I don't like living in England....

[al_yrpal]

Here we go again. Its ok for the French to blockade Jersey with 80 boats, intimidate our fishermen and stop ferries carrying vital supplies at the same time threatening to cut off electricity supplies. Great negotiating tactics! Glad people like you lot werent in the majority in 1940!
Our vessels obviously werent there to intimidate the mob, they were there to ensure there werent any incidents, which there werent and express concern. The Channel patrols all have weapons.

Al

[Jdsk]

Here we go again. Its ok for the French to blockade Jersey with 80 boats, intimidate our fishermen and stop ferries carrying vital supplies at the same time threatening to cut off electricity supplies.

Which post above do you see as saying that any of those are "ok", please?

Because if there aren't any this would be another straw man argument.

Jonathan

[Oldjohnw]

Here we go again. Its ok for the French to blockade Jersey with 80 boats, intimidate our fishermen and stop ferries carrying vital supplies at the same time threatening to cut off electricity supplies. Great negotiating tactics! Glad people like you lot werent in the majority in 1940!
Our vessels obviously werent there to intimidate the mob, they were there to ensure there werent any incidents, which there werent and express concern. The Channel patrols all have weapons.

Al

I've read and re-read these posts but cannot see where anyone has even slightly hinted at it being ok for the French to blockade Jersey or threaten to cut off electricity. Can you help?

[Jdsk]

Perhaps there's a clue in the prominence being given to this in some newspapers: a bit of sabre rattling or the naval equivalent is believed to do wonders at the polls.

I think it very unlikely that the Bailiwick's provocation was deliberate and politically motivated. But much easier to believe that it would then be exploited.

But here's an article suggesting just that:
https://www.thelocal.fr/20210505/analys ... over-fish/

Jonathan

PS: Of course it's much better that these matters are resolved by jaw-jaw. The UK's acceptance of the EU Ambassador should be welcomed.
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/fore ... sion-5-may

[Tangled Metal]

A lot countries have other agencies to deal with monitoring commercial fishing activities but in the UK that's been reduced to nonexistent with the duties falling to the Royal navy. If that's the way our governments want to manage fisheries in its remit (and that's been the case for a seriously long time) then don't be surprised when you get the potentially negative optics of royal navy patrol vessels being sent.

However I would point out that these are not big warships and indeed large fishing vessels are probably of comparable size. Although they are bigger than the small family owned/operated vessels the French fishermen have.

BTW as bad as it seems the French are sending their warship and have threatened cutting 95% of power to Jersey. Can you tell me if that's any better? Iirc the UK action was in response to this and French fishermen threatening to stop anything getting into Jersey by sea. At the moment it appears that one freighter initially got delayed and the Guernsey ferry hasn't been able to get out. I wonder if the action of sending navy monitors has put the fisherman back a bit so things didn't escalate the way some sectors of French economy tend to do.

One more point anyone know if the so called restrictions in these new licences are really an imposition on the fishermen? Aiui they seem to be about restricted fishing types and fishery management. Were they that much more restrictive than when uk was in the eu? Mind you, the EU fishery policy wasn't exactly great in the first place.

I only ask because there's precious little info on what fishing was carried out pre brexit compared to what is allowed post Brexit. I have a sneaking suspicion that now under the licencing scheme and then under EU rules isn't going to be too far apart. That it's really only about the paperwork and red tape. Another sneaking suspicion is that the French politicians are worse than UK ones for playing to their worst levels of society. That this is a pointless and unnecessary spat generated by the parisian political elite for political gains. That boris has jumped on the bandwagon for his own political gain. Make the most of the dodgy but pathetic situation for the tory party benefit.

Whatever the case this isn't about fishing rights but about politics now. Its pathetic all round. If the eu was as good as made out at times this wouldn't happen. Afterall the communication apparently went through Paris to commission to London then to Jersey and back again. Something to do with the agreement that Jersey and fishermen can't deal direct.

[Jdsk]

One more point anyone know if the so called restrictions in these new licences are really an imposition on the fishermen?

They are new restrictions and it does seem that they came as a surprise.

As above I'll take some convincing that this part of the sequence was deliberately provocative or politically motivated.

Jonathan

[Maillot Rouge]

I’m getting the impression that one particular poster is very anti-EU and anti-French in particular.Thankfully that’s the opposite of my everyday experiences.

[Oldjohnw]

I am happy to say that the two British vessels sent to Jersey are now described as “patrol vessels” and not gunboats as described in all news outlets, some with considerable glee. Hopefully, some calm will prevail and that both the French and the Jersey authorities will get agreement.

They do, of course, carry weapons

[Tangled Metal]

It's not about explicitly or implicitly saying that either side is right or wrong it is about the perception of bias through the frequency of comments about one side carrying out negative or outright wrong actions or comments.

Whether right or wrong there is a basis for the perception that some on here exhibit anti British bias due to this higher frequency of negative posts about British, Britain or England in threads discussing other nations or topics.

Personally I have no idea if anyone has conscious or subconscious bias against their country. Sometimes I do think the threads start to labour the British/ Britain bad pov. I do not see Britain being better or worse than most of Europe USA, Canada and Australia. I think Scandinavia is the only part of Europe that seems noticeable better than UK (better than France, Germany, Spain, Netherlands and Belgium too). That's my pov. I do have bias because I like both Norway and Sweden more than the UK. Must be my Swedish ancestry coming out. I think gothenburg is the only city I could actually be happy living in. But I digress.

Since moving to a smaller settlement I must admit I've become happier about living in Britain. People aren't made to live in large conurbations. The UK has most of its population in a relatively small area. I think this probably makes living here less enjoyable than other countries.

[Tangled Metal]

I am happy to say that the two British vessels sent to Jersey are now described as “patrol vessels” and not gunboats as described in all news outlets, some with considerable glee. Hopefully, some calm will prevail and that both the French and the Jersey authorities will get agreement.

About time too. One was about to be decommissioned. And the other was built as a patrol vessel to look after UK waters after Brexit. They're basically what Americans have in their coastguard branch of the armed services. If the press has said UK government sent two coastguard vessels it wouldn't have sounded bad at all.

As an aside, when RN vessels were being described as warships the media were describing the French warships as patrol vessels. Bias in early media reports were clear. It is about time they rowed back on the provocative phrasing in their reports.

[Oldjohnw]

It's not about explicitly or implicitly saying that either side is right or wrong it is about the perception of bias through the frequency of comments about one side carrying out negative or outright wrong actions or comments.

Whether right or wrong there is a basis for the perception that some on here exhibit anti British bias due to this higher frequency of negative posts about British, Britain or England in threads discussing other nations or topics.

Personally I have no idea if anyone has conscious or subconscious bias against their country. Sometimes I do think the threads start to labour the British/ Britain bad pov. I do not see Britain being better or worse than most of Europe USA, Canada and Australia. I think Scandinavia is the only part of Europe that seems noticeable better than UK (better than France, Germany, Spain, Netherlands and Belgium too). That's my pov. I do have bias because I like both Norway and Sweden more than the UK. Must be my Swedish ancestry coming out. I think gothenburg is the only city I could actually be happy living in. But I digress.

Since moving to a smaller settlement I must admit I've become happier about living in Britain. People aren't made to live in large conurbations. The UK has most of its population in a relatively small area. I think this probably makes living here less enjoyable than other countries.

I am not anti British or anti English. At all. I am anti this government and almost all it does. I am very biased.

[al_yrpal]

Whether right or wrong there is a basis for the perception that some on here exhibit anti British bias due to this higher frequency of negative posts about British, Britain or England in threads discussing other nations or topics.

Since moving to a smaller settlement I must admit I've become happier about living in Britain. People aren't made to live in large conurbations. The UK has most of its population in a relatively small area. I think this probably makes living here less enjoyable than other countries.

Spot on, and having lived in many places in England and Wales there is a massive variation. Living only 40 miles from the centre of London for 44 years where the Labour party regularly lost its deposit it was peaceful, with the kindest community spirited people, nice local towns and marvellous countryside.

Al

[Ride-sleep-repeat]

Spot on, and having lived in many places in England and Wales there is a massive variation. Living only 40 miles from the centre of London for 44 years where the Labour party regularly lost its deposit it was peaceful, with the kindest community spirited people, nice local towns and marvellous countryside.
Al

Would you care to elaborate on the part of your quoted text I've highlighted?
Are you inferring that 'it was peaceful, with the kindest community spirited people, nice local towns and marvellous countryside'. because it was not a Labour voting area?I can see no other reason why you would insert that little nugget of information other than to have one of your customary digs at the 'Trots'!

[Mike Sales]

It is because I love this country that I expect it to be excellent.
I do not want to live anywhere else, but I am ready to criticise its failings in order to make it better.
It is because some people saw faults in the country that it was improved.
It is worth looking abroad to find out whether other countries do some things better.
For instance, I think we could improve road conditions for cyclists by taking a look at the Netherlands.

[al_yrpal]

Not having a dig at anyone, just trying to dispel a myth. It was in the Henley constituency. Some folk here seem to think that all Torys are uncaring and mean spirited but the people who did all the good charitable works locally were the Torys. A lot of the charitable work was to enrich the lives of the old and least well off, pensioners with a lot of clients from the council estate. Free transport to the local towns and large supermarkets carrying their shopping door to door, hospital visits, pub lunches, garden centre, National Trust properties, seaside, West End Lights, Christmas markets and every month a free afternoon tea in the village hall. The edge of the Chilterns is wonderful countryside and woodland with seas of bluebells at this time of year. You have the Thames to enjoy. 4500 footpaths in the Chilterns and 100s of natural bridleways in unspoit forests. I was sad to leave but had little choice.

Al