More better grammer and speeling please.

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mikeymo
Posts: 2299
Joined: 27 Sep 2016, 6:23pm

More better grammer and speeling please.

Post by mikeymo »

A list in no particular order.

"Eke out" not "eek out". A word which seems to have changed meaning, but is still spelt the same.

"infer" vs "imply". No, they don't mean the same thing. At all, in any way. In fact they are like the opposite of each other, sort of.

"should/could/would of" - nope, that should have been "have". Its not a change of meaning or language being "fluid". Its just wrong.

"data is" well actually it should be "data are". But that horse has probably bolted. So now "data" just means - "some stuff we know". Better to use "numbers" or "facts".

"fora" - oh, just give it a rest with that one. Erudite <> making up latin plurals. And you can have referendums too, we aren't living in Rome, 100 B.C.

"their/they're/there" - we all know this. Don't we? As it happens I sometimes get it wrong. Though I tell myself that's because I'm such a fast typist that I type as words sound. Maybe that excuses shoulda/woulda/coulda above.

"literally" - nope, I will defend this to the death. Because there isn't another word that means the same, unless you count "really" repeated many times. You're only "literally dead on my feet" if you're in the trenches, you've been killed by sniper fire but haven't fallen over.

"myself/yourself" - the new version of Hyacinth Buckets "'scuse I"? It's not more politer to use words incorrectly.

"I" is not "me" - see above. "George and Barbara Bush often stayed with Dennis and I at Chequers". Mrs T wasn't stupid, lazy or uneducated. And I was ready to vote for her until she got the pronoun wrong.

"affect/effect" - actually affect can be a noun and effect can be a verb. But it's best to know when.

Also, ironic edits made in light of:

https://edition.cnn.com/2019/12/03/us/apostrophe-protection-society-disbanded-trnd/index.html

Of course, stuff which is dialect or regional accent is acceptable:

The apocryphal northern misinterpretation of the level crossing instruction - "Do not cross while red lights are flashing". For those of you not familiar with the usage, up here some people use "while" to mean "until". You can see the problem now.

"Go and spear at Jock the time" - go and ask Jock what time it is.

"Where do you stay?" - which seems to mean "where do you live?" for some Scots.

And Barnsley-esque "thee, thou, thine", often contracted - "tha nos", is a lovely regional variation. Or maybe they read a lot of Shakespeare in Barnsley.

Here in Leeds men sometimes used to call each other "luv". It seems to have pretty much died out, but only about 8 years ago we had a couple of painters round and when I got them a cup of tea the older one said - "thanks luv".
Jdsk
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Re: More better grammer and speeling please.

Post by Jdsk »

If anyone is looking for a modern style guide I strongly recommend Pinker:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Sense_of_Style

Jonathan

PS: Is Skitt's Law in play for this thread? With penalties? : - )
mikeymo
Posts: 2299
Joined: 27 Sep 2016, 6:23pm

Re: More better grammer and speeling please.

Post by mikeymo »

Jdsk wrote:PS: Is Skitt's Law in play for this thread? With penalties? : - )


Not a bean - "ironic edits".

Built in get-out, you see?

I can do some more if you like, but then it get's a bit ham-fisted.
Last edited by mikeymo on 15 Feb 2021, 12:40pm, edited 2 times in total.
tatanab
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Joined: 8 Feb 2007, 12:37pm

Re: More better grammer and speeling please.

Post by tatanab »

mikeymo wrote:"should/could/would of" - nope, that should have been "have". Its not a change of meaning or language being "fluid". Its just wrong.

That one really frustrates me. it is the result of poor enunciation where 've should be pronounced something like uv, certainly not of. I can understand people speaking this way, but writing it is beyond the pale.

These days I have to accept many wrong words being used as a result of auto correct or auto word completion, whatever it is called. I frequently see where instead of were. I proof read my posts, but of course we see what we fought we writ not what is actually there.
mikeymo
Posts: 2299
Joined: 27 Sep 2016, 6:23pm

Re: More better grammer and speeling please.

Post by mikeymo »

tatanab wrote:
mikeymo wrote:"should/could/would of" - nope, that should have been "have". Its not a change of meaning or language being "fluid". Its just wrong.

That one really frustrates me. it is the result of poor enunciation where 've should be pronounced something like uv, certainly not of. I can understand people speaking this way, but writing it is beyond the pale.

These days I have to accept many wrong words being used as a result of auto correct or auto word completion, whatever it is called. I frequently see where instead of were. I proof read my posts, but of course we see what we fought we writ not what is actually there.


You have reminded me of another:

"accept" vs "except".

Though I must admit, I haven't a clue about colons and semi-colons. So that above might be wrong.
Psamathe
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Re: More better grammer and speeling please.

Post by Psamathe »

(I'm useless at spelling & grammar but a few examples)

I'm always uncertain as to using enquiry vs inquiry
Apostrophe rules are "confusing"

Style use when talking to somebody, if they wave two fingers in the air to indicate something they say "in quotations" to me it's like nails on a chalk board. But when I write stuff I recognise I massively overuse quotation marks.

etc. (and there are probably many)

Ian
Bonefishblues
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Re: More better grammer and speeling please.

Post by Bonefishblues »

I no longer stress about it tbh :)
mikeymo
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Joined: 27 Sep 2016, 6:23pm

Re: More better grammer and speeling please.

Post by mikeymo »

Psamathe wrote:(I'm useless at spelling & grammar but a few examples)

I'm always uncertain as to using enquiry vs inquiry


Yes, me too. Thanks.

Let's have a look:

https://www.grammar-monster.com/easily_confused/enquiry_inquiry.htm
mikeymo
Posts: 2299
Joined: 27 Sep 2016, 6:23pm

Re: More better grammer and speeling please.

Post by mikeymo »

Psamathe wrote:
Apostrophe rules are "confusing"



A bit. I think partly because the apostrophe can do two things - indicate possession and stand in the place of a letter. Which gives rise to the exception of its.

And plural possessives. The girl's instrument. The girls' instruments. The girls' playing fields' surfaces won't stand hockey. Depending how many playing fields there are.

Oh, and sentences without a main verb. That's terrible ;-)
Last edited by mikeymo on 15 Feb 2021, 1:20pm, edited 1 time in total.
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simonineaston
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Re: More better grammer and speeling please.

Post by simonineaston »

role / roll, bear / bare, innit... one word that I do not like is hence EDIT actually it's not the word I dislike - after-all what's to dislike about a bundle of letters - it's the circumstnaces in which it gets used. I think that it only ever gets in a work context. I don't think I ever use it when I'm not working!
S
(on the look out for Armageddon, on board a Brompton nano & ever-changing Moultons)
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simonineaston
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Re: More better grammer and speeling please.

Post by simonineaston »

I have wrote a lot about apostrophes. It's quite popular to cock a snook at folk who misuse them, but although the basics are quite straightforward, it's not long before it all gets a bit more complicated... them's as can't quite get their 'ed around it all have my sympathy.
S
(on the look out for Armageddon, on board a Brompton nano & ever-changing Moultons)
Tangled Metal
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Re: More better grammer and speeling please.

Post by Tangled Metal »

At which point in the development and growth of written English would you consider to be correct? Arrogance! Without the influence of spoken colloquial English on written English we'd probably be discussing different grammatical and punctuation matters. Indeed we'd probably still few speaking and writing old English language, possibly. Would that even exist as it was a mishmash of different languages.

I'm sorry but the conveyance of ideas far outweigh the etiquette of "good" grammar. Obviously these OP won't agree with that.

An example of ridiculous grammatical matters. My primary school age child is learning grammatical concepts both my partner and I were never taught at school. Indeed my partner taught English to adults and they never got taught it neither. Some of the grammar our child is learning she even has to jog her memory about. Yet we are both understood both with spoken and written English.

Before you go on about quality of education I went to an independent grammar school :lol:

Actually it was top 5 ranked in independent school table when I joined regionally one of the best.40% oxbridge nearly 100%university level education, mostly Russell group entries too. Our English teacher was more interested in ideas than obeyance of the rules of grammar fixed some time in the past. An inspiring teacher, awoke many a kid's awareness of the world, politics, etc.
Psamathe
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Joined: 10 Jan 2014, 8:56pm

Re: More better grammer and speeling please.

Post by Psamathe »

Maybe it's my age but another thing I find difficult ITCASSOU. I'm forever having to HAUGTFOWTM.

Ian
mikeymo
Posts: 2299
Joined: 27 Sep 2016, 6:23pm

Re: More better grammer and speeling please.

Post by mikeymo »

simonineaston wrote:I have wrote a lot about apostrophes. It's quite popular to cock a snook at folk who misuse them, but although the basics are quite straightforward, it's not long before it all gets a bit more complicated... them's as can't quite get their 'ed around it all have my sympathy.


Yes, I've seen some badly wrong "corrections" of apostrophe misuse.

And I agree, it's sometimes too easy to mock people who get things "wrong".
mikeymo
Posts: 2299
Joined: 27 Sep 2016, 6:23pm

Re: More better grammer and speeling please.

Post by mikeymo »

Tangled Metal wrote:At which point in the development and growth of written English would you consider to be correct? Arrogance! Without the influence of spoken colloquial English on written English we'd probably be discussing different grammatical and punctuation matters. Indeed we'd probably still few speaking and writing old English language, possibly. Would that even exist as it was a mishmash of different languages.

I'm sorry but the conveyance of ideas far outweigh the etiquette of "good" grammar. Obviously these OP won't agree with that.

An example of ridiculous grammatical matters. My primary school age child is learning grammatical concepts both my partner and I were never taught at school. Indeed my partner taught English to adults and they never got taught it neither. Some of the grammar our child is learning she even has to jog her memory about. Yet we are both understood both with spoken and written English.

Before you go on about quality of education I went to an independent grammar school :lol:

Actually it was top 5 ranked in independent school table when I joined regionally one of the best.40% oxbridge nearly 100%university level education, mostly Russell group entries too. Our English teacher was more interested in ideas than obeyance of the rules of grammar fixed some time in the past. An inspiring teacher, awoke many a kid's awareness of the world, politics, etc.


It's good that you went to such a good school, you're obviously very proud of it.
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