These morons(and I count Trump among them)hold a lot of power and weild it as much as any terrorist bomber!
-----------------------------------------------------------
I cycle therefore I am.

carpetcleaner
Posts: 387
Joined: 14 Nov 2019, 1:25pm

Re: Coronavirus (aka COVID-19) - just how serious?

Postby carpetcleaner » 26 Mar 2020, 3:21pm

Mike Sales wrote:
carpetcleaner wrote:
I think you'll find similar views are held in many parts of the world, not just the west, and much more widely too. I won't be more specific as that would be racist, phobic or some other such description.

This pastor is entitled to his opinions. [moderated]


The description that all these people have in common is that of "religious" or "believer". You could try using that to see whether anybody objects.


No thanks. I know the rules. When it comes to criticising religious people only certain targets are permissible.

I'm not particularly bothered about this pastor. He has his views and I don't mind him telling everyone else about them. Nobody is forced to agree with him and he doesn't appear to be making any threats.

I don't draw conclusions about what western society has become from the actions or words of a few people, just as I don't draw conclusions about societies in other parts of the world because of the words and actions of a few people. That would be stereotyping large groups of people because of how a minority speak or behave.

Mike Sales
Posts: 4404
Joined: 7 Mar 2009, 3:31pm

Re: Coronavirus (aka COVID-19) - just how serious?

Postby Mike Sales » 26 Mar 2020, 3:26pm

carpetcleaner wrote:

The description that all these people have in common is that of "religious" or "believer". You could try using that to see whether anybody objects.

No thanks. I know the rules. When it comes to criticising religious people only certain targets are permissible.



I was not suggesting that you need to be any more specific than my generalisation. It is what these believers in the wrath of a vengeful god have in common. I'm not sure why you feel the need to choose any particular religion.

May your god (or gods) go with you.

User avatar
Cugel
Posts: 3110
Joined: 13 Nov 2017, 11:14am

Re: Coronavirus (aka COVID-19) - just how serious?

Postby Cugel » 26 Mar 2020, 3:47pm

kwackers wrote:
Psamathe wrote:Initially I thought "something lighthearted" except it isn't light hearted atall but for me just highlights what western/human society has become. I despair
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/coronavirus-trump-pastor-homophobic-ralph-drollinger-a9426801.html wrote:Coronavirus: Trump cabinet’s pastor blames gay people for ‘wrath of God’
...
A evangelical pastor who runs a Bible Study attended by several members of the Trump administration‘s cabinet has implied that homosexuality could be one of the causes of the coronavirus epidemic in the US.

In a blog post “Is God Judging America Today?”, Ralph Drollinger wrote that “America is experiencing the consequential wrath of God” — that is, the inevitable punishment for violating Biblical precepts on godly behaviour.

A detailed theological argument distinguishing between different types of wrath, the post concludes that “those individuals who are rebuked by God’s forsaking wrath are largely responsible for God’s consequential wrath on our nation”.

The forsaken include gays and lesbians, “given over” as they are by God to “degrading passions”, as well as environmentalists, since “clearly indicative of God’s forsaking wrath is when the abandoned serve the creature rather than the creator”.

Ian

Nobody ever questions the evils of a 'Super-being' who wreaks vengeance on all for the "mistakes" of a few.

What a ***** he must be (if he were real).


Sounds like wor headmaster at skool, known not-so-fondly as "The Boss". He and his familiars (various teacher-martinets, especially the two RE martinets) loved an excuse to punish the whole school of about 1000 for some small transgression of the skool rools by but one miscreant they couldn't lay their cane on.

My favourite was when they made all of us take off our shoes in morning assembly and walk with socks-only back across the rain-soaked and mucky yard back to our classrooms, all clutching our shoes in one mit. This because some wag had let off a stink bomb up on the stage from whence The Boss and Co emitted their various commandments (many more than ten). But there were others ......

Anyroadup, it could well be that The Boss was in fact that Big Bearded B*!!*d in The Sky come down a second time to give us the alternative side of his Jekyll & Hyde to that of the Jesus nice-man. No forgiveness of sinners with The Boss! And we were all deemed sinners without chance of redemption.

Cugel, still good at singin' Victorian hymns very loudly, though.

pete75
Posts: 12807
Joined: 24 Jul 2007, 2:37pm

Re: Coronavirus (aka COVID-19) - just how serious?

Postby pete75 » 26 Mar 2020, 3:48pm

The utility cyclist wrote:
Vorpal wrote:Moderator note:

Ignoring government and medical advice, or recommendations to others to do so will be removed from this thread.

Folks are welcome to discuss the science, contributing factors, etc., but not wilful disregard of government guidelines.

Thanks for understanding.


So you're saying that anything which challenges or questions whether to obey the diktats of Boris Johnson will be removed?
Last edited by pete75 on 26 Mar 2020, 3:51pm, edited 1 time in total.

Marcus Aurelius
Posts: 1002
Joined: 1 Feb 2018, 10:20am

Re: Coronavirus (aka COVID-19) - just how serious?

Postby Marcus Aurelius » 26 Mar 2020, 3:50pm

Something else that struck me today, is the thing about ramping up the testing. BoJo thinks ( quite rightly) this is a fabulous idea, and wants it done ( good move ) certain folk are coming out with all sorts of weird and wonderful excuses for why it isn’t a good idea. If you increase the amount of testing, you ( pretty much ) guarantee to find a lot of people who have the virus, but never show symptoms, or very mild symptoms. Why would anyone be concerned about that? Hmmmmmm I wonder :roll: