Panic buying, hoarding

[thirdcrank]

I think a lot of what seems to be swing is really turnout.

[mjr]

Labour won't get in until they stop pretending that the vast majority of their potential voters are the slightest bit interested in wokey type stuff (as understood by the canteen conversationalists).

That cuts both ways: it also means the current Conservative obsession with knees and cancel culture and hagiographic statues of flawed figures is a massive own goal because the vast majority aren't interested, as long as whatever happens is seen as British "fair play". That combines with the long inaction about HGV driver market problems and the dithering about army intervention to make the Conservatives look out of touch, while Labour are now starting to talk about what matters to people.

The next election could be characterised as Bonkers Brexit-obsessed Boris versus Safe and Serious Starmer, if Labour get it right and Conservatives keep navel-gazing.

I wonder how crucial massive support internally within the party is - all parties need a lot of votes from non-party members to get elected.

It's crucial in two major ways: firstly, good party support suggests they will get their "base" into the polling booths, which is needed alongside floating voters; and secondly, party activists do a lot of leafleting, door-knocking and postering, both real and virtual, so they need to feel extra-enthused to do that voluntary work.

I'm not sure any UK party has ever got into government without massive internal support for its campaign.

Home delivery order today a complete waste of time. No tray meals, no skimmed milk, no porridge, etc. and much of what is coming is going to have to go back (as I don't like e.g. just carrots as a main meal so carrots go back, etc.!).

THERE IS NO SHORTAGE! They're just somewhere else...

; - (

We have all the right products... but not necessarily in the right places!

[thirdcrank]

Re HGV drivers, I can see that in a mixed economy the government has a big responsibility to regulate driver training, testing and licensing etc., but I don't see how the government can or should direct people into driving as a job.

[mjr]

Re HGV drivers, I can see that in a mixed economy the government has a big responsibility to regulate driver training, testing and licensing etc., but I don't see how the government can or should direct people into driving as a job.

Not direct so much as encourage. Government encourages people into various types of jobs, whether through broad measures like promoting STEM jobs or higher education, or narrow ones like listing certain jobs as shortage professions eligible for extra visa categories... and that's ignoring that government also hires loads of people itself, such as the army whose drivers it seems about to direct.

Or another path it could have taken is to promote technological changes that reduce the demand for drivers, which could include more rail freight (good) or longer lorries (bad IMO). Those are not quick fixes but this multi-reason crisis has been brewing for years and government was apparently well warned. The Conservatives took their eyes off the basics while they fought amongst themselves.

[Stevek76]

Labour won't get in until they stop pretending that the vast majority of their potential voters are the slightest bit interested in wokey type stuff (as understood by the canteen conversationalists).

I think this view is more a successful creation of conHQ comms (and their fairly extensive client press) than true and one that labour have been useless in dealing with.

Most grumbles about 'woke' are little more than dogwhistling bigotry so trying to pretend they're 'anti-woke' isn't an option, instead it really needs to be called out for what it is clearly and firmly every time it is brought up, a weak effort to distract from conservative failings in the day to day matters that actually register with most of the non-retired voters that labour need.

Instead we get awkward deflections and occasional attempts to try to 'out patriot' (in that shallow giant flags form of patriotism) the tories.

[Vorpal]

THERE IS NO SHORTAGE! They're just somewhere else...

; - (

Jonathan

I think that there might shortages of common sense & honesty.

[Jdsk]

THERE IS NO SHORTAGE! They're just somewhere else...

; - (

I think that there might shortages of common sense & honesty.

"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself--and you are the easiest person to fool. So you have to be very careful about that. After you've not fooled yourself, it's easy not to fool other scientists. You just have to be honest in a conventional way after that."

And not just in science...

Jonathan

PS: Does anyone know who said that... without looking it up?

[jb]

Labour won't get in until they stop pretending that the vast majority of their potential voters are the slightest bit interested in wokey type stuff (as understood by the canteen conversationalists).

I think this view is more a successful creation of conHQ comms (and their fairly extensive client press) than true and one that labour have been useless in dealing with.

Most grumbles about 'woke' are little more than dogwhistling bigotry so trying to pretend they're 'anti-woke' isn't an option, instead it really needs to be called out for what it is clearly and firmly every time it is brought up, a weak effort to distract from conservative failings in the day to day matters that actually register with most of the non-retired voters that labour need.

Instead we get awkward deflections and occasional attempts to try to 'out patriot' (in that shallow giant flags form of patriotism) the tories.

Whether conHQ plays on it or not it I think your average skilled/semiskilled worker thinks Labour is / has drifted away from representing him and is more concerned about looking correct on issues that have nowt to with putting bread on 't table.

[mjr]

Whether conHQ plays on it or not it I think your average skilled/semiskilled worker thinks Labour is / has drifted away from representing him and is more concerned about looking correct on issues that have nowt to with putting bread on 't table.

The current empty bread shelves have not occurred under a Labour government. I don't believe average workers are daft enough to think that the Opposition are to blame for the current failures of supply and market regulations. That buck stops with the Government.

[jb]

Whether conHQ plays on it or not it I think your average skilled/semiskilled worker thinks Labour is / has drifted away from representing him and is more concerned about looking correct on issues that have nowt to with putting bread on 't table.

The current empty bread shelves have not occurred under a Labour government. I don't believe average workers are daft enough to think that the Opposition are to blame for the current failures of supply and market regulations. That buck stops with the Government.

Well I agree.

[reohn2]

It's my guess thatnthe Tories can't afford to have Johnson as the leader intovthe next GE,it'll most likely be someone like Sunak,but I hope it's Gove

[Mick F]

Gove!

Minister for Education.
Absolute rubbish.
Speak to teachers. The education system was screwed by him.
Don't even mention his name in this house.

[merseymouth]

Afternoon all, I wonder if we would be having the same sort driver shortage and delivery panic if we still had a Nationalized Road Haulage Industry?
Some of us date back to that era, when British Road Service and Pickfords held the franchises, with other newbies struggling for a toe-hold.
Throw British Railways into the mix and you get a picture of the times when food didn't travel far from it's point of origin.
We rarely travelled further than 40 miles from home, the ferry ride over the Mersey to New Brighton was an exotic trip, see the wonderous tower, sticky rock and candy floss, who could ask for more?
With no fuel we could still cycle or walk through the Queensway tunnel, we were yet to reach "You've never had it so good " times!
We never worried about a fuel shortage as we didn't own a car. Happy days . TTFN MM

[thirdcrank]

I collected my granddaughter from school today and judging by the number of vehicles parked on double yellows and zig-zags with the engine running there's no fuel shortage around here

[Psamathe]

It's my guess thatnthe Tories can't afford to have Johnson as the leader intovthe next GE,it'll most likely be someone like Sunak,but I hope it's Gove :)

My vote is for Gavin "Superhero" Williamson (vote for leader, NOT vote at next GE). Just like as a republican I'm expecting Charles will lower the pubic regard for the Monarchy, so Gavin would ensure the Conservatives come 3rd to the Lib Dems.

I worry that there are too many voters who will see Johnson ruffle his hair and play the "lovable rogue" and overlook the horrendous mortality due to his inaction/delays/buffoonery.

Ian