The Italian Job

[merseymouth]

Hi folk, Pre-WW2 Rileys had various types of gear-boxes, never pulled them apart so slightly vague? Some models had straight cut boxes, sporty ones for better power transfer. Then they ah the wonderfully named "Silent 3rd Box", it really was quieter in that gear" Then a couple of Pre-Selector Variants, a Wilson model and a Armstrong-Siddeley model.
None had synchro 1st's. Back then folk took pride in actually learning to drive through the gear-box properly, even on down changes? These days folk are taught to avoid engine braking, but to use the brakes to reduce their road speed, hence far too many drivers do poor overtakes due to being in the inappropriate gear!
At least cyclists who use derailleur gears find proper use of anticipated gear changing to be a vital skill. TTFN MM

[Mick F]

This was our Talbot Samba.

[Jdsk]

These days folk are taught to avoid engine braking, but to use the brakes to reduce their road speed, hence far too many drivers do poor overtakes due to being in the inappropriate gear!

What's the connection, please?

Engine braking is discouraged because braking with all road wheels makes it less likely that traction will be broken, and because modern brakes don't need to be protected from overheating and fading.

Jonathan

[al_yrpal]

Never named a vehicle until I got this one...Rusty!

Rusty all polished up

Its a Devon Moonraker camper in an original 1980 colour scheme. Air Cooled 2 litre petrol engine. Independent suspension. The biggest interior of any VW Camper before or since. Side lifting roof with a double bed, rock and roll bed downstairs. Stove, cool box per original, porta potty, table and we have a couple of awnings.
Obvious why he's called Rusty, not just the colour.
Despite the almost constant drip of cash I have grown quite fond of his simplicity. Fits in a standard car park space, 25mpg since new carb.

Al

[merseymouth]

The connection? Being in the wrong gear is poor roadcraft!
Unless one is driving an automatic, where kick-down applies, being in too high a gear does make for a dangerous overtake, especially if the vehicle being overtaken is a pedal cycle.
Just think of how many times a driver struggles to get into the power band if they haven't changed down the box, far to often for my liking.
Being in the unsafe zone for the shortest time is the optimum position. You know that makes sense. MM

[Jdsk]

That's about changing down to overtake,

What's the connection to braking with the engine being preferable to braking with the brakes, please?

Thanks

Jonathan

[Syd]

On another note has anybody tried to push start a modern car (with a low battery) it is almost impossible for one person - too heavy.

And there's a lot of electronics that needs to be up and running even if you could spin the engine fast enough.

If anyone is concerned about this I recommend considering a lithium battery portable jump starter thing. (And I still find it very funny that the same device can be used to power a 'phone and start a car.)

Jonathan

When the 12V battery went flat I was able to start my Honda Insight with 8 AA batteries.

It needed to wake the electronics which allowed the car to start from the ~200V battery for the hybrid system.

[[XAP]Bob]

1st gear .........
Only required from stationary, even now.

Even then, if you're facing downhill, why start in 1st?
Use the highest gear possible.

Because the torque from a specific rpm in first might be more appropriate than a lower rpm in a higher gear.
If you are crawling uphill then first can be the appropriate gear - so you arrive behind a fully laden touring cyclist going up a hill with traffic coming in the other direction.

I know the fashionable approach is to sound the horn and run them over... but realistically dropping to first gear might be appropriate.

[Mick F]

Select the correct gear appropriate to the speed.

Brake to slow down, then select the correct gear.
Pull away, and change to the highest gear.
Therefore 1st gear is only for pulling away from stopped, but only when on the level or uphill.

Driving a hybrid these days ............
No gears to chose. Just Go pedal and Brake pedal.
Gear shift is P R D .......... and also B.

The selections are obvious, and driving gently the car is in EV when the battery is happy. The engine kicks in as and when required depending on battery charge and speed demand. You, as a driver, have no control of the engine. It kicks in when IT needs to.

B?
What's that for? I hear you all ask.
B is for engine braking.
Come down a steep hill, select B, and the engine kicks in on over-run to hold the car back.

Brakes, generally as a friction device are rarely needed. Pressing the brake pedal turns the EV motors into generators and that retards the speed amazingly well. Brake pads and discs last YEARS.

Drive a "normal" car after a hybrid, it will open your eyes.
I'm a member of the Institute of Advanced Motoring, and I understand all this to start with.

[Jdsk]

Is that intended as a continuation of the discussion of whether it's sometimes useful to be able to change down on a manual gearbox that doesn't have synchromesh? The technology of that hybrid with automated transmission and regenerative brakes is fascinating... but it's completely different.

Because the torque from a specific rpm in first might be more appropriate than a lower rpm in a higher gear.

Exactly.

Jonathan

[Jdsk]

On another note has anybody tried to push start a modern car (with a low battery) it is almost impossible for one person - too heavy.

And there's a lot of electronics that needs to be up and running even if you could spin the engine fast enough.

If anyone is concerned about this I recommend considering a lithium battery portable jump starter thing. (And I still find it very funny that the same device can be used to power a 'phone and start a car.)

When the 12V battery went flat I was able to start my Honda Insight with 8 AA batteries.

It needed to wake the electronics which allowed the car to start from the ~200V battery for the hybrid system.

And I bet you were smiling as it worked. : - )

Jonathan

[Mick F]

I wrote a book some years ago, and published it DIY all about the cars I have known.
It was called, Cars I have Known ...................

Gave all the copies to people and kept a PDF of it all.
I can screenshot pages if you want, but here's Page 8 as a sample.

[Mick F]

Is that intended as a continuation of the discussion of whether it's sometimes useful to be able to change down on a manual gearbox that doesn't have synchromesh? The technology of that hybrid with automated transmission and regenerative brakes is fascinating... but it's completely different.

Brake, select the correct gear, then drive.
Engine braking is good for downhills.

There's no difference with a hybrid as it does it all for you.

[richardfm]

Select the correct gear appropriate to the speed.

Brake to slow down, then select the correct gear.

Which could be first, if you have slowed to walking pace behind a heavily laden touring cyclist going uphill with no where for you to overtake and you are towing a caravan.

[richardfm]

I wrote a book some years ago, and published it DIY all about the cars I have known.
It was called, Cars I have Known ...................

Gave all the copies to people and kept a PDF of it all.
I can screenshot pages if you want, but here's Page 8 as a sample.Screen Shot 2021-07-14 at 18.40.50.png

No thanks, the list of your cars earlier in the thread was more than I need to know about the cars you have known