C19 - Ending The Lockdown

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Bonefishblues
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Re: C19 - Ending The Lockdown

Postby Bonefishblues » 27 May 2020, 5:14pm

mjr wrote:
Bonefishblues wrote:
merseymouth wrote:Hi, Dominic Cummings has effectively terminated any worthwhile support forthcoming! Lock-down is now dead, why should we bother! MM

Interestingly, R4 reported that public adherence & support was still very strong (and stronger than MPs, it was noted)

At least the public gives a [self-censored before writing a rude word] :evil:

How are they measuring that? I estimate it's 90% of a pre-lockdown half-term's motor traffic out there on the A10 today and maybe 5% of what's missing could be explained by the increase in cycling - a big drop from the early days of lockdown, but still about double what it was before. The other 5% are probably still on furlough or teleworking, but I think few local industries lend themselves to teleworking and probably even fewer have bosses that would allow it any longer than they must, in this deeply conservative (small c) area.

Lockdown seems basically over except for the closures of fun things like pubs/cafes/cinemas, non-essential shops and other large gatherings. Thank you Dominic(!) Now we wait and see what the R value does... :(

I stood by the M40 yesterday evening. I think it's still a long way below previous numbers, based on no science at all, but I have no idea how that particular info regarding attitudes was polled.

mercalia
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The Blame Game

Postby mercalia » 14 Jun 2020, 10:44am

Here it starts?

The Lancet’s editor: ‘The UK response to coronavirus is the greatest science policy failure for a generation’

( psst you can buy his new book for £12.99)

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/jun/14/the-lancets-editor-the-uk-response-to-coronavirus-is-the-greatest-science-policy-failure-for-a-generation?

Ben@Forest
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Re: The Blame Game

Postby Ben@Forest » 14 Jun 2020, 7:43pm

mercalia wrote:Here it starts?

The Lancet’s editor: ‘The UK response to coronavirus is the greatest science policy failure for a generation’

( psst you can buy his new book for £12.99)

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/jun/14/the-lancets-editor-the-uk-response-to-coronavirus-is-the-greatest-science-policy-failure-for-a-generation?


Not sure I'd trust Horton or the Lancet. As is in the article he wasn't on the ball on the MMR scandal; the Lancet also published very dubious figures on casualties in Iraq, which were questioned by most other researchers investigating the same topic.

After the MMR scandal there was some independent assessment of the way the Lancet selected articles for publication and, just like any other news media, it was found they published on the basis of the best headline/controversy not necessarily the most pertinent, if boring, medical opinion.

roubaixtuesday
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Re: The Blame Game

Postby roubaixtuesday » 14 Jun 2020, 8:08pm

Ben@Forest wrote:
Not sure I'd trust Horton or the Lancet.


As things stand, virtually noone from the medical community seems prepared to defend the govt handling of the pandemic.

Oldjohnw
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Re: C19 - Ending The Lockdown

Postby Oldjohnw » 15 Jun 2020, 8:15am

I assume that going to non-essential shops today is not mandatory.

Or that spending for England is not proof of being a responsible citizen
John

kwackers
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Re: C19 - Ending The Lockdown

Postby kwackers » 15 Jun 2020, 10:50am

I think that most folk on both sides think that BoJo is a one trick pony elected to do a single job and is vastly out his depth now.

I thought this article pretty much summed it up.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/jun/14/even-tories-increasingly-fear-they-have-inflicted-the-worst-of-all-worlds-on-britain

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mjr
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Re: C19 - Ending The Lockdown

Postby mjr » 15 Jun 2020, 1:52pm

Strangely quieter on the A10 than most weekdays recently. I guess a chunk of the motorists are stuck in queues outside the newly-reopened non-essential shops?

You might like to share this image (from WHO via Forbes and Carlton Reid) with your local networks:
Image

Has anyone seen other good cycling promotion images?
MJR, mostly pedalling 3-speed roadsters. KL+West Norfolk BUG incl social easy rides http://www.klwnbug.co.uk
All the above is CC-By-SA and no other implied copyright license to Cycle magazine.

Ben@Forest
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Re: The Blame Game

Postby Ben@Forest » 15 Jun 2020, 6:58pm

roubaixtuesday wrote:
Ben@Forest wrote:
Not sure I'd trust Horton or the Lancet.


As things stand, virtually noone from the medical community seems prepared to defend the govt handling of the pandemic.


Possibly true - though there are going to be scientists who will have to defend whatever advice they did or didn't give to the government for the rest of their careers.

Horton's longevity as editor of the Lancet is however amazing. The MMR article was published in 1998, was not partially retracted until 2004 and not fully retracted until 2010. It led to an increase in cases of mumps and measles in the UK and probably worldwide. In the same period if you compare it to how Piers Morgan was sacked from the Mirror or how Rebekah Brooks had to resign from News International (neither of whom themselves had done anything illegal) it is astonishing that someone who oversaw publication of information that has definitely caused physical harm still has his job.

roubaixtuesday
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Re: The Blame Game

Postby roubaixtuesday » 15 Jun 2020, 9:03pm

Ben@Forest wrote:
roubaixtuesday wrote:
Ben@Forest wrote:
Not sure I'd trust Horton or the Lancet.


As things stand, virtually noone from the medical community seems prepared to defend the govt handling of the pandemic.


Possibly true - though there are going to be scientists who will have to defend whatever advice they did or didn't give to the government for the rest of their careers.

Horton's longevity as editor of the Lancet is however amazing. The MMR article was published in 1998, was not partially retracted until 2004 and not fully retracted until 2010. It led to an increase in cases of mumps and measles in the UK and probably worldwide. In the same period if you compare it to how Piers Morgan was sacked from the Mirror or how Rebekah Brooks had to resign from News International (neither of whom themselves had done anything illegal) it is astonishing that someone who oversaw publication of information that has definitely caused physical harm still has his job.


I don't know enough to comment really - I have a vague recollection Wakefield falsified data which isn't necessarily something a journal can be blamed for, but equally I agree it's amazing there were no repercussions whatever.

It's certainly not, however, a reason to automatically dismiss anything in the journal.

Oldjohnw
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Re: C19 - Ending The Lockdown

Postby Oldjohnw » 18 Jun 2020, 12:36am

Apparently the game changing world leading contact tracing app won't be ready until the end of the year. Mr Hancock says it's not a priority anyway.
Last edited by Oldjohnw on 24 Jun 2020, 1:25pm, edited 1 time in total.
John

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mjr
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Re: C19 - Ending The Lockdown

Postby mjr » 18 Jun 2020, 9:24am

Oldjohnw wrote:Apparently the game changing world leading contact tracing app won't be ready until the end of the year. Mr Hancock days it's not a priority anyway.

Well, Mr Hancock thinks standing next to people and stroking them is a priority: https://twitter.com/BorisJohnson_MP/sta ... 5433948160
MJR, mostly pedalling 3-speed roadsters. KL+West Norfolk BUG incl social easy rides http://www.klwnbug.co.uk
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rjb
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2 metre rule

Postby rjb » 22 Jun 2020, 5:28pm

If you want to blow your own trumpet you need to maintain 5 metres social distancing. https://www.wired.com/story/the-science ... -comeback/ :(

Heres an extract

"LAST MONTH, MEMBERS of the Berlin Philharmonic returned home to their concert hall after weeks of isolation. They sat onstage in a loose constellation, dispersed according to local virus regulations. Only 15 players could be onstage at a time. The strings sat two meters apart. The woodwinds and brass sat five meters apart—on account of them blowing great quantities of air during a global respiratory virus pandemic, without the benefit of masks. They played music by Ligeti, Pärt, and Barber. And at the end of the performance, they bowed, smiling vaguely into an empty, silent hall. A classical music critic for The New York Times, watching the performance live from his apartment, described it as “awkward” but “also inspiring.”
At the last count:- Peugeot 531 pro, Dawes Discovery Tandem, Dawes Kingpin, Raleigh 20, Falcon K2 MTB dropped bar tourer, Longstaff trike conversion on a Falcon corsa. :D

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The utility cyclist
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Re: 2 metre rule

Postby The utility cyclist » 22 Jun 2020, 8:50pm

Again many German scientists/experts within the German government state that the threat is massively less than first thought/imagined
2 metres, in fact any social distancing other than if you were going to visit a frail/vulnerable person and you were actually showing symptoms is ludicrous and always was.
Locking down has killed tens of thousands more in the UK and hundreds of thousands more yet is still far short of the deaths from influenza
http://ronpaulinstitute.org/archives/fe ... tvFChhSauY

99.9%certain
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Re: C19 - Ending The Lockdown

Postby 99.9%certain » 23 Jun 2020, 2:18pm

Now it's 1m.
THE most sensible thing the Govt has done throughout this whole fiasco!

I never thought i'd see the day when i actually agree with something the Tories say!!!!!

Oldjohnw
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Re: C19 - Ending The Lockdown

Postby Oldjohnw » 23 Jun 2020, 2:57pm

So now it's I metre . Except where it's 2 metres. And people can stay in other people's houses so long as you social distance. Should be easy in my fisherman's cottage.
John